MAGA is going gaga over tax hikes.
The amount of bragging over tax hikes on X is quite stunning. And it continued yesterday on news of a deal with the EU that was no deal at all.
Trump likes to say “We will charge them tariffs” but them is us. The lead chart shows collected import duties, paid by US importers, not them.
The importers have a choice. They can eat the tariffs or pass them on with price hikes paid by consumers.
From January through April, importers tried to hold the line on price hikes. That is ending now.
The sad thing is these tariffs disproportionately impact small businesses and lower-quintile consumers the most.
Trump’s $750 Billion EU Energy Deal
MAGA also braggs about an energy deal with the EU that is nothing but lies by both sides.
Please consider Trump’s $750 Billion EU Energy Deal Collides With Market Reality
The European Union has promised President Trump a $750 billion shopping spree on American energy. Making good on that pledge will be a tall order.
“It’s a nice number but it’s just not realistic,” said Warren Patterson, head of commodities strategy at ING Bank. “You’d essentially have to divert all energy trade. That’s just not possible.”
European officials said Monday that the plan to increase energy purchases isn’t legally binding and is based on amounts the bloc believes it can accommodate. Purchases would also depend in part on U.S. infrastructure capacities, they said.
“Even if the EU were to buy the entirety of U.S. crude and LNG exports, the annual value of its purchases would total only $141 billion,” according to Gavekal Economics. It based its figures on current prices and the U.S.’s estimated year-end LNG export capacity.
There are also questions about whether the U.S. could deliver enough energy to hit the target. American LNG terminals, where natural gas is supercooled and loaded onto tankers, are already operating at near-full capacity. While companies are expanding facilities in Louisiana and Texas, this process will take several years.
On the European side, U.S. energy would encounter significant infrastructure bottlenecks. Europe’s re-gasification and pipeline networks, which receive and process LNG, are stretched to their limits, and expansion would require huge investment. The region’s refineries would also likely struggle to process extra volumes of light U.S. crude to produce diesel.
Energy Obstacles
- The US does not produce enough LNG to handle what the EU agreed to
- The EU does not have the infrastructure to handles the commitment
- EU private companies have existing long-term contracts, some still with Russia
- Ursula von der Leyden who negotiated the deal does not have signing authority.
Suckering Trump
- Ursula von der Leyden told Trump what he wanted to hear.
- A bunch of economic fools believe it will happen.
- This was a great effort by Leyden to buy time without agreeing to anything.
Trump Announces a 15 Percent Tariff Deal With the EU But There Is No Deal
Yesterday, I commented Trump Announces a 15 Percent Tariff Deal With the EU But There Is No Deal
Two Problems: Trump is exaggerating the deal. And Ursula has no signing authority.
The administration has released no documentation for deals it claims to have reached with the Philippines or Japan, and details released of the Indonesia deal last week remain incomplete. The U.K.’s framework, released in May, also left some big items unresolved, like steel tariff levels.
Is This a Good Deal?
On average no. It is idiotic to impose a 15 percent tax on US business on US consumers and businesses and call it good.
But there will be winners and losers. In general US exporters gain. US importers and consumers lose.
This is all premature because no one agrees on the details.
Is This Deal Better Than Expected?
Perhaps.
Given that Trump threatened much worse, he could have done far more damage than putting a 15 percent tax on US consumers and businesses.
Tax Cut, Tax Hike
To the extent the EU will lower tariffs on the US, that is a tax cut for the EU.
The lead chart shows Trump’s tax hikes.
The economic illiterates brag about tax hikes. Go figure.
Fundamental Flaws in Trump’s Thinking
- Trump says exporters pay tariffs. The lead chart proves otherwise.
- Trump fails to understand trade is multilateral, not bilateral.
- Trump fails to understand trade is between individuals, not nations.
- Trump fails to understand tariffs are a tax and that tax hike encourages price hikes by US producers who are too weak to compete globally.
- Trump believes a VAT is a tariff. It’s idiotic.
- Trump fails to understand there cannot possibly be any net benefit to paying more for copper, steel, aluminum.
Point 3 is critical. The EU cannot force private companies LNG or anything else from US companies.
All of the hype over a BRICS currency amounts to the same thing. A Brazilian framer selling sugar to a Chinese merchant has no need for the Yuan or a BRICS currency.
