The impeachment farce should have ended long ago. Instead, it lingers on and on and on.
The following video shows the alleged impeachment star witness hammered by Rep. Jim Jordan.
Here’s the short version of the exchange.
Star Witness Testimony
Jordan: You didn’t listen in on President Trump & Zelensky’s call?
Taylor: I did not.
Jordan: You’ve never talked with Chief of Staff Mulvaney?
Taylor: I never did.
Jordan: You’ve never met the President?
Taylor: That’s correct.
Jordan: And you’re their star witness.
Project Take Down Trump
Never-Ending Impeachment Process
The Democrats have managed to turn a grave process into a dully partisan one says Kimberley Strassel in Impeachment as Usual.
Democrats have already lost their impeachment battle. That’s the takeaway from Wednesday’s first public hearing. What was meant to be a moment in history turned out to be business as usual.
Democrats laid out their best case for removing Donald J. Trump from office, repeatedly using words like “extortion,” “bribery” and “abuse of power.” Mr. Trump was accused of “presidential misconduct,” of a “shakedown scheme” and of “corruption.” He was said to have broken the law and violated the Constitution. Texas Rep. Joaquin Castro analogized the president’s actions to “attempted murder.”
The media will continue to imbue this event with gravity, to report every bit of testimony as more “bombshell” evidence against Mr. Trump.
Viewers watched the Democrats’ two star witnesses acknowledge that they had no firsthand knowledge of White House decisions on the aid. They were reminded that Ukraine got the money without launching an investigation into Hunter or Joe Biden. And they watched Republican congressmen make a persuasive case that Democrats are abusing the process by blackballing White House counsel from hearings and refusing to call witnesses from the Republican list.
Democrats and the media have accomplished the disturbing feat of turning it [impeachment] into day-to-day partisan warfare. And the public is understandably treating it as just that: Washington as usual.
Impeachment Polls
538 asks Do Americans Support Impeaching Trump?
If the question is whether or not the “process” should begin, then 51.8% approve on an entirely partisan basis.
Stupidity of It All
I am not going to attempt to change your mind on whether or not Trump committed any act worthy of impeachment. Your mind is likely made up.
Instead, focus on the farce of the process.
Impeachment is impossible. There is no hard evidence of anything and most likely, even if there was, Senate Republicans won’t convict.
Witch Hunt
Russia was nothing but a political witch hunt from the beginning.
Ukraine was more promising, but the testimony of alleged star witnesses unquestionably turned to ashes even if you believe Trump is guilty as sin.
Where was it ever going? Senate Republicans were never going to convict.
That’s not a good reason to sweep things under the rug, but had it not been for a silly Russia investigation, Ukraine would not have come into play.
Dead End After Dead End
Witch hunts inevitably turn into scenarios like this: Dead end after dead end.
Meanwhile, the Democrats managed to screw up their own debate schedules and political focus for less than nothing.
If the process fails, a victimization sympathy rebound ensues. After his impeachment, Bill Clinton Had a 73% approval rating.
Please note “The process failed.”
Mike “Mish” Shedlock
Just take a look at the nervous, paranoid, guilt ridden faces of the Democrats as Pelosi slurred her way through some kind of press event today. Every single one of them knows this is their last chance saloon. Make no mistake these clowns will tear down the very fabric of democracy rather than allow their crimes to be investigated. And don’t kid yourself, there’s a fair number of Republicans in the same sinking boat.
Now, seriously, do you really think the complicit Republicans want an all in brawl in the Senate chamber, with Trump’s attorney’s listing all the quid pro quo, stolen USAID $, money laundering, in fact every single scheme these grifters have used to enrich themselves over the last 40 years? Nah, not gonna happen.
The Democrats have put in lots of effort into their final year school play. But all shows must come to an end. They’ve taken their curtain calls, played their last cards.They got a whole lot of nothin left now. It’s written all over their faces. This, their last gambit to try and get a deal from Trump. Give us a deal or we’ll impeach you! There is no deal. They are all going to prison or will mysteriously leave politics and disappear as many Republicans already have.
It’s been swell watching these utter clowns run in circles cursing the Orange Man Bad as they systematically obliterate the Democrat party from political history. Truly they are the most hilarious pack of losers ever assembled in one place.
It’s when you realize who has been laughing at the American people for 40 years putting up with this punch and judy show in place of a real democracy…
Democrat Rep. just asked today’s star witness Vindman:
DEMOCRAT: “Would it ever be U.S. policy in your experience to ask a foreign leader to open a political investigation?”
VINDMAN: “There are proper procedures in which to do that. Certainly the President is well within his right to do that.”
oops!
Trump may be the only person who benefits from this farce. I would prefer if Trump (or whomever) wins / loses based on merit, instead of Trump winning based on Schiff making an ass of himself and the democrat party.
.
Schiff is a Russian asset, sent to help Trump win
Either that, or Schiff is just an escaped mental patient like the Californians who voted for him
Whatever the case is, it is not turning out well politically for the Republicans or Trump. Every state level he injects himself into turns to stone for the Republican party this November. So far he is 0 for 3. The tide has turned as states that were Republican strongholds are even buckling at local and state level races. The traditionally Republican suburbs in the south are now being flipped. Unless Trump has a miraculous turnaround, there is more trouble ahead. A longtime conservative radio host in Colorado was fired for anti-Trump comments. This may further deteriorate Republican support to the point where they may have to consider dumping Trump.
I’m pretty sure the “High Crime” here has probably been done by just about every President since James K. Polk.
Why do we have tanks? Are we worried about a tank invasion from Canada or Mexico? Every once in a while Trump poses a question like this. The response is to impeach him.
