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First Russia Sanction Casualty: Biden to Hold Off Sanctions On Aluminum

Aluminum smelting image from Bloomberg.

No Sanctions Hitting Russian Aluminum

Bloomberg reports Biden Team Will Hold Off on Russia Sanctions Hitting Aluminum

The Biden administration is holding off for now on sanctions against Russia that could disrupt global aluminum supplies, according to people familiar with the matter, as the market grapples with already severe shortages of the metal.

Russian-supplied aluminum accounts for roughly 10% of total U.S. imports, highlighting the negative impact that sanctions could have for the U.S. and allies who rely on the metal for everything from iPhones to automobiles and fighter jets.

It seems to me Russia has an easy answer. Stop aluminum exports.

What About Fertilizer?

Q: Hmm. That too. Anything else? 
A: Unfortunately, yes.

Semiconductors 

Please note Russian invasion of Ukraine to further strain U.S. chip supply for auto, tech industries.

Key Points 

  • Russia’s invasion of Ukraine could further strain the supplies of semiconductor chips that have already caused global production disruptions for tech companies and automakers.
  • Russia and Ukraine are critical suppliers of neon gas and palladium that are used to produce semiconductor chips.
  • The White House earlier this month warned chip suppliers to diversify their supply chains in case Russia retaliates against threatened U.S. export curbs by blocking access to key materials.
  • The price of neon shot up 600% the last time Russia invaded Ukraine in 2014.

What About Swift?

SWIFT is the international payment system. It would hurt Germany, a major trading partner of Russia.

Russia Stock Market Reaction to SWIFT

Stop Thinking Dictators Care

If the US wants to sanction everything that hurts Russia, then Russia has an equal if not stronger retaliation.

Putin undoubtedly thought this through in advance. 

So expect severe shortages to get more severe.

And in case you missed it, please see What’s the Real Background Story Behind Russia’s Invasion of Ukraine?

This fiasco has it roots in Obama administration policy.

This post originated on MishTalk.Com.

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129 Comments
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Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Russia is about to get crushed financially:
Prime Minister Mario Draghi of Italy confirmed that Italy will support banning Russia from SWIFT, a payment system, along with other sanctions imposed by the E.U. In a telephone call, Draghi told the Ukrainian president that Italy will help Ukraine defend itself.
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
The latest evidence that sanctions against Russia are having an effect on its financial markets is the decision by S&P to lower its credit rating to “junk.” Other rating agencies have also downgraded Russia.
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Most of the more than 150,000 Russian forces massed against Ukraine are now fighting in the country, but those troops are “increasingly frustrated by their lack of momentum” as they face stiff Ukrainian resistance, especially in the country’s north, a senior Pentagon official said on Saturday. The United States said on Friday that one-third of Russia’s combat power was fighting in Ukraine.
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago

Looks like Putin plays everything close to the vest:

Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Looks like a new world order. Russia/China/NK vs the world.
Dutoit
Dutoit
4 years ago
Not “the world”, but “a small part of the world”
Zardoz
Zardoz
4 years ago
Sure it’ll hurt to stop Russia, but it’ll hurt more when they’ve invaded more countries.  Putin’s narcissism is being rewarded by inaction. He’ll invade again.
Scooot
Scooot
4 years ago
Reply to  Zardoz

Hopefully by then the Allies will be better prepared. 