The Brazilian farmer needs the Brazilian Real because his expenses are in the Real. Alternatively, the farmer might want US dollars to buy machinery. Other than sanction avoidance, the BRICS currency has no use.
Yet Trump is threatening huge tariffs if any country uses BRICS.
It’s really pathetic to have a president who understands nothing about trade or currencies, then brags about tax hikes, with the Cult cheering. But here we are.
Related Posts
March 16, 2025: Trump Wants a Weak Dollar But Needs a Strong One
Trump wants the Fed to cut interest rates to weaken the dollar and boost exports. But that’s not what helped him get elected.
June 23, 2025: How Long Can the US Dollar Remain the Global Reserve Currency?
An article on the fundamental flaws with the euro triggered this post.
July 8, 2025: BRICS Are No Threat to US Dollar Dominance, But Trump Is
Are the BRICS Countries increasing their clout?
Addendum VATs
No, VAT isn’t a tariff – here’s what Trump (and others) get wrong
And in the US from the Conference Board: Tariffs for VAT? An Explainer
Key Vat Insights
- VAT is a neutral consumer tax applied to all goods sold domestically, while tariffs selectively penalize foreign imports by raising their prices.
- Shifting taxation from corporate and labor taxes to VAT has shown to enhance long-term economic growth and competitiveness, with 175 countries worldwide adopting VAT systems.
- The EU’s average corporate tax rate matches that of the US, contradicting the idea that Europe enjoys a corporate tax advantage at the expense of the US as a result of applying VAT.
And from the Tax Foundation The European VAT is Not a Discriminatory Tax Against US Exports
There are a dozen articles refuting BS from Trump. When Trump says anything it’s best to question it.
The money coming in from Trump’s tariffs don’t amount to a hill of beans compared to the deficit spending in the BBB.
That is correct
Also it’s a tax hike, and not an insignificant one, that impacts small business owners and the lower income quintiles the most.
I have just went through an EU document describing the deal and it doesn’t look that Trump has made a great deal. There is no EU’s commitment to remove non-tariff barriers vis-a-vis the US, just to reduce those where it doesn’t hurt. Trump caved in on airplanes,some chemicals and natural resources and pharma and EU extracted clear deadline from him, August 1. It seems that even Trump views potential 30% tariff on these items as suicide and not as weapon against the US. EU made cars fall under 15% which is probably the last nail in Detroit’s coffin. $40bn of AI chips is intention not a pledge. China is not specifically mentioned in clause on economic security. How can Art of the Deal negotiate against Chinese when even von der Leyden managed to get a reasonably good deal for spineless fragmented each-country-different-goal vassal where CIA has a file on every higher ranking politician? Let me tax my citizens (because we need cash to plug fiscal holes) and I give you what you want type of deal?
Bingo
And not a bit of it is binding until ….
The European Parliament ratifies it and the US Senate does too.
Meanwhile it’s a bunch of silly promises that won’t be met. But Trump does get to brag about a 15 percent tax hike on US citizens.
Please post a link to your doc so everyone can read it.
Thanks
There is nothing silly about them promising to buy more energy than we can sell. That ain’t window dressing. I’m so excited about Americans, without even a whimper, paying, so far, $128,000,000,000.00 in taxes without representation. All my Revolutionary War ancestors are so proud of us.
Stole this from ZH and wondering about all the tariff inflation impact on these.
Most extensive compilation on the internet I have compiled this list and update when significant changes warrant.
Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep,Case/New Holland tractor and equipment,Mack Truck,Freightliner & Western Star Truck,Navistar Truck,Detroit Diesel,Thomas Bus,Firestone Tire,General Tire,BF Goodrich Tire,Uniroyal Tire,Colt Firearms,Winchester Arms,Monsanto Chemical, GE appliance div,Sylvania Lighting,Jim Beam Distillery,Fridgidaire appliances,Rheem HVAC hot water heaters,American Standard,Loctite adhesives,Kraft & Heinz Foods,Burger King rest.,Hoover vacuums,Milwaukee power tools,Skil Power Tools,Dremel Power Tools,Homelite Power Tools,Vermont AmericanTools,Eureka vacuums,Rayban & Oakley eyewear,Krispy Kreme donuts,LensCrafters,Pearle Eyevision Centers,Sunglasses Hut,Pennzoil/Quaker State oils,CITGO Petroleum,Prestone anti freeze,Autolite auto parts,Ben & Jerry” ice cream,Fram auto filters,Purolator auto filters,Reynolds wraps & Hefty bag products,Anheuser Busch/Budweiser,Cirrus Aircraft,Werner Ladders,Johnson Levels,Rack Room Shoes stores,Rockport shoes,Keebler cookies, Famous Amos cookies,Caribou coffee,Peets Coffee,Einstein Bagels,Panera Bread,Dreyers/Edy’s ice cream,Breyers/Good Humor ice cream,Carnation,Ovaltine,Del Monte canned fruit & vegetables div,Poulan chainsaws,Weedeater power products,Empire levels,Dirt Devil vacuums,Delta Power Tools,Gerber Cutlery,Lucent Technologies/Bell Labs,Westinghose Nuclear,R.J Reynolds tobacco,Sprint mobile,Motorola cellphone div,AMC Theatres,Russell Stover/Whitmans candies,Link Belt Cranes,Tiffany jewelry,Maybelline Cosmetics,Dan Wesson Arms, Tiffany Jewelry, Keebler cookies, Ragu food sauces,Butterfinger/Baby Ruth/Rasinets/Sno Caps,Goobers,Sweettart/Laffy Taffy,Chunky Bar candies,Digiorno/Tombstone/California Pizza Kitchen/Jacks frozen pizzas,Purina pet foods,Gerber baby foods & products, Schwinn/Roadmaster/Mongoose/GT/Cannondale bikes,Chinet paper plates & products,Bobcat construction Equp,.Columbia Pictures,CBS Records,Seven Eleven stores,Holiday Inn,Westinghouse elevators,Electro Voice,Sea Land shipping,Keurig coffee,Holiday Inn Hotels,Hot Pocket frozen foods,Glidden paints,Dresser Industries,ALL Clad cookware,Mirro cookware,Emerson electric motor div,Wilton Vises,Browne & Sharpe tools,DKNY clothing,Chiquita fruits,Harmon International(Harmon Kardon,JBL speakers,Infinity speakers,Crown amps,Mark Levinson amps,),ERTL metal toys,Goodman HVAC,Country Crock margarine,Popsicle brand,Crush soft drinks,RC Cola,Stewarts soft drinks,Snapple,Sun Drop cola,Dr Pepper/Seven Up,A&W Root Beer,Motts juices,Hawaiian Punch drinks,NEHI drinks,Yoo Hoo drinks,Imperial margarine,Hellmann’s mayo,Airwick products,K-Y personal lubricants,d-con pesticides,Andrew Jergens soaps products,Dial soap,Trend & Purex detergents,Right Guard/Dry Idea deodorants,Gold Bond ointments,Wise chips and snacks,Ghirardelli Chocolate Company,Ferrara Pan candies makers of( Lemmonheads and other flavors,Atomic FireBalls,Brach;s candies,Sathers candies Bob’s candies,Now & Later,Red Hots,Boston Baked Beans), Jelly Belly Candies, Wells Entepirises(Blue Bunny, Blue Ribbon ice creams and Bomb Pop), Everlast Boxing equipment,Emtek & Yale Locks,Lexmark printers copy equipment, Shop Vac vacuums, SK Tools, Arrow staplers and many many more
D-R-I-N-K-M-O-R-E-O-V-A-L-T-I-N-E
I seem to recall at least a decade ago this site advertising the sale of farmland in the Ukraine. My Ukie neighbor pointed out this land was next to Russia.
How has that worked out for investors?
This is bullshit. I never promoted buying farmland in Ukraine. Zero hits in a search just now.
It was an ad not an article. I still have hard copy if I can find it. It had to be before 2014, maybe around 2012.
Are you archived that far back?
I doubt it was Automatic Earth.
And if I recall it was through a third financier company only the sales copy was posted. Nice pictures of black soil too.
I know it was not ZH.
I think I started reading these sites sometime after 2009.
Obviously been lurking for a long time.
Stop stealing if this is the result.
Now that is projection. What are you guilty of?
Some type of online scam.
Strange you use “stealing” with theft never mentioned.
Back when this was written Ukraine seemed a good investment for farming.