Liberals want DJT out of office because they can’t stand that…he was elected. Tough crap, we had to live with Oblunder-Boo for 8 terrible years. Suck it up, losers.
Having watched three high-level representatives of the US Government in action, Kent, Taylor, and Yovanovitch, one thing is very clear. These people are weak, incapable of standing up to Russia. Where’s the defiance, the ‘look in the eye’, the raw intelligence to control the argument, the wit to destroy moronic questions? God help us!
One Trump tweet makes Yovanovitch feels intimidated. Seriously? If she had the guts to stand up to Putin, she’d have ridiculed the tweet, something like… “Well, his butt is bigger than his brain.” Go out with a bang, not a whimper.
Although I am English and don’t have a ‘dog in this fight’ I am concerned by what I see unfolding, and indeed saw unfold in the Mueller Investigation. While I appreciate that many of you on here loath and detest President Trump with a passion, and I can see he is not a terribly likeable sort of person, I would just raise a voice of caution. Many of you will be familiar with the film by Robert Bolt, ‘A Man for All Seasons’ so I copy a few lines here below -:
“William Roper: “So, now you give the Devil the benefit of law!”
Sir Thomas More: “Yes! What would you do? Cut a great road through the law to get after the Devil?”
William Roper: “Yes, I’d cut down every law in England to do that!”
Sir Thomas More: “Oh? And when the last law was down, and the Devil turned ’round on you, where would you hide, Roper, the laws all being flat? This country is planted thick with laws, from coast to coast, Man’s laws, not God’s! And if you cut them down, and you’re just the man to do it, do you really think you could stand upright in the winds that would blow then? Yes, I’d give the Devil benefit of law, for my own safety’s sake!”
Some of you commenting should pay heed to the last line. You should give the President ‘benefit of law’ not because you like him but for YOUR OWN ‘safety’s sake’.
I again come back to my central point. Once you start these sort of nasty partisan vendettas you are on a very slipper slope indeed. I think some of the revelations re RussiaGate – for example the FISA Warrants etc – are deeply troubling and should worry you just as Sir Thomas More pointed out. You might be cheering these proceedings on but be careful what you wish for because oneday they might knock on your door – and don’t think it can’t happen.
Hearsay-gate has reached peak stupidity.
Vote for / against Trump next year as you see fit, but don’t wreck the whole system out of spite. Trump violated no laws, and everyone knows this. There will never be a democrat president if Schiff continues — every president will be impeached at their inauguration by whatever partisan morons voted differently. It will just be perpetual investigations from here on out.
I think Pelosi let Schiff off his leash hoping he would either exhaust himself or discredit the entire extremist bowel movement known as California (its not just covering their streets).
But Schiff and AOC’s infantile behavior is pretty much guaranteeing Trump a second term, which will only drive the extremists in California even more crazy.
At this point, the bureaucrats who tried to rig the election must go to prison, or else the viability of the entire federal system is gone… Its not clear Pelosi is able (even if she were willing) to pull her party back from the brink of insanity. (if the Republicans had their act together, Trump wouldn’t have beaten a dozen of them in 2015 primaries).
Trump wanted to drain the swamp, instead the swamp is committing hari-kari to spite itself.
Patience, grasshopper 🙂 You dont start a story by starting at Chapter 8. While the Senate will shut this whole process down, as far as I can tell, Trump has pretty much admitted, and the evidence so far has verified, his being VERY unpresidential. Lets wait till all the testimony is in. But I do doubt it will have changed any minds. My mom’s mind certainly hasnt been changed.
Yeah. Pretty much. The fireworks really start next week. Christopher de Roetth
Mrutkaus is fully right.
However the only way the proves of the loosely covered rôle of US (BIDEN) in the overthrow of an elected government too close to Russia (at the US liking) could come out, is trough the new ELECTED Ukraine government.
Trump is here again fighting with the CIA (defender of the shadow government wether we like it or not) .
I am not sure they (Ukraine) will dare to expose some facts because they dont know if Trump will be reelected or not.
Why isn’t the pre-Biden time in Ukraine, the US assisted overthrow of the elected gov being discussed? It is as if everybody had clean hands up until Biden Sr. entered Ukraine. See Kunstler.com yesterday.
I agree that it’s very unlikely for the Senate to convict in a public vote, but if they choose to have a private vote, all bets are off.
Democrats moto: ” If you can’t beat your opponent, get rid of them”. Poor Hillary is still after her prom queen crown.
Hey Mish you partisan hack, is Hillary dead from that brain disease yet? Oh no that’s right, you helped spread fake news in the 2016 election.
American politics are such a joke. Trump isn’t the problem, nor is he the solution. As a nation, we could be talking about the bankers, the MIC, or even Epstein, but instead we’re going through this impeachment charade. Lots of red/blue rah-rah cheerleading for nothing.
Last night, my hometown NFL team (Browns) beat the Steelers with a much publicized, nasty brawl at the end of the game. Rather than admitting this was dumb, the people back home doubled down saying that violence was the correct answer, because Pittsburgh people cannot be reasoned with. Never mind that it’s just a game, or that the players are from all over the country and switch teams frequently, or that Pitt is just a few hours away and they’re not so different from us, what matters is that these fans felt personally emasculated because they lost to the Steelers for too many years. It’s like the old Onion article about how the sports team from my geographical area is superior to the team from your geographical area, except these grown adults take it completely seriously.
We all talk about the corruption in this country, but a HUGE part of the problem is the average American. We’re a nation of dopey people with no perspective on life. Red/blue theater and sports are hugely important, but don’t bother us with the real world or any sort of complexity.
