Q&A: Obamacare Big Price Hikes Coming. What’s the Shutdown Really About?

Neither Republicans nor Democrats are telling the truth.

Big Price Hikes Coming

Even if there’s a deal, to end the shutdown, big price hikes are coming.

The Wall Street Journal explains What to Know About Signing Up for ACA Health Plans as Rates Rise

For around 24 million people enrolled in Affordable Care Act plans, things are about to get crazy.

Enrollment for next year’s coverage starts Saturday, and virtually everything is changing all at once. Premiums for many plans are shooting upward. The federal subsidies that most enrollees use to pay for their insurance are set to shrink, though Congress might still reverse that in coming weeks. New rules will add additional wrinkles, including the risk of higher tax bills.

The upshot: If you have Obamacare, you really need to dig in and be careful about what you choose during the open enrollment period, which begins Saturday and lasts until Dec. 15, for coverage that starts Jan. 1.

If you don’t, you could get hit with huge bills next year. You could also be locked into health insurance you can’t afford.

“This is the most extreme pricing change we’ve seen,” said Jeff Grant, a former official with the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services, which oversees federal ACA implementation. “Nobody can understand what this means until they go shop.”

Many Obamacare insurance premium hikes for next year are well into double-digit percentages. Most enrollees don’t pay the full premium, but declining federal subsidies will still leave them with far higher monthly bills.

The pain will be spread unevenly. Its impact will depend on factors like your income level, your age and what plans are sold in your area. 

Some of the biggest increases, in dollar terms, will hit people who make slightly over 400% of the federal poverty level, which is about $62,600 for an individual. Many of those people qualified for a subsidy this year, but they won’t get any help at all next year because enhanced federal payments are set to lapse. 

Premiums More Than Double

KKK reports ACA Marketplace Premium Payments Would More than Double on Average Next Year if Enhanced Premium Tax Credits Expire

Since 2014, the ACA has capped how much subsidized enrollees pay for their health insurance premiums at a certain percent of their income, on a sliding scale, with the federal government covering the remainder in the form of a tax credit. Enhanced tax credits work by further lowering the share of income ACA Marketplace enrollees pay for a plan. For example, with the enhanced tax credits in place, an individual making $28,000 will pay no more than around 1% ($325) of their annual income towards a benchmark plan. If the enhanced tax credits expire, this same individual would pay nearly 6% of their income ($1,562 annually) towards a benchmark plan in 2026. In other words, if the enhanced tax credits expire, this individual would experience an increase of $1,238 in their annual premium payments net of the tax credit.

insurers in the ACA Marketplace are proposing to raise their rates by a median of 18%. Fueled by rising health care costs and the expiration of the enhanced premium tax credits, insurers are proposing the largest rate increases in 2026 since 2018, the last time uncertainty over federal policy changes contributed to sharp premium increases. As premiums increase, the enhanced tax credits provide additional savings to enrollees that receive them. This means that middle-income enrollees, whose payment for a benchmark plan is currently capped at 8.5% of their income and will lose financial assistance altogether, will have to cover the cost of premium increases in addition to the amount their tax credits would have previously covered to keep their same plan.

Enrollees with incomes above 400% of poverty will be subject to large increases in premium payments if enhanced premium tax credits expire. On average, a 60-year-old couple making $85,000 (or 402% FPL) would see yearly premium payments rise by over $22,600 in 2026, after accounting for an annual premium increase of 18%. This would bring the cost of a benchmark plan to about a quarter of this couple’s annual income, up from 8.5%. Meanwhile, a 45-year-old earning $20,000 (or 128% FPL) in a non-Medicaid expansion state would see their premium payments for a benchmark plan rise from $0 to $420 per year, on average, from the loss of enhanced premium tax credits. About half (45%) of ACA Marketplace enrollees have incomes between 100-150% of poverty, about a fourth (28%) have incomes between 150-250% of poverty, and roughly 1 in 10 have incomes above 400% of poverty.

Funding SNAP

The New York Times reports Government Ordered to Pay Food Stamp Benefits During Shutdown

A federal judge ordered the Trump administration on Friday to continue paying for food stamps during the government shutdown, siding with local officials and nonprofits that had sought to spare millions of low-income Americans from losing benefits in a matter of days.

It was the second of two rulings in the span of about an hour that found the administration had acted unlawfully, after it had refused to tap an emergency reserve — enacted by Congress and totaling in the billions of dollars — to sustain the nation’s largest anti-hunger program.

But it remained unclear if or when food stamps would actually reach the roughly 42 million people who rely on monthly federal help to purchase groceries. Taking to social media, President Trump said late Friday that his administration would release the funds only once it received “appropriate legal direction” from the court, as he warned that any food stamp benefits paid in November would “unfortunately be delayed.”

The emergency funds alone are enough to provide only partial benefits, according to federal officials, raising the odds of another financial cliff for millions of low-income Americans unless Congress can quickly devise an end to the current stalemate.

The twin court defeats nonetheless amounted to a major rebuke of the White House. For days, Mr. Trump’s leading deputies had maintained that they could do little to save the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program, known as SNAP, despite the fact that they had access to emergency reserves — and had already moved around billions of dollars to sustain other functions of government while federal funding had lapsed.

A spokesman for the Justice Department declined to comment, and a spokeswoman for the White House budget office did not respond to a request.

Roughly one in eight Americans are enrolled in SNAP, which was set to run out of money beginning Saturday in a calamity that would have exacted a substantial economic toll on communities nationwide.

The Agriculture Department initially said it would use the money, which totals about $5 billion, if the government remained closed for an extended time. But the agency reversed its publicly stated policy in late October, saying that it could not legally drain the available reserves except in response to natural disasters. That created a November funding cliff for the program.

At one point during the hearing, Tyler Becker, a lawyer for the Justice Department, argued on Friday that the shutdown was “not an emergency,” even though roughly 42 million people were at risk of losing benefits imminently.

“If we are given the appropriate legal direction by the Court, it will BE MY HONOR to provide the funding, just like I did with Military and Law Enforcement Pay,” added Mr. Trump, referring to his earlier actions to shift billions in funding to pay workers who normally would not have received checks during the shutdown.

Q&A on Obamacare and SNAP

Q: Do Democrats want to fund illegal aliens?
A: Of course they do, but please keep reading.

Q: Is the shutdown about funding for illegal aliens?
A: No. That’s a Republican excuse. If that was what the shutdown was about, it would be over already. Republicans and Democrats would work out a solution. They are not even talking.

Q: Are both sides lying?
A: Yes, as is typically the case.

Q: What’s this really about?
A: Democrats extended subsidies to those making up to 400 percent of the poverty level. They want to keep those subsidies. Illegal aliens are a side show.

Q: Why are benefits expiring this year?
A: Blame the Democrats. To make Biden’s budget look reasonable, it was the Democrats who set this year as the expiration.

Q: Please explain.
A: Budgets are 10-year processes. Both sides play games by pretending their handouts will expire. That way they get to avoid 10-year accounting, treating things as temporary. Trump’s first term Tax Cuts and Jobs Act was set to expire next year as well. But it didn’t. The budget deficit increase was massive.