Like retiring to Peru.
What amazes me is the number of people in this country that think paying more for goods is a great thing for them, family, neighbors, etc. This country is full of people with peasant minds.
What guarantee do you dip shits have that your life situation will get better if tariffs are added and/or increased?
If the idea is that tariffs = prosperity then let’s cut the crap and just add a 1 million % tariff to everything.
Yesterday I spoke with a bank about an auto loan. End of the month and I didn’t want the check to appear on a report in case I did not want a car.
He told me he deals with people requesting a loan more than once a month.
How stupid do you have to be to twice in thirty days apply for a loan you know will be denied.
He stated he also talks financially stupid people out of applying on a significant basis.
The low rent auto loan place locally, the place where bad credit borrowers could get a loan and every dealer loved stopped doing loans.
Because of the repo,s.
I am not certain I can mention a competitor here but I stumbled across Orlando Miner. Naturally he is selling stuff but the main point he is making comes across within the first three minutes of his videos. Check out his last five or ten for trends not really covered except in passing.
Those trends impact everything.
Good for a laugh and good for the utterly horrible realization how stupid people are.
Chaplin said that up close life is a comedy but at a distance it is a tragedy.
Just when you think Trump could not do anything dumber or more damaging to our nation… He Does!
And delusional people play “repeat after me” whatever Fox News tells them to.
Meanwhile more raccoons have been arrested than Epstein associates like Trump!
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Had a fun conversation with a neighbor. He said that “Democrat sanctuary cities are seriously under reporting crime by illegals to make it look like most crime is coming from Americans”. I said “where’d you hear that?”. His response “it’s all over the news”. I said “what sources did the news use that I can look up and verify?”. End of conversation…
I live in a small city that seriously under reports crime. Drug deaths amongst the homeless never get mentioned due to lack of family to create an obituary.
The local brown people come from Puerto Rico.
It is a farce.
And the cops are truly lazy.
Get the bennies and get out.
But this {My city recently the local metal recycler had a million embezzled by an employee}
Which group is more likely to commit white collar crimes?
white males
The majority of white-collar crime offenders are white males, except for those who commit- ted embezzlement.
https://secondcitycop.blogspot.com/?m=1
under reporting of crime has been happening in LA for years. It’s as much a cop problem as it is a City of LA political problem. Gotta show we’re making progress! Let’s just not report everything. Bad incentives always produce this bs.
You should know this.
Preparing my kids for a future in Europe. The UK and EU are now doing everything they can to attract US citizens. While America turns into India, Europe will be what America could have been. Ive received multiple contacts over the last 6 months asking if I could move to Europe for research and development. I must thank Trump for part of this as he continues to make Europe rely on itself. This will open up all kinds of oppoeruntieis for US citizens who are getting replaced by visa-based workers. Americans last.
They are trying to poach talent from the US and some countries like France have set aside 100 million Euros to pay for them because in Europe the salaries for what you do are much less. That is good but the downside is that if you are paid much more than your co-workers it can cause friction. It was a continual problem where I worked.
So now H1B cheap labor?
What field are you talking about, because IT is laying off by the thousand.
The Brazilian farmer has no use for dollars, because bank accounts in Brazil can only hold BRL. As any country which has capital controls in place, the Brazilian farmer acquires US farm machinery through the Brazilian Central Bank.
I haven’t looked closely at the linked source within this quote, and the underlying numbers and formulae, but anyway:
” … The independent Tax Foundation projected that Trump’s tariffs would raise $2.5 trillion in revenue over the next decade, but that, through price increases, they would effectively increase taxes on the average U.S. household by nearly $1,300 this year and nearly $1,700 in 2026, should they remain in full effect. …”
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/congress/sen-josh-hawley-introduces-bill-send-tariff-rebate-checks-americans-rcna221457
Time to relocate to the EU?
How are you going to get a work permit?
Duh Slavic prostitution runners.
The idea of tariffs is to make American goods a better deal to the consumer than buying imported products or to encourage investment in American companies to make American products here to avoid tariffs. The reality is that Europe already has a 20% sales taxes added to American goods sold there. This is an attempt to level the playing field.
I understand the stupid theory
And it’s a stupid way of going about it
And you need a refreshened course on a VAT
Read My addendum on VATs
Why?