I want to fault elites and the media for turning people against each other, but when you have a few hundred million willing participants, I get why they do it. We didn’t have to make it so easy for them!
You should read John Meacham’s bio of Jefferson. He would rail against how certain papers portrayed him. John Adams hated and distrusted Alexander Hamilton.This has been going on since Aristotle was forced to swallow some hemlock.
Well yeah, but those guys had meaningfully different views. Modern Americans hate each other because they listen to the wrong kind of music, root for the wrong team, or prefer noshing on the wrong snacks while viewing the wrong kind of TV programming and washing it down with the wrong beverage.
It’s difficult to equate today’s society of distractions and petty divisions with life hundreds of years ago. There is no more shared benefit in working together and now that the Fed has eliminated the business cycle, we’re free to voice grievances and quarrel to our heart’s content. We can even wage endless war around the globe because we can simply print the money to pay for it!
I liked your two posts. They hit the nail right on the head with force. Anyone who doesn’t understand your posts lacks the perspective necessary to understand anything.
“Modern Americans hate each other because they listen to the wrong kind of music, root for the wrong team, or prefer noshing on the wrong snacks while viewing the wrong kind of TV programming and washing it down with the wrong beverage.”
Eccelente! Bravo!
I am not sure about your distractions theory in the next paragraph. I think most ordinary people have been practicing Paragraph 1 albeit in different ways in different times. The truth is that societies need elites. The main issue is that of ensuring that they are checked and balanced when needed (and not overly checked or balanced when not needed).
What we have now is an elite out of sync and out of control/accountability. The first Republic of the USA has run its course unless Barr is really meaning what he says (which I doubt, since probably he won’t take out the Fed or dismantle the CIA!).
Meanwhile, despite all the terrible figures Mish here forthrightly publishes – and intelligently so – look at the first 5 minutes of this press conference today with Trump: they are nailing a key US healthcare issue.
And, if you are so inclined, look at this surprisingly muscular – albeit also academic – speech on the role of the Executive, Legislative and Judiciary in the current political context, but also within the larger historical context of the USA, a speech by Barr:
This stuff going on with Trump is actually deep. It is occluded by the colorfully questionable character of the Showman President in Chief who actually might be the Stable Genius he (inappropriately on Twitter as always!) proclaims himself to be.
Things are shifting. I suspect in the next four years we are going to see a huge change in US society, similar to the effects the Great War of 1914-48 which have shaped everything since in many ways.
Watch the impeachment boomerang on the accusers. Watch Trump get a substantial working majority in both Houses. Watch the National Injunctions from various Crooked Benches cease.
Then the battleground will shift to whether or not the Banking Cartels are willing to go along with Main Street needs. At that point, the previous battles will seem like skirmishes.
And THEN is when the whole thing might crash. But that fight is not yet being engaged, and quite probably never will. Some wars are too costly for both sides to engage in.
About the transparency issue, although it is a good idea, there may be some legal issues. As a eg I had to have a test and inquired about paying for it in cash instead of running it through my shitty insurance. The cash cost was $340 vs the $540 I would have had to pay if it was billed through my shitty insurance. It is however, technically illegal, or against the rules, to bill one price for private self pay and another to insurance companies. If the provider is audited by the insurer they would have to pay back anything the insurance co paid in excess of what the lower private pay price was.
Another eg I learned the hard way was of a simple test done years ago at a hospital and was charged $1200 because it was done by the hospital. If I had chosen an independent provider it would have only cost about $300. WTF.
Good points. Presumably they figured that stuff out in hard backroom dealing.
When living in the States decades ago I started a short-lived Cricket Club in the Peoples’ Republic of Boulder Colorado. During the first game a ferociously muscled and bearded Pakistani, with a row of alarmingly bright white teeth, whacked a slow pitch straight into the hand of Silly Mid On (played by myself), bending back the index finger before almost cracking a rib (after which the ball dropped harmlessly to the ground, resulting in said Silly Mid On retiring, and said Hairy Pakistani going on to score an obscene amount of runs permanently demolishing any desire on the part of our team to ever participate in any game of cricket anywhere in the world ever again!!).
I went to the friendly US doctors. They gave me three choices:
I chose 3) figuring that if it hurt that much I could choose 1) or 2) later.
Result: finger works fine, stopped hurting after two weeks or so, looks a little off center, but that’s it.
Ever since then, haven’t paid a penny in US healthcare (figuring that is generally the better option), though now am older am glad to be no longer living there. The whole thing is so horrifically commercialised. But that’s the age we live in, so why should healthcare be any different? It’s the Great Western Way these days….
Sorry to hear that. Glad it worked out for you. Where do you live now and do they have universal health insurance. If so are you happy with it.
“The truth is that societies need elites.”
Far and away the most prosperity generating, transformational, society on record, was America during the westward expansion. Specifically because those there, had left their “elites” behind.
Second to that place&period, the runner up is Western Europe and Japan in the first few decades following WW2. Again, because “elites” had been discredited and bombed out of commission. Which allowed even “systems” with as much built in scope for tyranny in the wrong hands as Social Democracy, to work remarkably well at improving conditions.
Even the US sorta-kinda functioned pretty well in those years, as first the Depression, then the War, resulted in the ranks of the prior “elites” being shaken up and randomized pretty decently.
Noone needs idle dunces preening around enforcing braindead opinions about what others should do, while living in splendor off of robbing their productive superiors. No different from how no Antebellum slave “needed” a massa, nor an army of asymmetrically armed slave drivers; even if the immediate period following their demise may have looked less “peaceful” than if the Niggas just shut up and did their jobs, as their “elites” told them to.