Q: Did Republicans claim the deficit did not rise due to extending the TCJA?
A: Of course. It’s a big lie.

Q: If Democrats were in power now would they make the same claim about Obamacare subsides?
A: Of course

Q: What does SNAP have to do with this?
A: Trump tried to shut off all SNAP benefits to pressure Democrats into passing a clean continuing resolution to fund the government?

Q: Can Trump shut off all SNAP funding?
A: No, but he tried to anyway by shutting off the emergency SNAP funding pool.

Q: If the emergency pool runs out, will SNAP benefits cease?
A: Yes

Q: Who will get the blame for this?
A: Republicans think Democrats will get the blame. Democrats think Republicans will get the blame.

Q: Who has the better case?
A: In the blame game, Democrats will come out ahead. In the case for reducing spending, Republicans have the better case.

Q: Won’t Republicans increase the deficit in other places?
A: Of course. Look no further than Trump’s “Golden Dome” defense system, Trump’s “Golden Fleet” shipbuilding program, and ridiculous executive orders on resumed nuclear testing.

Q: What’s the resolution of this crisis?
A: The same as always. More of this in return for more of that.

The system is totally broken. Expect deficits to soar out of sight.

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Casual Observer
Casual Observer
2 months ago

We need an economic crash to bring prices down. And then a currency revaluation where the new dollar is $10 of the current dollar.

jlee
jlee
2 months ago

needed or not, here it comes

RonJ
RonJ
2 months ago

“…financial cliff…”

38 trillion $ national debt. The 1913 dollar is worth around a penny. The U.S. penny is going to stop production. The Roman Denarius was a silver coin, which eventually ended up with less than 1% silver content. TILT.

Denninger, the other day was railing again that enforcing USC 15, antitrust law, would cut the cost of medical as much as 80%. Why does medical have antitrust exemption? Why do pharma companies have liability protection from vaccine injuries? Denninger has mentioned that twice, the court has upheld antitrust law on medical, yet it has not been enforced. What happened to no one is above the law? It is just sloganeering.

Aduhelm, an Alzheimer’s drug that didn’t work, approved by the FDA at a price of $56,000 for a year. Later cut to $28,000 a year- for a drug that doesn’t work, to treat people of medicare age, which does nothing for them. A $28,000 placebo with potential negative drug side effects. Apparently, it has now been quietly withdrawn by the pharma company. Think about the fact that Aduhelm was approved only because it was to help the pharma company recoup costs.

Flingel Bunt
Flingel Bunt
2 months ago

“…The system is totally broken. Expect deficits to soar out of sight….”
Got gold, silver, miners? Good.
Got oil? Oops.

Christoball
Christoball
2 months ago

Lets face it, the USA is a Usary Based Economy.

Last edited 2 months ago by Christoball
CaptainCaveman
CaptainCaveman
2 months ago

Where are the damn bond vigilantes I’ve heard abut all my life?

JSH
JSH
2 months ago
Reply to  CaptainCaveman

A conspiracy theory, but, I suspect the FED is running QE on the medium and long end of the yield curve through some undisclosed mechanism.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  CaptainCaveman

US T-bills and bonds pay the highest coupon in the developed countries and are the safest to buy. Bond vigilantes are snapping them up gratefully.

Flingel Bunt
Flingel Bunt
2 months ago
Reply to  Jon

Next question.
If US Ts and Bs “…pay the highest coupon in the developed countries and are the safest to buy…”
WHY is the coupon rate so high?
Might it have to do with a declining dollar? Falling demand?

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Flingel Bunt

Inflation premium.

Flingel Bunt
Flingel Bunt
2 months ago
Reply to  Jon

declining dollar = inflation premium

FDR
FDR
2 months ago
Reply to  Flingel Bunt

Yankee $ is cleanest shirt in the dirty laundry. When the next recession or depression occurs depending how deep the latter is Yankee $ will remain the reserve currency of the world and seekers of credit in the repo, wholesale market funding, SOFR, etc., will flock to Treasuries as their source of collateral.

Why? At this time there is no alternative or TINA. When there is an alternative, the US will become officially a banana republic and a 3rd world country.

The days of the US Empire and Pax Americana are waning. Trump, Biden, Obama, Bush II stretched and overreached the Empire’s ability to be the world’s policeman due to wars on terror, invading or overthrowing or attempting overthrow Ukraine, Libya, Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, Venezuela, etc.. for oil, commodities, mutinationals, etc.

bmcc
bmcc
2 months ago

honest assessment of the situation. however it’s idiotic that amerikans keep voting to pay double to triple the rest of the world’s cost to doctoring. not to mention non stop warfare which runs about a trillion per annum including VA plus the unintended and contingent liabilities of this imperial idiocy. 9.11.01 and GWO being scary as an example. amerikans are grifters and war mongers. democracy works. the real blame is in the mirror of 98% of the voters. the 2percent who vote green or libertarian seem to have half a brain. democracy works perfectly. grifters elect grifters. hat tip republic of plato.

Mike T
Mike T
2 months ago
Reply to  bmcc

Interesting post, bm. A couple of your points merit further thought, but I’d be interested in two items: 1) your nationality/heritage. Yes, there’s an element of graft in the U.S. politics. How about your amongst your leaders? 2) What solutions do you propose? It’s one thing to criticize, but for resolving the world’s issues, what solutions are you offering?

Jojo
Jojo
2 months ago
Reply to  Mike T

Take money out of politics. Everything will follow from that.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Jojo

Sure, have a constitutional amendment that says the federal government will fund all federal campaigns for elected officials, and any official (or family member) found accepting funds (or jobs) from private sources will be hung from the neck on the White House lawn for treason. Folks like Mike T would never go for something like that though, because liberty.

randocalrissian
randocalrissian
2 months ago
Reply to  Jon

Start by overturning Citizens United, one of the worst laws that has hurt the USA tremendously. BUT the political class’s corporate masters will never allow that. Make your plans accordingly.

RonJ
RonJ
2 months ago
Reply to  Jojo

Money can’t be taken out of politics. Political candidates promise to spend the public’s money if they get elected. “Elect me and i will vote for a new or enlarged government benefits.” Mandami is talking of new benefits to get himself elected mayor of NYC. Free bus rides. Also, he is apparently looking into how he can seize private property for community benefit. Allegedly, this includes people who are empty nesters with a 4 or 6 bedroom house. Property ownership is a threat to democracy.

Jojo
Jojo
2 months ago
Reply to  RonJ

Exactly! Thus the only solution is to abolish our government system and politics as it presently exists, put an AI in charge and let is robot workers do all the work and provide for humans as needed.

randocalrissian
randocalrissian
2 months ago
Reply to  Jojo

what could possibly go wrong?

bmcc
bmcc
2 months ago
Reply to  Mike T

born and raised in usa. also have EU passport, italia. the solution is simple. when amerikans to start to be anti imperialist and vote for anti imperialists. this is so simple. look at the history of italia, spain, portugal and france and UK and netherlands and belgium. this is so damn basic. the republic of plato short handbook on democracy layed it all out. amerikans are grifters and imperialists. perhaps we’ll change soon. i hope so. i’ve been advocating this. what is your background ?

randocalrissian
randocalrissian
2 months ago
Reply to  bmcc

America is too dumb to wake up to the benefits of socialized healthcare for all. Every other advanced nation does it, and it works. When people say that isn’t true, the fact they cite a preference for our incapable execution of healthcare reveals a lot.

glenny
glenny
2 months ago

Yes, but it comes at a cost as in much higher income tax rates . I’m in Canada and have a tax rate approx. 20 % higher than equivalent US for earned income.