Mish ive been pondering. Tariffs will raise prices. Higher prices will put pressure on businesses to raise wages to attract employees. Which will raise prices. So eventually we will be back to where we are today. Except our exports will be more expensive and businesses will adopt ai faster reducing tax base.
What do you think.
California has a 10% sales tax added to American goods. Let’s tariff California too!
Try real facts not partisan play numbers.First, not near 10% – much less on the rest of the US!
“In short, while some locations within California might have a combined sales tax rate that reaches or exceeds 10%, it’s not a universal rate for the entire state or specifically for “American goods”. All goods sold within California are subject to the same sales tax rules based on the location of the sale, regardless of their origin within the United States.”
Explains please.
Duh !!!!!!!!! We also have sales tax (VAT) added to our own good and services at 20%. God you are dull.
No. The European consumer pays the same VAT regardless of an item’s origin.
The sad thing can also be said that people keep trashing Trump’s tariffs, when to-date, they haven’t raised inflation. A 10% tariff is easily absorbed by the foreign producer, exporter & domestic importer / retailer, unless it’s on a good that has unusually low margin for some reason. Even a 15% tariff is mostly going be absorbed by the pre-consumer supply chain.
So to-date other than being able to call Trump out about all sorts of bellicose statements, just about everyone here has been wrong. Now if Aug 1st gets here and Trump leaves a 25% tariff on all the remaining countries yet to handshake / sign a deal, then we’re definitely looking at an increase inflation on those imports. Likewise, if Trump leaves the 50% tariff on steel & related products, then they will certainly have a quick & outsized impact on producer & then consumer prices.
But to recap, thus far, if you’re a Trump hater, then you’ve pretty much been wrong.
The fun starts on Aug 1. Get ready to put on the popcorn.
I also think the tariff effect on inflation is a red hearing. The US economy is 70+% services. By the time any product gets to the consumer, there are multitudes of surcharges.
Nevertheless, tariffs on EU are idiotic, since EU isn’t practicing mercantilism ala China, nor exchange rate fixing ala Japan. It will only create bad blood, and TACO is badly in need of some public relation.
Consumer prices are a small problem. The bigger problem is that US manufacturers are being saddled with extra tariff costs (like 50% on steel, aluminum and copper) that their foreign competitors don’t have. US manufacturers were already struggling to compete thanks to higher wages and energy costs. Tariffs are just another nail in their coffin. Trump is making foreign manufacturing great again.
It’s still VERY early in the game as far as tariff prices affecting inflation. Like 1st inning early. It’s like smoking a few cigs a day at age 20 and saying see, I don’t have cancer or other health problems so what’s the big deal about smoking. By the time you are 40 (assuming you live that long) and smoke 2 packs a day things will look a lot different.
Also many people seem to conflate tariff percentages with final retail prices paid by consumers. So if item X costs $5 at the store and there is a 50% tariff it’s going to cost 7.50. But the tariff price is on the manufacturer price which could be just $1 (the other 4 dollars being shipping costs, middle men / final retailer profit). So when the price only goes to 5.50 they think there wasn’t any real tariff cost.
those trashing Trump’s tariffs have said all along it will take minimum 6-9 imnths for pain to be felt. because of panic buying ahead of them, existing inventory and companies experimenting with what they can and cannot eat.
companies will not easily absorb 10% increase in their cost of dong business. their planning is now completely upended and it’s ridiculous to think they will just shrug and eat all the tariffs like they’re stupid instead of passing it on.
“absorbed by the supply chain” means lower corporate earnings. There is no free lunch, somebody pays. And it is fantasy to think that the foreign exporter is going to be the one to do so – they are just going to sell into other markets.
I know people who are convinced that the exporters pay the tariffs. No amount of explanation will get them to believe that the importer pays for the tariffs. TDS is now an affliction of the MAGA right.
And apparently no amount of explanation will help you understand this:
$1.00 widgets are subject to a 10% tariff. The foreign producer / exporter cuts their prices by 10% to maintain market share, so the cost to the importer is now $0.90. The importer PAYS the 10% tariff raising the cost to import back up to $0.99. So in this example, the importer gets to keep $0.01, when we compare the old & new prices that are passed onto the consumer, who is still paying the same price after the 10% tariff.
Not a bad deal for the importer, NO?