If someone doesn’t like our politicians, they should see our voters.
I’m with those who think this whole thing is 60% political jockeying and100% entertainment.
OK, let’s assume Trump put the screws on the Ukrainian prez to get dope on Biden. Well, if Biden did a bad deed, then what’s Trump supposed to do? Ignore it because, hey, Biden is his political opponent? I’d think just the opposite. Let’s let these royal-court, DC types go at each other. Keep each other honest. AmIright?
But, sure, Hunter wasn’t hired for his oil expertise. He was hired for being who he was. Think about that. American VP family guy in a high level position inside Ukraine. Gosh, I wonder what that position lets him do. Can you say, “Spying?” Or, to take the spin off, not “spying” but keeping an eye on things for America.
And, now what’s with Trump even being so crass as to bring up the point with the Ukrainian prez? Jeez, it’s not like the Ukrainians didn’t know what Hunter was doing there.
I’m fine with whatever to see what Biden did. But the guy saying everyone under the sun should be looked into doesn’t want to get looked into. There is something bad about all these guys at the federal level. Maybe Mayor Pete is the closest thing to honest that’s actually running for President. This might explain why he is up in Iowa now.
So WHY didn’t Trump begin his investigations 3 years ago when republicans had control of both houses of Congress. They could have done whatever they wanted then. But noooooooooooooo.[lol]
Damn lot of “simple” facts missing evidence of “fact”
I think it is too early. There are people with firsthand knowledge who have yet to testify. The issue isnt that Trump tried this. The issue is he tried it with money that was appropriated by Congress. If he said let’s make a deal but not involved the OMB and not tried to usurp congressional authority then it wouldnt be a problem. The real question if there is no line that the executive branch cant cross then then constitution is moot.
Yes, they have been hiding all those witnesses with first hand knowledge so far. Are you serious?
Democrats are cheering. Republicans are jeering. Independents, like me, are puking in disgust at the whole damn beltway goat rodeo.
Just remember to vote for, and support, whomever is most likely to reduce the size and scope of the idiot rodeo, by (literally, remember to internalize that…) whatever means necessary.
There is no room for independents in the USA today. You need to choose one side or the other. What will it be? The light (Democrats) or the dark and repulsive (Republicans)?
Given a choice that tragic, anyone even remotely reasonable is left little choice but to pick either one of ISIS, Putin or nuclear Armageddon, instead. While neither of those are all that, either, at least they’re a heck of a lot better than any possible variant of progressivism.
In practice, while the US electoral system bias heavily towards two parties; it doesn’t necessarily prevent a “take-over” of one, or both, of the parties; like what Ron Paul attempted.
It didn’t work for him in the end, but the only thing that is absolutely guaranteed as long as progressives are in charge, is that things will just get worse and worse. So someone similar, just may have better luck next time. And if that fails, we can always look forward to binge rescued by the Muzzies. Or the warheads.
I think I’ll leave this here for Casual Observer, and everyone else, of course. https://www.aier.org/article/the-birth-of-the-deep-state-a-history/
I think the whole impeachment thing is a joke, myself; as it was always political in nature. As for Russia, the ability of the GRU is either laughable or impressive, depending on the desired spin of the moment. May I suggest “The Rise and Fall of the Great Powers” by Joseph Kennedy as an informative read as regards “modern” international relations? I also don’t expect anyone to agree with me; fear not. 🙂
Of course its political. But you are arguing the deep state is perfectly coordinated irrespective of party. I just don’t think the government is capable of being incompetent (which most here including me agree it is incompetent) AND completely coordinated. The two are mutually exclusive.
Also I think whomever chose the term “deep state” is doing a disservice. It sounds too organized, highly efficient and extremely competent. This sounds like no government I’ve ever been a witness to.
I disagree with your assessment of my point. If you read the article you would realize that the point is bureaucracies take on a life of their own, protect their turf, and can and will promote a particular agenda. The agenda will generally be that of those in the upper ranks of the bureaucracy in question, and groupthink will tend to rule. Consider J. Edgar Hoover’s F.B.I. That was pretty consistent across parties.
I found your comment on Russian intelligence upthread interesting. Are you saying they’re better at it than the CIA or NSA? You wouldn’t be Polish, would you? No offense intended, but I know very few Poles who like Russia or Russians. And no, I’m not saying I want to live under Putin! 🙂
Did I say anywhere they were better at it than the CIA or NSA ? The bottom line here is Russia will stop at nothing. And no I’m not Polish. This is all just going on my own research in graduate school earlier this decade.
I just don’t think bureaucracies are smart enough to be agenda-driven. They are mindless paper pushers who can’t coherently push paper at times. I have a friend that recently joined the government as a full time remote worker in addition to the 3 other full time jobs he does in the private sector (all remotely). He says the government one is by far the most disorganized and uncoordinated (he works across multiple organizations in Homeland Security).
If he’s working four jobs at the same time, then they can’t be full time jobs.
He must be scamming his employers by getting paid for 40 hours a week when it’s physically impossible for him to work 4 * 40 = 160 hours per week.
He does the work he is assigned. Hours arent his problem.
I’m not viewing “the bureaucracy” as being monolithic. Each bureau, however, will have a general viewpoint which leads it towards a somewhat common agenda. All the actions taken, are taken by individuals. Their immediate superiors and co-workers will tens to have similar views, and either join in, or turn a blind eye, to these actions. They will feel morally justified in what they do as well. Those who disagree will often just ignore it all, as they won’t want to make waves. There are exceptions, of course, but in general this is how things work in government service. I retired from the post office; and I was trained by State as a passport acceptance agent. I have a bit of familiarity here.