Bill
Bill
2 months ago

The key statement in the post: The system is broken.
Everyone knows it.

I started the process of estimating income to open enroll. Doesn’t really matter because what’s broken is the costs are in the stratosphere at the provider and insurer levels. When you have to devote about $6/hour just to have insurance and another $2-4/hour for a deductible, that’s a lot of wage resources devoted to health care. How is this workable?

So much for making health care affordable via the Affordable Care Act! In line with the Inflation Reduction Act or the American Rescue Plan or the Big Beautiful Bill or the Patriot Act or…….

If government and politicians get involved it will always get worse.

Mike T
Mike T
2 months ago
Reply to  Bill

Bill, ever seen “Blazing Saddles”? Rowrick.
So how do we improve the morass (and probable corruption) that has become our health care system (a.k.a. Medical-Industrial Complex).

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Mike T

Simple, copy the German system, or Taiwanese. Both provide outstanding services at a reasonable cost.

Flingel Bunt
Flingel Bunt
2 months ago
Reply to  Mike T

Vastly increased competition will do it.

Eg: Start a company doing one-price for air travel to Thailand, surgery, and recuperation.

Jojo
Jojo
2 months ago
Reply to  Bill

Get a job in healthcare. They often get free insurance.

randocalrissian
randocalrissian
2 months ago
Reply to  Jojo

Ah yes, fix myself and to hell with everyone else, great solution!

JCH1952
JCH1952
2 months ago
Reply to  Bill

A major part of that promise was the insurance subsidies, which did in fact make the cost of healthcare insurance vastly less expensive for millions of Americans who could not afford healthcare insurance prior to Obamacare. It is preposterous to think forcing insurance companies to not charge extra for preexisting conditions would result in less expensive healthcare costs overall as preexisting conditions are massively expensive to treat, and that expense is spread over all policy holders, which makes all policies more expensive. Are early deaths going to be a lot cheaper? Yes, limiting care to finish people off sooner is cheaper.

ajc1970
ajc1970
2 months ago

Mish, “KKK reports” should probably be “KFF reports”

Sentient
Sentient
2 months ago
Reply to  ajc1970

No. The best data comes from the KKK.

JeffD
JeffD
2 months ago

Next year, unsubsidized household ACA premium levels will exceed rent annually, I believe nationwide. If anyone knows that’s not true for their state, please let us know.

I thought ACA was finally going to make healthcare affordable, when in fact, it has driven health insurance premiums sky high.

Jojo
Jojo
2 months ago
Reply to  JeffD

You’ll just have to return to the old days when you call a witch doctor if you are sick!

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  JeffD

The original plan proposed by Obama had a public option for insurance, developed by the federal government. The idea was that the federal insurance option would negotiate prices with hospitals and other providers, with those prices based on best operational and financial practices. This set of prices would create a low price tier that private insurers would have to compete with, keeping prices affordable. But this was stripped from the bill by more conservative democratic senators who took significant “campaign contributions” from the insurance cartels. So the ACA became the “pay whatever the insurance companies and hospitals want to charge” care act.

Flingel Bunt
Flingel Bunt
2 months ago
Reply to  Jon

We have seen how government healthcare works. It is called the VA. So, I call bull$hit.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  Flingel Bunt

Veterans who actually use the VA rate it much higher than the average American rates their own experiences with their insurance.

Flingel Bunt
Flingel Bunt
2 months ago
Reply to  JeffD

ACA would never make healthcare affordable for the simple reasons below.
It increased demand.
Supply was unchanged.
There was no INNOVATION, and less competition.
It was not insurance, since risk was never a factor

HubrisEveryWhereOnline
HubrisEveryWhereOnline
2 months ago
Reply to  Flingel Bunt

You don’t seem to understand the US health insurance market very well.

Half the US population is covered by healthcare insurance provided by their employer (and has been this way for decades). Risk is not a factor there the vast majority of time. Get employed, get healthcare coverage premiums as an average of the entire workforce.

If you want risk-based insurance, go out and buy private car insurance. It’s not the way it works with healthcare insurance.

BenW
BenW
2 months ago

MISH, WHEN ARE WE GOING TO GET THE ARTIC FROST ANALYSIS?

Sentient
Sentient
2 months ago
Reply to  BenW

Democrats and their lawfare buddies will never be convicted of anything. They get 93% of the vote in DC and 80% in Manhattan (SDNY). Don’t waste your energy thinking about it. Maybe if a case were brought in Oklahoma or something …

BenW
BenW
2 months ago

From Just The News:

Obamacare’s inconvenient truths exposed during shutdown | Just The News

Insurance companies’ profits right now are up something like 240+ percent. There’s something morally wrong with that. Not only is it shamefully wrong, but morally wrong. Millions of these so-called ghost enrollees, people who are technically eligible, but are unaware of it, never use these subsidies. The insurers pocket the difference

ad hominem
ad hominem
2 months ago

We have the Goodfellas Paul Sorvino healthcare system:
“Fuck you, pay me.”

Last edited 2 months ago by ad hominem
ad hominem
ad hominem
2 months ago

Meanwhile, in another part of the world:

#######

China retains crown in scientific papers, widens lead over U.S. Japan, outstripped by Iran, falls to 13th place in most-cited studies.

Smallest, lightest artificial heart working fine in three children with heart failure: 45 gm. and 29 mm. diameter, suitable for children weighing 10 to 30 kg.

Rick
Rick
2 months ago
Reply to  ad hominem

If they are so smart, then they don’t need to use our university system and labs.

Sentient
Sentient
2 months ago
Reply to  Rick

Maybe theirs are full.

ad hominem
ad hominem
2 months ago
Reply to  Rick

Times are changing there too.

Jojo
Jojo
2 months ago
Reply to  ad hominem

China has a lot more people. And how many of those paper publishers were educated in the USA?

ad hominem
ad hominem
2 months ago
Reply to  Jojo

It’s question time! Here are a couple more questions:

How many “USA” papers were written by Asians, people forced economically to leave Asia when Euro-Yank empires destroyed their countries? Is “brain drain” a kind of resource theft too?

Even the tiny percentage of Chinese who come study in USA for masters and PhD’s got their excellent K-12 start in China. Trick question: what’s more important in a skyscraper: the bottom half or the half? 😉

JCH1952
JCH1952
2 months ago
Reply to  Jojo

Many that I have followed since they were post grads started here, and are now working in China. Their university system has become world class, so Chinese students do not have to leave to get 1st-class educations. Western Universities need Asian students.