And it’s been widely reported by just about everyone that, based on CPI & Producer Index data to-date, it looks like this is what’s been happening up through June,
We have your explanation or Mish, on why inflation has not taken off. Unless you offer proof, I will stick with Mish. Of course there’s the TACO effect…
The proof is in the CPI data.
To date, NOBODY has been able to point to obvious, broad-based, tariff related increases in CPI.
That’s legit.
because it takes time for them to show up there, as everyone has said from the beginning.
Lol! Why would they cut their price if all their foreign competitors are subject to similar tariffs. Trump wants to tariff everyone. Or did you forget that?
To maintain market share, assuming the widgets cost the same. The one who cuts their price, maintains market share. The one who doesn’t loses market share. How hard is that to understand?
And it behooves countries to sign trade deals with the US, because those that are getting a better deal come Aug 1. The UK for example is getting 10%, I think, vs the EU 15%. Who knows where China is going to end up at. 30% is probably too high long-term, but I could definitely see them getting 20%, when it’s all said & done.
All of this is WAY more complicated than we all make it out to be. We, including you and me, tend to think in terms basic supply & demand, but on a global scale this is all well beyond what we’re capable of diagraming out / connecting the dots.
Nope. If everyone keeps their prices the same, they all maintain market share. The only reason to cut price is if you want to increase market share.
Because most also have American competitors and alternatives. They pass on the tariff and the customer passes on buying their product.
The American competitors just raise their prices.
I assume you’re talking about apples to apples here. In other words, an imported widget that costs the same as the American made one.
Well, let’s start out by analyzing that. So you’re suggesting that there’s all sorts of widgets made in the USA that are the same price as the imported one, before tariff?
PLEASE OH PLEASE GIVE ME AN EXHAUSTIVE LIST OF THIS.
And don’t blabber about steel, al & cu. These are either raw materials or base consumables. I want fully manufactured goods as examples.
That’s about the funniest thing I’ve heard you say in a long time. The MAIN REASON US companies import things from abroad is because they either cost less or is something that’s not made in the US in sufficient quantities to meet their demand.
So right there out the gate, you’re talking nothingburgers, grasping at straws.
And like we all do here on Mishtalk, you’re making the assumption that the US competitor is going to raise prices to meet the new tariff price of the import and choose not to increase market share instead. Sure, in really simple examples, that’s probably the case, but I hardly doubt it’s the case across all sorts of imported goods that have “competitive” US manufacturers.
“ Well, let’s start out by analyzing that. So you’re suggesting that there’s all sorts of widgets made in the USA that are the same price as the imported one, before tariff?”
Nope. I have never suggested anything that stupid. That is YOUR suggestion.
Companies import foreign “widgets” because they are better or cheaper than what they can get in the US. Otherwise there is no point in importing.
And lose market share. Competition does exist.
If US firms are so competitive, then why does Trump need to put tariffs on foreign imports?
This entire thread reminds me of a Bob Hope comedy skit with one of his shows regulars where Bob pointed out he was losing say a dime on every sale and the guest replied right but my plan to remedy the loss is to make it up with volume.
If they have American alternatives, why are they importing?
Hardly anyone here ever talks to the companies who are importing nor the companies that export to the US so they have no real idea of what their are. They are just presenting their various ideological preferences as fact. The Libertarians here hate anything that resembles a tax including tariffs but somehow love VATs. That is inconsistent. If Trump introduces one I am sure that love will turn to hate.
They are just presenting their various ideological preferences as fact.
Exactly. Nobody here is a trained economist who of late have been very wrong with their predictions about Trump’s trade policies.
There aren’t many modern examples of what we’re going through right now.
I agree. We’re all giving our opinions. As usual, it takes time to find out which one’s are more correct than others.
Until then, everyone THINKS they’re an expert on everything, including myself.
Yep. You don’t. As a result, you don’t have a clue. Personally I talk to a lot of companies. Confidentially of course.
Explain how tariffs differ from sales taxes? Why is it that corporate and personal (S corp, LLC taxes) are not passed through to consumers and tariffs are?
Imported goods are 12% of GDP. I would guess on average a 50% mark up so cost basis 8%. 15% on 8% is a cost increase of 1.2% of GDP.
I think not reverting to the old tax rates will cut costs over 1.2% of GDP.