OOPS! -co-workers will tens? Should be tend.
@Felix_Mish ; thanks. I believe the Sasanid Empire (Persia-contemporaneous with Rome) also had an excellent bureaucracy. It’s almost a requirement for any well run empire. Warriors conquer, paper pushers rule afterwards. 🙂
This is government culture not some deep state conspiracy. This is not a culture that is capable of enough coordination required for a deep state conspiracy.
You ignore the upper echelons of the intelligence community when you say that there can be no conspiracy. You also define the deep state in such a way that to you it could never exist. Tell it to Berrios.
China has had what we call a civil service for a couple thousand years. It’s probably fair to place the “blame” on that system for China often being at the forefront of humanity during that time. Emperors come and go, but the bureaucrats remain to run the place. When they do well, things go remarkably well. When they don’t, at least the structure of the society stays together, more or less.
But, a fundamental problem noted in the article is unsolved. That is, how do you keep the civil service from becoming something like the current Chinese Communist Party – an entity with a monopoly on power and no balancing, competing entity other than other nation states?
The US system of voting and political control being ultimately in the hands of voters may be a solution to the problem. But what stops the civil service from becoming the politicians overseeing themselves?
When you consider all this, note the hysterical reaction those in the civil service have to Trump. Imagine you were attracted to a job whose major characteristic is job security. And, now your bosses bosses bosses boss is a guy who made himself famous with the catch words, “You’re fired!”.
Notice as the impeachment/hearsay “hearings”? progress, more solid information (Bank records, ect) spills out about Biden/&son, Kerry/Heinz, et al.
The Biden corruption really needs to be formally investigated.
I remember when our government had at least a shred of credibility? My kids can’t.
“Star Witness” is a Republican construct. Taylor & Kent went first for CONTEXT. Watergate started off as a snooze fest with some guy explaining the White House Organizational Chart for context.
The impeachment process is just gearing up. It is premature to declare it a failure.
To address another stupid Republican talking point: it does NOT matter if Ukraine EVENTUALLY ended up with the monies that had been AUTHORIZED. Nixon’s attempt to have the IRS audit/hound his political opponents was still deemed an “abuse of power” even though the IRS did not comply.
“Nixon’s attempt to have the IRS audit/hound his political opponents was still deemed an “abuse of power” even though the IRS did not comply.”
Obama weaponized the IRS. There was no impeachment.
I am certainly not a fan of this President, however “abuse of power” is not an impeachable offense. It is “high crimes and misdemeanors”. President Nixon went through the impeachment process specifically over his knowledge and involvement in the crime of breaking and entering and theft of materials at the Watergate Hotel.
The role of House is to determine whether or not a high crime or misdemeanor has taken place, and if so, adjudicate the issue before the Senate. This is what will determine whether this is just intended to be political drama or actual impeachment. If the Democrats begin calling legal witnesses who can affirm that “quid pro quo” is a statutory crime and that the President actually committed said statutory crime, we’ll know that this is serious.
Until I see that, I’m not going to spend a lot of time considering this issue.
Allow me to summarize Mish’s post:
“My mind is made up. Don’t confuse me with the facts.”
— Roy S. Durstine (Advertiser)
Mish’s blog has been combative for many years and his newly found support for Trump is designed to provide comfort to the Trump supporters that are hurting right now.
It is funny and ironic to watch Fox News turn on Trump and others at Fox News:
Mish when the Mueller report came out, you said it was all over and I said Trump would still be up for impeachment by the House by the end of the year. I have my own sources. I will say removal from office is possible if the Republicans can come up with an alternate candidate. Even they don’t want to live with Trump anymore but he has a hold of the party election apparatus (money) because the party of the president is the automatic head of the election resources for that party. If Trump was truly not guilty of anything he would not be trying to fight everything. Nonetheless he will be a compromised candidate come 2020.
Agreed. I see the Pubs dumping or forcing Trump out and going with Pence. If they don’t then Trump will lose come the elections.
My hunch is Pence will stay put and the chosen one will be Mitt Romney. He is enough of anti-Trumper and an establishment Republican to win in 2020 against anyone the Dems put up.
Trump 2020.
Yes. Even I may be forced to vote for him again. But I’m effectively a single issue voter these days.
While the establishment R’s hate Trump, they fear his supporters. If the Senate convicts Trump and the RNC puts up Mitt Romney or another old school “republican”, Elizabeth Warren, Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer will be swept into power and have their way with the legislative and executive agenda.
Both sides will show up in 2020 to the polls no matter who their candidate is but neither side will decide it. The independents will decide the victor.
Just getting started Mish. There was no star witness. Also the thing to watch for is if the trade was in favor of something Putin and Russia asked for. I suspect it was and it just makes look Trump look bad again when it comes to Russia. He certainly has a thing for Putin who has him by the you know what.
It would be better for the US to have improved relations with Russia. The Dems always wanted better relations with Russia up until Trump. Remember the Hillary – Russian reset? Obama telling the Russian President to be patient “that he will have more flexibility after the election”? Bill Clinton accepting a speaking fee in Russia and then going to the home of Putin? How about Hillary and Obama approving Uranium One purchase? Hillary and the DNC paying for a dossier that had Russian sources. That would mean paying Russians!!
Exactly why should we all hate the Russians?
In favor of something Putin and Russia asked for?? WTF you moron. Did Putin request Trump give Ukraine anti tank weapons that Obamanation refused to do. As well a shitload of other aid and military weapons. Try a lobotomy for your TDS.