Last edited 2 months ago by JCH1952
Flingel Bunt
Flingel Bunt
2 months ago
Reply to  ad hominem

How much do you know about publishing research papers? It is rife with fraud, and has been for some time.

ad hominem
ad hominem
2 months ago

FREE LUIGI

Green Mountain
Green Mountain
2 months ago

And Mike Johnson keeps the House closed. I would love to have this job. When the going gets rough stay home. Unfortunately his CR runs out later this month so someday he is going to have pass real budget bills. That is what Congress is supposed to except under this leader. But of course he can’t because he needs to protect our leader from the Epstein files. Leadership????

FDR
FDR
2 months ago
Reply to  Green Mountain

MAGA Mike is a waste of human skin. Unfortunately, there are way too many in the halls of Congress, the Judiciary and the Executive Branches.

If and when the majority of the working, middle and professional classes ostracize and purges themselves from the outsized influence vis-a-vis the reactionary Right wing wannabe fascists, oligopolies, oligarchs and corporatists, then the vast majority of the people will be better off economically, politically and socially.

YP_Yooper
YP_Yooper
2 months ago

This is truly something that needs to stop.
My mother, 80 yrs, had OUTPATIENT heart surgery here in Pitt, and they have a $900,000 bill.
All line items had the expenses zeroed out, and the hospital refuses a line item bill.
Final bill? $2,000???

I had total hip replacement. $90,000 billed

I saw the damned lady who gave me a single diet coke in outpatient charged me for $85?!?!?

Owe $7500???

WTF????

Jojo
Jojo
2 months ago
Reply to  YP_Yooper

It will never stop until the system is torn down. There are too many hands profiting from the way health insurance/care runs in the USA, which is exactly why it is structured in the manner that it is.

And the only way the system is torn down replaced won’t happen because Congress suddenly develops religion. It will be because something radically different happens, which IMO, is an AI taking over with a robot workforce and military.

Perhaps this will become a Terminator future. Or perhaps not.

ad hominem
ad hominem
2 months ago
Reply to  YP_Yooper

OMG

EVERYBODY SHOULD VOTE WITH YOUR FUCKING FEET.

There’s no fixing this amount of fuckery.

Mike T
Mike T
2 months ago
Reply to  YP_Yooper

Where in the peninsula, yah?

abcd
abcd
2 months ago

If anyone is not happy about inflation, and wants to do something about it, they have a choice in the next election to stop voting for the Republicans and Democrats who endlessly spend money the country doesn’t have, which fuels inflation, and vote Libertarian, the only choice on the ballot claiming to support a balanced budget, however we would only know by their actions if they were elected if they were faithful and trustworthy, so people would need to pay attention and hold their officials accountable through their votes. People had this choice in previous elections also, but still voted for the deficit spenders.

Jon
Jon
2 months ago
Reply to  abcd

Federal spending is not the primary cause of inflation. It is cartel monopoly pricing power. China runs a bigger deficit than the US and has deflation. That’s because China believes in competitive capitalism instead of the libertarian free market.

Ghost poster
Ghost poster
2 months ago
Reply to  Jon

Inflation was high a few years ago and corporations had a great excuse.
Their input costs had gone up, they had to increase prices.
Earning season rolls up and we might think earnings would be lower.
Instead they were record breaking.
Remember that we shouldn’t have the government price fixing?
There’s price fixing alright…

abcd
abcd
2 months ago
Reply to  Jon

I’m no expert but I’m pretty doubtful that overspending and money printing isn’t the main cause. So why not try and balance the budget and start cutting debt and see how prices go?, but the Uniparty is not getting any pressure from the voters to be fiscally responsible and either way, it is unethical and immoral of them to be robbing future generations by saddling them with enormous debt, so they need to be voted out. And if it is cartel monopoly pricing power, well, the Uniparty Democrats and Republicans don’t do anything about that either, so might as well give someone else a shot.

Rex River
Rex River
2 months ago

The number one items that most people buy with their snap card is Junk food…
Oh my, no more soda pop, chips, bottled water
And candy… What are the poor people going to do now, Riot? Most likely….
If you look at most people on TV complaining about not getting their food stamps,
Most of them are grossly overweight.

Michael Engel
Michael Engel
2 months ago
Reply to  Rex River

Obama females commando: Fuhrer Trump our children are hungry. Fuhrer Trump we are dying. SNAP is more important than higher Obamacare insurance rates. SNAP is a lever, like tariffs. For the dems it’s all about Obamacare. John McCane kept it alive. Isn’t viable. It was never viable. Trump will renew SNAP but Obamacare will deflate.

Last edited 2 months ago by Michael Engel
Michael Engel
Michael Engel
2 months ago
Reply to  Michael Engel

Trump will renew SNAP, but will eliminate soft drinks and snacks. The poor and shingle mums will have to suffer for a while, before claiming victory over TACO.

InMyRoom
InMyRoom
2 months ago
Reply to  Michael Engel

Most people who receive SNAP work. Many are elderly. Some are in the military or vets. Some are disabled.

FDR
FDR
2 months ago
Reply to  Rex River

Links to support your assertions?

Obesity is a national problem thx to the oligarchic capture of the DOA, the USDA, medical schools, Big Pharma, and Big Ag.

Phil in CT
Phil in CT
2 months ago
Reply to  FDR

There will be no links as his claim is false.

dtj
dtj
2 months ago

Almost nobody will escape big price hikes for health insurance next year.

If you’re facing an increase of “only” 10%, consider yourself a lucky duck and go buy a lottery ticket.

I just saw a self employed person on reddit who has never gotten an ACA subsidy yet still has a 40% increase next year to keep the same Blue Cross coverage.

Lots of people are going to choose lower cost plans or drop coverage altogether. The thing is, the US healthcare system depends on money flowing in. If the flow stops, the health care system gets worse. Less access. Poorer quality.

Medicaid cuts are going to take a huge income stream away from the US healthcare system, so it will have a negative effect system-wide, even for those with insurance.

MPO45v2
MPO45v2
2 months ago
Reply to  dtj

“Almost nobody will escape big price hikes for health insurance next year.”

Well those of us that have an exit strategy won’t have to pay the insurance cartels. We’ll take our savings and invest it to get richer and richer while lowering our costs across the board……

Is it starting to make sense now? Everyone must choose their poison carefully.

dtj
dtj
2 months ago
Reply to  MPO45v2

If you get citizenship overseas, then you’ll pay taxes in whatever country you reside in, so even if they have “free” healthcare, it isn’t really free.

I’m a dual EU-US citizen, so I’ve always had the option to leave the US if I wanted to, but I’ve chosen to stay here as it’s home to me. Even if the ship is sinking, I’m comfortable being on this ship rather than a different sinking ship.

FDR
FDR
2 months ago
Reply to  dtj

But some ships are more seaworthy than others. When the US empire falls due to its reserve status EVERYONE suffers.

The .1% and 1% can leave on their leased jets but they will have to pay a hefty tax penalty to do so.

The remaining serfs and vassals can hopefully restore the constitutional republic with a more level playing field similar to post Revolutionary War US.

Jojo
Jojo
2 months ago
Reply to  dtj

If someone relocates to another country but still maintains their US citizenship, then they are still required to pay taxes on all earnings/income, whether they occur in the US or in a foreign country.

Edv
Edv
2 months ago
Reply to  Jojo

Yes. The USA and Eritrea are the only 2 countries that treat their people this way.

If Z. Mandami gets his way the people of New York will get the same treatment.