Tariffs shift cost burdens of US goods to foreign goods. I think that is a wise bias.
Tariffs are not applicable to most goods required. Food is mostly US based so if you want foreign goods, you will pay a little more. The cost of the tariffs is pretty easy to avoid.
The end user pays all taxes, unless the vendor operates at a loss.
I can avoid the cost of sales taxes too if I don’t ever buy anything.
The fact that consumers will pay higher prices for imported items is the smaller problem.
The bigger problem is that US manufacturers will be even LESS competitive than they already were, thanks to 50% tariffs on steel, aluminum and copper. Plus other assorted tariffs that will increase their cost of manufacturing. Their competition in other countries don’t have these extra costs. Trump is making foreign manufacturers great again.
As I said to Mish the other day about something related, do you honestly think 50% tariffs on steel, al & cu are going to be around forever?
And you speak of them being in place already, which they’re not. TACO has more than enough time to cut them back by 50% and then eventually down to say 15%.
It’s simply hilarious that you’re solely concerned about manufacturing competitiveness & seem to care less about a near-term spike in inflation.
And don’t get me wrong, they both important, but again it’s hilarious that you minimize one for the sake of the other. And you’re constantly conjecturing that’s we’re going to see a collapse in jobs due to steel, al & cu tariffs.
Do you honestly think Trump is going to let this happen?
The moment anything that remotely resembles this rears its head, he’s going to have to back down. The only question is, if these conjectured job losses begin to happen, how long does it take for them to arrive & will it happen before China & MX are forced to get serious with negotiations.
“ And you speak of them being in place already, which they’re not. TACO has more than enough time to cut them back by 50% and then eventually down to say 15%.”
Lol! Nope.
On March 12, 2025, the United States started applying a 25% tariff on imports of steel and aluminum products from all countries.
On June 4, 2025, the rate increased to 50%.
These tariffs are already in effect and being paid.
Copper tariffs of 50% begin Aug 1, 2025.
Our manufacturers are already being hobbled by these tariffs. And by others as well.
“ do you honestly think 50% tariffs on steel, al & cu are going to be around forever?”
Of course they won’t be in place forever. I never said they would. But as long as they are in place, US manufacturers are being hobbled.
And you are cheering for them while you don’t even realize that they are already in effect.
Hope that helps.
Ok, my bad on the steel side, but I’m not cheering for the steel tariffs. I have said on many occasions to you directly that I’m not in favor of such large tariffs.
But my point was primarily directed at these supposed massive job losses. Granted, they will take time to show up, if Trump’s tariffs create too much dislocation.
I just don’t think Trump is going to let it come to that. Again, time will tell.
My only two points, which I keep repeating, are that tariffs on raw materials and various other inputs, will hurt our manufacturers; not help them. And that the only tariff revenue that US customs receives is paid by those US companies. Not by foreign governments or foreign companies.
You simultaneously agree with me and then try to tell me that I am wrong about everything so far. As you twist yourself into knots trying to justify whatever the f*ck you are trying to say.
Make up your mind.
1. Do 50% tariffs on steel, aluminum, and copper help our manufacturers or hurt them?
2. Who pays tariffs to US Customs?
Simple questions. Easy answers.
A lot of countries simply don’t care what happens. People will move on to other opportunities. Some hard times, so be it. In the mean time stagflation is coming to the “west”. This will be the result of the wrong antidotes being prescribed over a long time.
Now explain all that in a TikTok jiggly dance.
3 of you do not want an economics guy unlike Bill Nye.
Who is the science guy on TikTok?
Bill Nye
Bill Nye (@billnye) | TikTok.
Most of MAGA doesn’t care. Trump could declare that it’s okay for people to eat their young and half of MAGA would buy it. It’s a cult. A large number of the Cult followers are getting out, getting treatment and looking into deprogramming for their remaining Cult members, but the Cult will live on -even beyond 2028 when we get the new Newsome/AOC Administration. They’ll be claiming they stoled the election -or the Courts were corrupt for not allowing Trump to run for a third term.
I think we are in trouble-serious trouble. .
Dude Trump leaves 2026. Vance gets two years then two more terms,10 years.
Vance is the good Ol’ boy with the HIB wife and rehab mom.
A failed economy who can challenge Vance?