That was the US congress that authorized weapons to Ukraine. Trump actually was agaisnt it before he was for it. Trump is torn on most issues and flip flops. No TDS here. I openly admit voting for him and may have to do it again. That doesnt mean he is perfect or that I cant criticize him. Welcome to America.
I would actually argue, if Trump was against sending money for weapons to Ukraine, there is one more reason to vote for him. What “US interests” precisely are at stake in that corrupt sh*thole nation?
The issue is Russian expansionism. Obama failed there as well. Russia was gifted an airstrip in Syria built by American taxpayer dollars. We can have a legitimate argument about US interests but we cannot have this argument in a vacuum where the rest of the world is not considered. I wouldn’t have an issue if Russia wasn’t an oligarchy. This is not the type of expansionism the world needs.
Russian expansionism is not a thing. Russia has legitimate concerns – from its perspective – due to the expansionism of NATO, which is now encircling Russia. Moreover, the break-up of the Soviet Union has left problems behind very few people outside of the region are even aware of. In many of the former Soviet Republics that are now independent, ethnic Russians are a significant minority – and they are oppressed almost everywhere, treated as second-class citizens. Whenever they revolt, Russia’s government is in a bind, as the nationalist forces in Russia itself (and trust me, you don’t want these guys to replace Putin) are exerting enormous political pressure. The Crimeans clearly wanted to join Russia – Crimean autonomy has been a major bone of contention within Ukraine forever. I see no problem with them getting their wish, not least as Crimea was joined to Ukraine in 1954 by Soviet leader Khrushchov for purely administrative reasons (involving oversight of construction projects). It was previously part of Russia for almost 300 years – Katherina the Great stole it fair and square by conquest. Anyway, I don’t want to write a novel – my point is actually merely that the issues are a lot more complex than your allegation of “Russian expansionism” implies. As a final aside, there is not a scintilla of difference between Russian interference in its “near abroad” and what the US is doing under the “Monroe doctrine”.
There is a difference. One country promotes free and fair elections and other is ruled by oligarchs and dictators and has no form of free and fair elections. Russia has serious problems internally and the only reason they are doing what they are doing is because Putin is the last hanger-on of the Soviet illusion. He was at the Berlin wall when it crumbled and everything he has done since is to bring the west down. If Russia had a strong economy and citizens who didn’t live in fear of everything, they would not need to rig elections, kill opponents and media and wreak havoc with their own citizens. Putin will die like all dictators do and democracy will eventually come to Russia. Instead of trying to reclaim the past and take freedom away from their citizens, Russia should embrace democracy, capitalism, open markets and economies. In my opinion, Putin has set Russia on a course that they will come to rue.
Okay, sorry, but that statement about Russia is still ridiculous. I don’t like Trump for many reasons but did vote for him. I find it extremely aggravating however when he is unfairly characterized and doing so polarizes the country even more.
I don’t like a lot of what’s happen but I believe constantly moving the goalposts isn’t in the best interests of America either. As Trump said during his 2016 campaign, “either we have a country or we don’t.” It is almost 2020. He won’t have the benefit of being an outsider anymore. He has a record now. Anyone who can say he has been presidential with a straight face is really smoking some good stuff I’d like to have too.
you look at cnn,msnbc,abc,nbc and read the wash.post too much. your brain has been warped.
Lol. I actually dont watch any TV news. My primary source of info is this blog.
Isn’t 90% of foreign aid quid pro quo? Is it wrong for the president to ask a foreign government to investigate a prominent and powerful American if he believes that a crime has been committed? Is it wrong to apply pressure in order to see justice done? Seriously, I fail to see the problem.
I completely agree with your point of view. Based on the corporate ethics training I’ve had, Hunter Biden passed the sniff test for Trump to launch an investigation.
The Republican Party is a cult now, and their church is Fox and Friends. The Obama Trauma finally pushed them over the edge. Better than Hillary? Maybe. A criminal, definitely…. and Hillary’s gone.
Don’t kid yourself. The Democratic party is no different, and they are a cult as well. On the one hand, I sort of blame Rush Limbaugh, as he sort of weaponized the news, but I also blame the Journalism schools for failing to teach Journalism, and allowing the media circus to become so polarized. For me, the most appalling news of the week was the Northwestern University daily paper apologizing for covering news, rather than providing a sterile version that might not offend any readers.
I am with you there. Both parties are a shitshow. Clowns to the left of me…jokers to the right.
“Both” are just a special case for “All.” Which again is just a special case of “All possible.”
Government will always consist of nothing but scum. Hence, the relevant question is never “who?” But instead: “How much power and influence over you, should someone obviously nothing but a scum, have?”
Can someone please explain why Nadler and Schitt threatening to withhold Ukrainian aid unless they cooperated with the Trump Russia hoax, or why Biden withholding aid unless they fired the prosecutor investigating Burisma is different? This actual extortion and fact. If the democrats didn’t have double standards they would have none at all. None of the sycophant dem morons will look at facts. So the fuck what if Trump wanted an investigation I would also if I were in his shoes and so would anyone else. The dem assholes are pushing for a civil war.
Blah, blah, blah. Has to suck to look in the mirror and see you.
Spoken like a true b**** with TDS
I think the Dems focus on impeachment helps their Presidential candidates. The less people focus on the candidates and the policies they are proposing the better. This group is so far left, most older Dems wouldn’t recognize them.
If you listen carefully to what is said, regardless of your political bias, one thing is clear; the deep state is a self-important, self-interested, overpaid, public servant, dedicated to preserving the status quo at all costs.