Now there is motivation to exit New York.

FDR
FDR
2 months ago
Reply to  Edv

New York will vote for Mandami because of the deterioration of NYC by mainstream neoliberals, bribery, and outright corruption by the likes of Koch, Dinkins, broken windows Giuliani, corporatist and plutocrat Bloomberg, naive and politically weak de Blasio, and corrupt Eric Adams.

So, why not a socialist, whatever that terms means anymore. Mandami will not nationalize the means of production in NYC. The private sector will still be there. The rich will have to pay more to live there. There will be more regulation and reform. Will it work? TBD.

The current and past leadership hasn’t so the people will speak and the oligarchs will moan and groan that they can’t bribe city hall anymore to get there way most of the time.

If Mandami can restore NYC to a city that is affordable and livable for the vast majority of workers, the middle class and upper middle class, why not. If he doesn’t improve NYC and governs responsibly for the vast majority of New Yorkers, he will be voted out.

Rick
Rick
2 months ago
Reply to  FDR

NYC is the greatest city in the world, hands down and this is coming from a loyal Boston fan.
It will never be “affordable”.
Anyone who chooses to live there believing it will someday be “affordable” is insane.
There are many other places that can be defined as affordable and it’s a free country there is always the option to move.
The best that can be done to run NYC is to make sure it runs safely, cleanly and as efficiently as possible.
When Mamdani is elected the voters will get the chaos they deserve.

Last edited 2 months ago by Rick
dtj
dtj
2 months ago
Reply to  Rick

U.S. News and World Report ranked NYC as the 3rd best place to retire in the US for 2025. That ranking is completely unhinged from reality as taxes, housing and cost of living are the most expensive in the US there.

https://realestate.usnews.com/places/rankings/best-places-to-retire

Jojo
Jojo
2 months ago
Reply to  dtj

If you can afford it, there is a lot to do for older, “sophisticated” people in NYC including museums, Broadway shows, art galleries, places to eat, clubs, live music, shopping, fashion, people watching and so much more.

I was actually born in NYC but grew up across the river in NJ. From the late 1970’s through early 1990’s until I relocated to CA, I spent a lot of time hanging out in NYC. So much life there. It is an amazing city!

FDR
FDR
2 months ago
Reply to  Rick

The cost of living in NYC is ridiculously high due to lack of affordable housing for those that work there. It is the landlord or rentier class causing this and a to a lesser extent the gentrification.

It won’t make the landed aristocracy happy but gouging and inflated housing costs due to lack of supply that they covet and want can be resolved.

The first step would be to increase fines on housing violations that haven’t been paid for too long and once paid can’t be passed down to the renters. There are currently tens of thousands of violations on the books on the top 20 list of the worst landlords. If they continue to not pay, then interest is charged for the balances, additional courts are set up and funded by the negligent landlords to expedite their delaying tactics and once found guilt pay, civil and criminal penalties are ensued up to and including forfeiture of property for unsafe, unhealthy lodgings.

Eminent domain for the purpose building multi-unit housing through bond sales underwritten by Wall Street banksters at low market rates and they will partner with the city and funded through a tax on algo trading, derivatives, etc. as well as a surtax on the top 1% on wealth, income and property tax.

The banksters and top 1% have unduly benefited from the faux wealth created by the Federal Reserve manipulation of QE, repo, reverse repo, and extend and pretend lending policies so it is just that they recompense the classes that were penalized by the owners of the FED, namely the Wall Street pariahs, their wealth management clients living in NYC, private equity holding company executives also living in NYC, etc.

There are more remedies but too many fro write about in this forum.

Jojo
Jojo
2 months ago
Reply to  FDR

It’s never so black and white. There will be lots of unanticipated consequences along the way that will affect people on all sides of the economic spectrum!

FDR
FDR
2 months ago
Reply to  Jojo

Yes, there is always gray. There needs to be rebalancing of the economy. This is the point of Democratic -Socialism. Neither of two main duopolies at this time are talking about it that are in party leadership positions.

Michael Engel
Michael Engel
2 months ago
Reply to  MPO45v2

u are talking about higher insurance rates. shingle mums are addicted to junk food and soft drinks. they will do whatever to get their fix.

Last edited 2 months ago by Michael Engel
Anon1970
Anon1970
2 months ago
Reply to  Michael Engel

Single, not shingle. Shingles is actually a disease.

dtj
dtj
2 months ago
Reply to  Anon1970

Not a misspelling. He’s British. “Single moms love french fries” would be spelled in Britain as “Shingle mums love chips”.

Avery2
Avery2
2 months ago
Reply to  Michael Engel

They can make shingles out of some of the junk food.

BenW
BenW
2 months ago

Healthcare costs way too much. I’ve read where ACA was never designed to really save money. If true, it would be nice to read a short article that explains what the real problems are withing the plan that have nothing to do with healthcare providers driving up costs through all sorts of means.

Here are my points about Mish’s article:

#1 – Please explain how the Dems are going to win the blame game? The Dems are the ones who approved the law sunsetting the subsidies. The Dems approved 13 CRs under Biden. The Dems wanted to add $1.5T in extra spending, including funding for some illegal / legal immigrants to get Medicaid.

#2 – What a joke to act like resumption of nuclear testing is going to have a big effect on the budget. Whatever we spend on that boondoggle if it even materializes will pale in comparison to what these “enhanced” ACA subsidies are going to costs taxpayers.

#3 – Yes it was about funding for illegals. If you haven’t noticed, the Trump administration is doing everything they can cut all spending on illegals.

#4 – I’m not completely up to speed on the SNAP explanation you provide, but it seems reasonable for Trump to try to apply some leverage to end the shutdown. And was anyone surprised by the last-minute judicial order to keep paying SNAP? Hell no. Now, let’s see what happens or where they find the money to do so.

abcd
abcd
2 months ago
Reply to  BenW

If The Trump admin were doing everything they can to stop spending on illegal immigrants, why are they not calling for making e-verify mandatory? The main reason those people are coming here is because they can get hired to work.

Avery2
Avery2
2 months ago
Reply to  Mike Shedlock

Corporate America

BenW
BenW
2 months ago
Reply to  Mike Shedlock

Everyone would complain.

BenW
BenW
2 months ago
Reply to  abcd

BECAUSE IT HAS ZERO CHANCE OF PASSING.

The Senate could kill the filibuster, and it would still have zero chance of passing.

abcd
abcd
2 months ago
Reply to  BenW

Republicans have the majority. Why does Trump criticize Massie for trying to rein in spending but he doesnt criticize whichever republicans wouldnt support mandatory e-verify. Because he’s fine with robbing future generations with his debt and deficit spending and he’s fine with most of the illegal immigrants despite all his pandering rhetoric saying he’s stopping an invasion or whatever.

Jackula
Jackula
2 months ago

God forbid we actually discuss making big pharma and big healthcare providers including insurers get more competitive on pricing

Avery2
Avery2
2 months ago
Reply to  Jackula

They are violating the same antitrust laws that the original Standard Oil did 100+ years ago. Did Bimbo Bondi come across that in her high school US History class?