He can even site his middle of the road stances during various Trump meetings.
Plus he is intel since college.
Vance is the hidden killer in every murder mystery.
Does anyone pay attention to his stances, actions and trajectory?
Well put! I have pondered scenarios of Trump resignation. But at the end of the day, he just doesn’t engage any sort of actual “team player” thinking, for any longer than a few seconds at a burst, and that, rarely. I would be stunned. That said, I am very wary of Vance. Trump completed the quest of FOX: he got the critical mass of non-rich people to become devoted (and to vote) for an oligarchs’ party. (The Big Beautiful Bill is a temporary sop to keep the bandwagon going, while putting up the velvet ropes against mass opportunity.) But Vance lacks the telegenic weird charisma to sustain the momentum, in any slight degree. He is a flaccid suit, not entertaining at all (the spirit of the age). If Trump for any reason ghosts the scene, I still see a many-sided chaotic scrum, as all roads that went through him disappear. Suddenly lots of face-offs would emerge. Not just idiotically-telegenically, but ideologically, also.
There are many avenues for an 80 year old Epstein guy to leave office.
Elon’s new party takes enough of the middle like Perot.
Who do the Dems actually have? Obama was ‘nudged’ into the role for years.
Traditional rules require either a gov or senator.
Trump and Eisenhower broke that pattern but Ike was big mil.
Vance keeps the dedicated 30%, Dems keep their 30%, Elon steals what he can from the middle and now spatting with Trump steals some Dems.
Simple even without rigging and Vance can spend two years sucking up apologizing for Trump policies.
Nobody’s voting for a guy who’s best known for romancing couches. Especially not after his little book made southerners out to be slack jawed dimwits. I for one am tired of Yankees coming to cash in on Appalachia. It’s take take take until something like Helene happens and they’re nowhere to be found.
Newsome would also be a terrible nom, but the DNC is too elderly and out of touch to read the writing on the wall from Mamdani. They want a president who’s willing to act like Trump in a blue tie.
This nation is going to have to call out both sides of the dirty penny before we can live easy again.
He is already there. Visited the pope before death then straight to India. On record against bombing Iran.
Intel guys know how to play middle of the road plus he has all that wonderful tech manipulation in his favor.
I believe Vance is staying quiet, watching the political tide.
Newt Gingrich has been making an awful lot of appearances lately, too.
VP Newt? Too old.
Vance only needs two terms then Dems can follow the planned social change pattern.
MAGA is composed of slack-jawed cultists. Once they started defending pedophiles, I have to wonder, is there really any limit? Cannibalisim, maybe?
nothing can get through the MAG forcefield. Nothing.
You are correct. If the next administration is a Newsome/AOC administration, we are in serious trouble.
Trump could declare that it’s okay for people to eat their young and half of MAGA would buy it.
That sounds exactly like the same type of hyperbole that Trump would spout. The only difference is that he’s the POTUS, so everybody listens.
Ignorance is strength!
Move to the second floor, for your own safety.
Too soon for Blackstone jokes.
It is an established fact that Taco has a problem with the truth, especially in regards to the tariff issues.
I just watched the old Trump on Oprah clip and he is wearing LATEX GLOVES!
Onstage alone why?
Dude has been nuts for a very long time.
Fred really did a number on that kid.
Love your children people. Not in the way that Trump and Epstein loved other people’s children. I think everyone here gets it.
Love all kids, hell love everyone. Be kind, try to change lives away from sad paths. If the 20th century bully culture hadn’t gotten root people like Donald wouldn’t be so pervasive in that generation. Dunno why that even has to be said really.
Nature is violent. History is violent.
>”Heh… why be kind? Nazis existed… It’s just human nature man…”
This isn’t R/atheism bud.
Honestly someone was dumb enough to down vote the fact that both nature and history is violent.
Video games are violent.Those are the best loved.
What bubble can one live in where they have never observed the inherent violence of nature.
i have a pal that was beat up by trump in junior hs. he said that trump was so scared of his father. others in my circle of old boomers, who knew both fred and little donald, in nyc concur.
He’s been a germ-o-phobe forever.
Hence the latex gloves.
Most recently his doctors said he had swollen hands from all the hand shaking and he has a serious venous issue.
What has he been wearing movie special effect latex?