There is no deep state if you think government is incompetent at everything. You can’t have it both ways. Government (deep state) can’t be both smart enough to be behind every conspiracy you believe and also be dumb enough not to be good at anything else.
You are correct, CO, there really is no such thing as a deep state. No less an authority than Steve Bannon has said as much. The so called deed state is the simply bureaucracy that exists in large organizations like most corporations, the military and organized religion – pretty much everything. It is the people that go to work everyday to do the job they were hired for as best as they can and as they understand it. You can like them or hate them but without them everything collapses into chaos. Spoken as a proud member of the deep state in both the military (retired officer) and huge health insurer!
“but without them everything collapses into chaos”
Just like an Antebellum slave revolt….. The horrors!!
No wonder the world is in such a state when people like Sechel and Monosynaptic are so deluded in their views… Russia did it! FFS!
Clearly you don’t understand how Russia operates. I did graduate research on how they use cybersecurity networks to make it look like other countries are culprits. Literally every major cyber-related incident leads back to the GRU and Russian spy services. They are some of the smartest hackers on the planet. This Ukraine thing has Russia written all over it.
Seriously, you implicate the Russians in the election as if this is unprecedented. Didn’t we interfere in the Ukraine elections to install a pro West govt in direct conflict with a Russian aligned country? DIdn’t Obama tap Merkel’s phone, didn’t Obama in Isreali elections? And his is only what has been reported on. Jeez give it a rest.
It wouldn’t be a problem if all countries had free and fair elections. As someone who came from a closed economy that was once a communist country, I can tell you the American version of democracy is better than Russia or some other non-democratic nation state.
“Our” Dear Leader is always bestester than all the other Dear Leaders. As is “our” “system.”….
We have the best govt money can buy. We need a constitutional convention to reign in these parasites that will eventually lead to our demise . My idea is one term only, maybe 6 years, and socialize the election process. Each candidate is allotted a certain amount of money to run a campaign with NO outside donations. We also need to shorten the election cycle, campaigning a year and a half in advance of an election is disgusting.
“with NO outside donations”
You’d need ‘NO outside donations’ of labor, or other monetary in-kinds either, then… Including from journalists, school teachers, football coaches, pop singers…..
IOW, not particularly workable in practice. Yet that it what is necessary, for “Democracy” to be a viable form of government. Ergo, it isn’t.
Instead, just recognize it for the inevitable failure it is. While simultabsously, perhaps, recognizing it may still be the best of all possible inevitable failures, in those precious few areas where there literally is NO other option.
Then, having come that far, focus on reducing the scope “democratically elected” Dear Leaders have to do damage. By reducing the scope they have for doing anything at all. Just as The Founders intended.
Do that, and the fact that democracy is nothing but an inevitable failure, and that any Dear Leader it produces is inevitably a scumbag, no longer needs to result in such tragic outcomes, in practice. Again, just like The Founders recognized.
When u prove to me beyond a reasonable doubt that our federal government no longer interferes in foreign elections, then I’ll care.
China’s Internet Is Flowering. And It Might Be Our Future.
For a witch hunt they are finding an awful lot of criminals. Another on bites the dust. https://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2019/11/15/Jury-convicts-ex-Trump-adviser-Roger-Stone-on-7-criminal-counts/3771573836850/
You could easily be found a criminal too. All they need to do is interview you, write up a somewhat modified 302, then prove their version of the interview contradicts something you said over the phone/email.
I will go out on a limb and say shamrock is probably not a federal criminal like Roger Stone.
Totalitarian governments have always had a special talent for finding “criminals.” In fact, it is one of the precious few talents they have.
In the 4 years and 40+ investigations into “Benghazi” and the “email server” not a single indictment was produced, other than Carlos Danger. Riddle me that.
Establishment covering their ass. All these people were convicted for process crimes that would never have come to pass without the hoax about Russian election meddling.
Whenever the Earth 45 types have cognitive dissonance there’s always a conspiracy theory to the rescue.
None of the convictions are for collusion. The collusion allegation is the springboard for a fishing expedition.
Clinton was impeached for lying about a personal indiscretion. He walked. Nixon was impeached for covering up a criminal act, and resigned before the inevitable impeachment. Trump is covering up a criminal act (including extortion and bribery). There are two ways to extrapolate Nixon and Clinton to include Trump, but I expect Trump to create a new path – obviously guilty of an impeachable offence, but let off by a cowardly Senate.
Yep. I expect he will be impeached but not removed like Clinton. IMO the impeachment of Clinton cost the Dems the 2000 election. The same will likely happen to Republicans and Trump. Unless the economy booms in 2020 Trump is toast.
Arguably, Pres. Clinton’s impeachment damaged the GOP more during the 1998 elections. I was there, on the ground, working for Republican candidates. It sucked all the air out of any policy arguments. It’s possible that the House Dems are repeating the mistake: Just as the primary season begins, they’re diverting attention from their nomination race to Impeachment.
Of course, there is a personal reason for this: some of the House Dems will possibly become the impeachment managers, prosecuting the case against Pres. Trump before the Senate, thereby getting their 15 mins of fame.
6 likes …..what a utterly pathetic sore losers bunch ! What will C(linton)NN come up with tomorrow, I wonder….
your brain is running backwards and you need mental evaluation and please hurry.
The democrats are a disaster. They took control of the house and have accomplished nothing. They won’t win in 2020 because of their track record, but they’ll probably win in spite of it.
The democrats will win because the majority of Americans are morons. The democratic party depends on it. Trump will win the high IQ states in the midwest and plains, but will lose the election because the low IQ areas are heavily populated.