Winston
Winston
2 months ago
Reply to  Avery2

UniParty politics in DC – a clown shown for the mostly clueless which includes most of the voting population:

If EITHER Party CARED About Health Care Cost….
2025-10-28 by Karl Denninger

https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=254301

The Bill To Permanently Fix Health Care For All
2017-03-30 by Karl Denninger

https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=231949

Hey, did you hear about the new, “free” child care in New Mexico. NO ONE pays for it!!!! And how about that student loan debt “forgiveness”?! NO ONE pays for that either! /sarc The fact that the lying pols can get away with that shows why our country is doomed.

FDR
FDR
2 months ago

The ten year budget is a total canard. Each new Congress can change anything from the prior Congresses if there is the political will and it is within the Congress’ purview per Article I and the Constitution. The Big Ugly Bill now a law can be rewritten. So can Medicaid, Medicare, the ACA, Social Security the defense budget, etc..

Would Trump veto it? Most likely. However, if he is soundly defeated in the midterms and the remaining senators and house members from the Grand Old Plutocrats that barely held onto their seats in ‘26 may then override the veto due to pressure from their constituents in red and purple districts to do so.

Wide swaths of an increasing divided MAGA did not vote for Trump to gut their healthcare and other subsidies that they were receiving prior to this Congress taking a meat axe to the working poor and working class.

As for Biden and his budget he is no longer president and the oligarchs from the Democratic Party dumped him from running in’24.

Dave Smith
Dave Smith
2 months ago

I read an article yesterday that Trump Administration wants to revalue US gold reserves to as much as $10,000 or $20,000 for the purpose of buying bitcoin and paying down the debt. Sounds good on paper but it is a gimmick that will not work, but it might postpone the coming disaster making it worse when it does arrive.

The process is to basically have the treasury secretary revalue gold to $20,000/ounce, the federal reserve surrenders its gold as certificates to Treasury at $11 billion total Treasury sells the gold certificates back to the Fed, no services or goods exchanged, but treasury gets a cash windfall, a total scam on the US public who will pay for it via inflation, basically, a tax without representation.

This is not some pipe dream. It is part of legislation being drafted tentatively titled “The Bitcoin Act” So how is this different from what FDR did during the great depression? FDR confiscated the gold from citizens then revalued the gold once in government possession therefore it could be resold for money actually earned at the higher price. The proposed is a paper shuffle, the only thing changing is the transfer of unearned money, QE with a little song and dance using gold certificates, not real gold.

Here is a copy of the pertinent text:

“(c) Federal reserve system gold certificates

Not later than 180 days after the date of enactment of this Act, the Federal reserve banks shall tender all outstanding gold certificates in their custody to the Secretary. Not later than 90 days after the tender of the last such certificate, the Secretary shall issue new gold certificates to the Federal reserve banks that reflect the fair market value price of the gold held against such certificates by the Treasury, as of the date specified by the Secretary on each new gold certificate. Upon issue by the Secretary, each Federal reserve bank that receives a new gold certificate shall remit the difference in cash value between the old and new gold certificates to the Secretary for deposit in the general fund within 90 days.
(d)
Use of gold certificate remittances
(1)
In general
Funds remitted to the Secretary under subsection (c) shall be allocated as follows:
(A)
An amount necessary to fund the Bitcoin Purchase Program, as established in section 5, shall be reserved for that purpose, up to the full amount required to purchase 1,000,000 Bitcoins under the program.
(B)
Any funds in excess of the amount necessary to fully fund the Bitcoin Purchase Program shall be deposited in the general fund of the Treasury to reduce the public debt.”

A link to the full text can be found here:

https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/119/s954

If this passes, my guess there will be some kind of follow up tax to steal the windfall profit from holders of gold a crypto currency.

Tony Frank
Tony Frank
2 months ago
Reply to  Dave Smith

There is absolutely no way to estimate to the extent our deranged dictator-in-chief will do or go, except if it puts money into his pockets or that of his family/billionaire friends. Biggest disappointment in the history of this country.

abcd
abcd
2 months ago
Reply to  Dave Smith

That sounds ridiculous. To have gold at a fair market value 5x more than it is now would require 5x more dollars in the world, so inflation on everything would go up 500% in a short time, which would cause pandemonium, so it couldn’t happen.

FDR
FDR
2 months ago
Reply to  Dave Smith

The difference between FDR’s confiscation of gold, then repricing it was due to the Great Depression’s deflation, lack of liquidity in markets and to bailout the banking system that was seriously broken.

Trump’s repricing of gold legislation is spurious and deceitful. It is the grifter’s way of reducing the debt and the annual deficit that some on the inside will profit, others in the cult will be conned, and some will call it what it is, namely BS by the Liar – In- Chief but everyone will eventually have to pay for Trump’s folly, lack of fiscal and monetary probity and acumen.

Jojo
Jojo
2 months ago

My Medigap Plan N increased by 16% for 2026. Meanwhile, per Perplexity.ai:

The Medicare Part B premium is projected to increase by $21.50 in 2026, rising from $185 in 2025 to about $206.50 per month. This represents an increase of approximately 11.6%, which is the largest jump in several years. Additionally, the Part B deductible is expected to rise from $257 in 2025 to $288 in 2026. These are projections based on the Medicare Trustees Report, with the final figures to be confirmed by CMS in the fall of 2025.

hmk
hmk
2 months ago

Again the solution is single payer. I wonder if any of the policy price inflation will show up in the economic politburo cpi statistics

Last edited 2 months ago by hmk
QTPie
QTPie
2 months ago
Reply to  hmk

Single payer is not necessarily the solution. There are countries out there without single payer health systems but with other means of controlling costs while providing a good level of healthcare (France, the Netherlands, and Germany for example do not have single payer systems).

What is common to all developed nations except the US are: 1. Universal coverage (which by definition means compulsory coverage), and 2. The lack of a link between employers and health insurance coverage. I mean, you don’t get your car insurance from your employer for example, so why should your health insurance be dependent and limited to the choices they make? Companies should concentrate on being the best at making widgets, not dealing with something that has nothing to do with their business. Nowhere else in the world this silly link exists. In the US it started as an accident of history… an unexpected result of government wage controls during WWII. In other words, in the US we ended up with a badly-designed ad-hoc health system. Other countries had a much more deliberate public policy process that ensured a better health funding and coverage model got implemented there.

Last edited 2 months ago by QTPie
hmk
hmk
2 months ago
Reply to  QTPie

They really need someone to analyze what works and institute it here with optimized policies. Look at the best systems and construct something that will eliminate the clusterfuck of a system we have. Health insurance companies are engaged in legalized extortion. They take in money an don’t pay claims.

QTPie
QTPie
2 months ago
Reply to  hmk

Exactly! Whenever the subject of reforming the health care system in the United States comes up, there are invariably those people who will immediately do nothing but point out the deficiencies in the Canadian system or the British NHS… completely ignoring the fact that they are many other universal health coverage models out there to study and learn from.

Last edited 2 months ago by QTPie
FDR
FDR
2 months ago
Reply to  QTPie

The Canadian system is very popular among Canadians per opinion polls. In discussions with Canadians, they think Americans are stupid for putting up for expensive healthcare and the outcomes are the worst of any advanced country.

The Brits have a functioning nationalized healthcare system but the Tories and the neoliberal Labor Party have been slowly privatizing it with inferior service.

I am not aware of any healthcare system for advanced countries that are not suffering from doctor shortages and pent up demand due to aging Boomers.

Last edited 2 months ago by FDR
Michael Engel
Michael Engel
2 months ago

If Obama vs Trump chaos cont for several months Xi might invade Taiwan.

Avery2
Avery2
2 months ago
Reply to  Michael Engel

Then what?

Sentient
Sentient
2 months ago
Reply to  Avery2

Then we stop pretending Taiwan is a country.

Gwp
Gwp
2 months ago
Reply to  Michael Engel

China will be patient. It will not attack Taiwan unless the US tries to occupy it.

Flavia
Flavia
2 months ago

The parties have always had disagreements.
Americans mostly understood that the ACA extension was under debate.
But the Repubs should never have let the SNAP issue reach the light of day. They should have quietly funded it, as they did the WIC earlier.

Jojo
Jojo
2 months ago
Reply to  Flavia

NO! 42 million on government food subsidies is criminal. Also, it is really annoying to watch the parade of new cars driving into food handout lines.

People who received welfare or SNAP benefits should have to submit to an implant that stops them from getting pregnant while they collect these benefits. If they have the implant taken out on their own and become pregnant, then they lose all government benefits forever.

Qualifying for government benefits needs to be made harder and for shorter periods of time.

FDR
FDR
2 months ago
Reply to  Jojo

The Black welfare queen using food stamps to buy groceries, then drive away in her white Cadillac as pontificated during St. Reagan stump speeches still lives.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gjeD5exDrDQ

Avery2
Avery2
2 months ago
Reply to  FDR

A Buick Park Avenue all dolled up was the thing back in those days.

Jojo
Jojo
2 months ago
Reply to  FDR

Some evidence for your consideration:

Why Are 42 Million Americans Relying On SNAP Benefits?

Sunday, Nov 02, 2025 – 09:50 AM

Amid the furious debate over the government shutdown and the incoming freeze of SNAP food benefits, one important factor is often overlooked – Why are 42 million Americans, a number larger than the entire population of Canada, dependent on government subsidized groceries? Isn’t this a time bomb waiting to explode regardless of a federal shutdown?  

There have been a few temporary food stamp programs from the Great Depression through the 1950s, but they were limited in scale and funding was minimal. It wasn’t until LBJ’s “Great Society” project in 1964 that food stamps slowly became a permanent mainstay of American life. By 1969, food benefits were in full swing, yet, only 1.4% of the population used them. Strict eligibility requirements kept the participation rate down until 1977.  

https://www.zerohedge.com/economics/why-are-42-million-americans-relying-snap-benefits

FDR
FDR
2 months ago
Reply to  Jojo

First, a little history JFK following Aristotle’s position on nutrition first advocated for a food subsistence program beginning in primary schools to increase protein into the diet of poor and malnourished children to facilitate brain development. He also proposed the precursor of the food stamp program due to high poverty rates in the Appalachians, rural South and inner cities.

LBJ after Kennedy’s assassination felt obligated to continue his legislative agenda. After LBJ won in a landslide and had a real mandate for the war on poverty, civil and voting rights he successfully lobbied Congress to pass The Great Society legislation – something he had long thought needed to be done due to his childhood in the Texas hill country, his teaching impoverished Mexican poor and working class children, etc.

In getting this legislation passed the wily politician that LBJ was knew there would be Goldwater, George Wallace , Strom Thurmond, etc., that would attempt to block legislation or implementation so he in turn had the American farmers and food processors see the benefits of feeding America’s poor. They in turn suggested to their legislators the righteousness of feeding America’s poor and malnourished and at the same time increase sales. This is how legislation is passed.

I will not argue that there isn’t fraud in government spending as I won’t argue that the current Congress doesn’t pass any legislation without someone from the supply side that hasn’t bribed Congress to get their welfare passed. I will argue, however, that I’ll see your SNAP fraud among recipients and raise with Merchants of Death fraud through Pentagon spending, health provider fraud through HHS spending including Senator Rick Scott from Florida in a previous incarnation as a medical supplier to the government , was caught but never went to jail. I’ll also add the fraud by Big Ag, Big Oil, Big Pharma, Big Tech, etc.via bribery to get their welfare subsidies.

How many women are out there that have eight children from different fathers? This argument has been used to cite extreme examples to throw the baby out with the bath water.It is for the gullible, that element of society that blame the poor because they are shiftless and lazy, or a different race, creed or religion to support their preconceived beliefs about their fellow beings that they are are naturally lacking in moral and cardinal virtues. But the primary purpose has always been and is time tested by most of the economic elites and their kleptocratic lackeys in government and the reactionary Right to divide and conquer for the purpose of retaining their status lest the poor, the working and middle as well as the professional classes not see the forest for the trees.

Have you and those of your ilk also considered that in a nation that has extreme wealth and income inequality that surpasses the Gilded Age and the 1920s with the associated increase of a disappearing middle class, approximately 50% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck that poverty and malnourishment would also increase, hence an increase in SNAP.

  • To wit: Total population: 38 million people (or 11.6%) lived at or below the poverty level in 2021.
  • Poverty rate by ethnicity: In 2021, the poverty rate for all Hispanics was 18%, while U.S.-born Hispanics had a rate of 18% and foreign-born Hispanics had a rate of 17%.
  • Older adults: In a June 2025 Pew report, it was reported that an average of 16.5% of older residents in 18 studied cities lived below the poverty level.
  • Other data points:
  • Other analyses using 2020 and 2022 data found slightly different numbers, with the official poverty rate at 11.5% in 2022 and 11.4% in 2020.
  • In 2020, the total number of people in poverty was 37.2 million. 

For your consideration, wasn’t the Nazi saluting Muskrat and his DOGE fraudsters with the help of the Grifter-In-Chief and wannabe fascist the Donald supposed to resolve government fraud and abuse?

Instead they hovered up all of our data illegally, collated it for their own greed then willingly surrendered it to Big Tech, Palantir, etc., to be used to our detriment.

Jojo
Jojo
2 months ago
Reply to  FDR

A more succinct history.

Why Are 42 Million Americans Relying On SNAP Benefits?

Sunday, Nov 02, 2025 – 09:50 AM

Amid the furious debate over the government shutdown and the incoming freeze of SNAP food benefits, one important factor is often overlooked – Why are 42 million Americans, a number larger than the entire population of Canada, dependent on government subsidized groceries? Isn’t this a time bomb waiting to explode regardless of a federal shutdown?  

There have been a few temporary food stamp programs from the Great Depression through the 1950s, but they were limited in scale and funding was minimal. It wasn’t until LBJ’s “Great Society” project in 1964 that food stamps slowly became a permanent mainstay of American life. By 1969, food benefits were in full swing, yet, only 1.4% of the population used them. Strict eligibility requirements kept the participation rate down until 1977.  