The House has passed a long list of deals that McConnell is sitting on. Get your facts right.
Passing bills that they know are DOA is the same as doing nothing at all. Don’t get me wrong, though. The fact that the Democratic House doesn’t choose to work with the Republican Senate to find common ground is not necessarily a bad thing.
Here are the top 5 states by IQ: Mass.,New Hampshire,Vermont, North Dakota, Minnesota. 4 of 5 did not vote for Trump. College graduates supported Clinton 52%-43%. Just more of your Earth 45 alternative facts.
I really hate that smug argument. Just because you have a degree in engineering does not mean you know anything about the political system. Most “smart people” picked up their “common sense” from the 101 courses that were taught by liberal professors. They never bothered to learn anything more. I talk to smart people in tech all the time and they, for the most part, have no clue about anything political. They don’t know about the deficit, nor do they know anything about our debt. And they certainly know nothing about the Fed.
“College graduates supported Clinton 52%-43%.”
Winning the voting block of a group that most likely severely overpaid for their diploma may not be something to brag about.
But EQ is the new IQ. I doubt there are accurate measures of EQ by state.
Just looked that up, the IQ rankings were published by the Washington Post; interesting that it ranks California 48th out of the 50 states in IQ.
This is not surprising. You can bet that the Washington Post would NEVER publish a result that showed Republicans as better than Democrats in anything. They are the MSNBC newspaper, purely opinion ‘news’ rather than serious journalism. At least since Jeff Bezos bought it for lobbying purposes.
“You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.”
— Nietzsche
That makes no sense because in 2016 the same thing happen and Trump won. 2020 could be a landslide for the Dems if Trump can’t hold the suburbs he won in 2016. This is where elections are won or lost. People in the city are traditionally Dems and people in the country are Republicans. The suburbs can go either way. So far they have swung to the Dems since 2016.
Russia interfered in the 2016 election. Simple fact. Republicans “won” so are OK with it, Democrats “lost” so are not OK with it. If China interferes with the 2020 election and the Democrats sweep the board, I expect the Republicans to switch, and the Democrats to try to tighten things so only Americans decide future elections. If the Democrats give Republicans a taste of their own medicine I’ll be disappointed in them.
Trump and Rudi cooked up a “drug deal” (Bolton’s characterization) in Ukraine, again some Republicans are OK with this, and some are pretending it didn’t happen. Sad.
Simple fact. What Simple fact. Please disclose simple chain of evidence going from Putin/Kremlin to some single action which demonstrably intervened in the election in favor of Trump or demonstrably changed opinion in favor of Trump.
Both parties are the same. If whatever happens is in their interest, it’s fine. If not, it’s not fine. To the extent Russian tried to affect the outcome in favor of Republicans, Democrats don’t like it. To the extent that Facebook/Google tried to affect the outcome in favor of Democrats, Republicans don’t like it. If the Chinese mess with the election in favor of the Democrats (which I consider likely), Democrats will be fine with it, but Republicans won’t be. If Democrats illegally got FISA warrants so spy on the Trump campaign, Democrats are OK with it, but Republicans are not.
Not just “both parties.” “All parties.” Even “All possible parties.”
Politics is not a game where nice guys finish first. He who is willing to go the furthest to win, wins. That’s just how contested prizes work in the real world. And, again, in any possible real world.
What is sad, is that it matters who supposedly “interfered”. If government was properly limited, it simply wouldn’t. Then the child brained taxfeeders could sit around and play “government” and “important people” all they wanted. With more worth vile people simply routing around the useless trash.
The USians interfere all the time in the governing of other countries. The latest example is Bolivia. So get a life USA.
The Case For Collusion
Bailed Out By Russia
1987-2014
Donald Trump may not have any business in Russia, but Russia certainly has business in Donald Trump.
https://themoscowproject.org/collusion-chapter/chapter-1/
Just a bunch of innuendo and some mentions of contacts with Azeri, Ukrianian, and Kazakh citizens (none of which are too Russia friendly) and clients from Eastern Europe, etc. All this material was sifted through exhaustively by the Mueller probe, nothing came out of it. Sure Trump may be shady, etc., but nothing in this mountain of innuendo comes close to demonstrating a Kremlin hand. A similar narrative could be constructed for Malaysian or Chinese or German influence.
“Russia interfered in the 2016 election. Simple fact.”
Ukraine interfered in the 2016 election on behalf of Hillary. Simple fact.
Foreigner Christopher Steele interfered in the 2016 election, using Russian disinfo that was weaponized by the government, against a political candidate- Trump. Simple fact.
‘Russia interfered’ ….. Would you mind explaining what exactly interference is and whether it can be considered ‘illegal’ somehow? I remember how Obama flew over to the UK to ‘preach’ (well paid for probably) in favour of ‘Remain’……Would that have been illegal if Remain had won ? …..and what to say about the CIA organised coup in Bolivia recently not to mention the failed one in Venezuela and Syria……
Would you like to provide an actual evidence of this “interference?” Show us the powerful social media memes that hypnotized ppl into voting for Trump. Tell me when the DNC server was independently examined that proves a hack and not a direct download by an insider or intruder.
Go tell the cops that your ex-wife’s new boyfriend hacked your computer. When they request to examine your computer tell them no. Then tell me how many search warrants and wiretaps the cops apply for with regards to your case. Don’t be surprsied when the answer is “zero.”
Let me guess – Putin emitted evil Putin rays from the Kremlin roof to scramble the brains of US voters so they would eschew voting for the honorable war harpy in favor of the uncouth real estate developer?