Candidates had to have a gross income below the poverty line. Their liquid assets (including vehicles) had to have limited value. They had to put some of their own money into a portion of the stamps in order to get the “bonus” stamps. Able bodied adults without children were largely excluded. College students and immigrants were barred from the program. Able bodied adults had to work or be in training. Monthly income and expense verification was required. Food stamps were paper, creating a “shame factor”. Just because someone was under the poverty line did not mean they could qualify.

Most of these barriers have been absent from SNAP in the past few decades, which is why the percentage of users spiked from 1.4% to as high as 15% of the population. Today, the rate stands at 12.5%, which is still extraordinarily high. Approximately 19 million SNAP users have been on the program for longer than a year, and over 80% of people on the program are able bodied and below retirement age.

In other words, the program has become a crutch for a vast number of people who do not need it.

https://www.zerohedge.com/economics/why-are-42-million-americans-relying-snap-benefits

Last edited 2 months ago by Jojo
FDR
FDR
2 months ago
Reply to  Jojo

You just repeated your earlier comment that I I refuted it by adding historical context how and why it started, acknowledging there is some fraud but nothing compared to the supply side contractors on the government tit and documenting that more and more citizens are slipping through the cracks and entering poverty, malnourishment, etc.

Bring something new or dispute what wrote.

Jojo
Jojo
2 months ago
Reply to  FDR

And another good article:

Shutdown exposes America’s food stamps folly

By Victor Joecks | Las Vegas Review-Journal

October 30, 2025 – 9:01 pm

 

Low-income Americans have higher rates of obesity than rich Americans. That alone is reason to rethink food stamps.

More than 41 million people currently receive food stamps, now known as SNAP. In Nevada, the number is almost 500,000 people. That’s around 12 percent of the population and 15 percent of Nevadans.

https://www.reviewjournal.com/opinion/opinion-columns/victor-joecks/victor-joecks-shutdown-exposes-americas-food-stamps-folly-3530629/

FDR
FDR
2 months ago
Reply to  Jojo

Your argument makes my case in my first retort how LBJ was able to get some farm state legislators to vote for food stamps, namely increase sales to the poor and working classes through government purchases.

The difference today, however, is Big Ag crops and processing techniques are qualitatively less healthy than Europe today or the US in the 60s.. Americans as a whole are more obese as a result so why wouldn’t the poor or those that can barely keep up buy cheaper processed foods to stretch their budget , ergo gain even more weight?

See RFK Jr., repeated rants documented on his website Children’s Health Defense and his MAHA rant as secretary of HHS about the quality of the American diet.

The rise in soda purchases were due to a “reform” implemented when food stamps were “dropped” and replaced by EBT.

The first iteration of food stamps allocated food and drink by categories and limited certain categories by volume or not at all per month. Today, that is not the case. EBT card users can buy almost anything they want in a grocery store at whatever volume.

One of the reasons for the reform was to reduce waste, fraud and abuse.

To use the rich as less obese than those on SNAP is patently obvious why this is the case. The former have their servants to buy organic and healthier foods or have it ordered online and delivered to one of their McMansions whereas the latter can’t.

As for Nevada, it is one of the poorest states in the Union. It is also one of the least educated and one of the least healthy in the nation. It also has one of the highest Medicaid enrollees per capita in the Union. The author of the Las Vegas Journal article further makes my case that if poverty goes up, the middle class shrinks, more and more people fall through the cracks due to wealth and income inequality so why wouldn’t SNAP enrollees also go up?

Michael Engel
Michael Engel
2 months ago

A perfect storm to start George Floyd #2. Obama, Hakeem and Chuck will break this country apart. The chaos might not end in Dec 31 2025. The dems will pour millions to the streets. It will be violent. It will be a bloody. Trump is ready for them. He will rule with an iron fist.

sNarayana
sNarayana
2 months ago
Reply to  Michael Engel

Fuhrer Trump!

Rogerroger
Rogerroger
2 months ago

Got me wondering. My ins is through work i dont pay enough attention. Prob 80 percent is “paid for” by my employer. Really but not really. Its prob 9 grand a year in reality but since only about 2000 out of my check.
Ive used the aca before. I liked it because if did well i paid. If times were tough i got a break. The best thing i liked was i felt like i had someone watching out for my cost who was not making money off me. Policy wise.
Snap is similar to infrastructure projects and government jobs etc. sure its tax dollars but as money is spent it is taxes and goes back to the government. So money should get recycled back to the government.

Sentient
Sentient
2 months ago
Reply to  Rogerroger

It’s probably more than $9,000. Maybe $11k for employee alone. Employee + spouse is usually really about $20k (true cost). Family coverage close to $30k/year – for a shitty plan with a high deductible. People have no idea how outrageous it is, since their employer ostensibly pays it.

Irondoor
Irondoor
2 months ago

Taxes and/or deficits will go up to feed, house and medicate those who won’t or can’t.

MPO45v2
MPO45v2
2 months ago

“Is the shutdown about funding for illegal aliens?”

Wait a minute, I thought Trump was deporting millions of people and all the illegals? If so then why aren’t all the ills attirubted to the immigrants gone now? high healthcare costs, high insurance cost, high housing costs, high food costs, etc.

But regardless there are 40 million people on SNAP (remember illegals have been kicked out), 76 million people on social security and presumably medicare (remember illegals have been kicked out). And as bad as that is that’s not the worse part, the worse part is a declining population and virtually no population growth. All population growth was coming from immigrants which are now barred from the US seemingly.  The US population continues to age out.

The logical conclusion to all of this is an inflationary spiral and a collapse of most if not all of these social programs. It’s not a question of if but when and 2030 seems about right.  If you put it all together there is only one question left.

Got exit strategy?

Last edited 2 months ago by MPO45v2
Michael Engel
Michael Engel
2 months ago
Reply to  MPO45v2

15/20 millions illegal in 2 millions out. Trump might recruit the Mexican cartel against Antifa and BLM. Chicago was always a slaughterhouse.

Avery2
Avery2
2 months ago
Reply to  Michael Engel

The illegals have clustered around the burbs surrounding O’Hare since St. Ronnie winked 40 years ago. The Chicago west and south sides are home-grown and have nothing to do with that.

MPO45v2
MPO45v2
2 months ago
Reply to  Michael Engel

So 2 million were deported and inflation went up year over year. Lol. Does that mean inflation would have been up really really high if no one was deported?

Let’s see how inflation does in 2026.

Jojo
Jojo
2 months ago
Reply to  MPO45v2

The exit strategy is the more pain, the better, as this will help hasten the day when there isn’t any alternative other than to let an AI take over and let its robot workers do most work. This will make all food, housing and services FREE.

MPO45v2
MPO45v2
2 months ago
Reply to  Jojo

Keep dreaming. I am willing to bet you will be long gone before that comes to fruition.

Gwp
Gwp
2 months ago
Reply to  MPO45v2

All Euro populations are declining. More wealth, more life options, less child mortality. Don’t need so many kids . And then when people think hmmm maybe we should have more kids…asset inflation means kids are living at home, can’t afford their own families unless they move to places with no good jobs, no schools, no hospitals.

The worlds economy has been based on constant expansion. Taking lands from someone else and exploiting it. But land, minerals, energy, water are limited. The future is relative economic decline, unless nations co-operate to innovate and moderate expectations.

So yea.. we are fkd. Constant war most likely.

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