StukiMoi
StukiMoi
4 years ago
Reply to  Scooot
With what? Idiots’ “Portfolios” and arbitrarily enforced homelessness?
The West is in free fall. To the point where we’re now largely catching up with the Soviet Commies.
American third worlders are already increasingly unable to find roofs over their heads. By now, increasing numbers of Americans can’t even afford to remain obese anymore….
And Europe has doubled down on the same kleptocratic financialization which have rendered the Anglo countries such absolute jokes.
KidHorn
KidHorn
4 years ago
For weeks and months we were told that Russia invading Ukraine would be the end of Europe and democracy. Seems to be a big nothing.
Scooot
Scooot
4 years ago
Reply to  KidHorn
Apparently Russia has just threatened Finland and Sweden with “military consequences” if they were to join NATO. It doesn’t seem like a “big nothing” to me. 
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Reply to  Scooot
Even Finland PM is now changing her tone on joining NATO after saying it wouldn’t come up on her watch a couple of weeks ago.
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Reply to  KidHorn
It has only been one day. You will think differently once Kyiv falls over the weekend. Putin is only use 1/3 of the total Russian military. He has the other 2/3 for the rest of Russia’s western borders. 
davidyjack
davidyjack
4 years ago
Stand up for democracy!
StukiMoi
StukiMoi
4 years ago
Reply to  davidyjack
Stalin used to get 100+% of the vote. Can’t get more “democracy” than that. Putin and co. handily beat near any Western junta at the ballots as well.
Which, of course, tells much more about trite nonsense like, like always entirely arbitrarily defined, “democracy,” than it does about Either Stalin or Putin.
As Acton put it, Liberty is the highest political goal. Not lynchmob-rule/”democracy.” Just liberty. As in, unlimited freedom to shout fire in crowded theaters, as well as to carry guns in the bed of your truck which are able to realistically keep Washington/Kremlin from invading and harassing you. 
BDR45
BDR45
4 years ago
Apparently our government (if that’s what one could call it) is unaware of the law of unintended consequences. Russia banning exports of fertilizer will actually impact us and the rest of the world quite significantly.  $6.00 per loaf of bread for instance????  
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Reply to  BDR45
Fertilizer is responsible for poor health. Let Russia eat it !
Dutoit
Dutoit
4 years ago
I think that probably we will see the creation of a new state, Novorossia, corresponding to the east and south of today’s Ukraine.  The rest will be the new Ukraine. This corresponds to the main languages, russian in Novorossia, ukrainian in Ukraine, and also to history (this was the situation before the revolution of 1917).
Anon1970
Anon1970
4 years ago
Reply to  Dutoit
In 1917, Lviv was still part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire and known as Lemberg. If there is anything consistent in this part of the world, it is that political boundaries change frequently. In 1919, Lemberg became Lvov and part of the newly reconstituted country of Poland. In 1939, Lvov became Lviv and part of Ukraine Soviet Socialist Republic. In 1941, Lviv came under German administration (General Government of Poland). By 1945, it was back under Soviet Union control, as part of the Ukrainian SSR. In 1991, Lviv was part of the newly independent Ukraine. 
Mish
Mish
4 years ago
Repeat 
“For the US project of turning Ukraine into a vassal state while pretending to care about its sovereignty, you couldn’t have picked a worse face than the guy who helped organize the coup of 2014 and then got his son a lucrative gas company board seat in the immediate aftermath.”
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Reply to  Mish
Do you seriously think that is what caused this ? Putin has had his eyes on Ukraine since 2000. None of this started in 2014. It started the moment Putin ascended to the highest office in Russia.
Mish
Mish
4 years ago
“For the US project of turning Ukraine into a vassal state while pretending to care about its sovereignty, you couldn’t have picked a worse face than the guy who helped organize the coup of 2014 and then got his son a lucrative gas company board seat in the immediate aftermath.”
Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Anti-war Protests in Russia
ALAN TAYLOR | 24 Feb 2022
20 PHOTOS IN FOCUS
On Thursday, Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered an invasion of Ukraine, launching missiles and sending thousands of troops across its borders. Following the attack, protests erupted in countries around the world—including Russia. Hundreds of people gathered in Moscow, Saint Petersburg, and other Russian cities to demonstrate against their government’s actions, and calling for an end to the war. Most of these protests were disrupted by police, and many of the demonstrators were detained.
HINTS: View this page full screen.
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
China takes the first step to provide assistance to Russia–China lifts all wheat-import restrictions on Russia amid Ukraine crisis https://t.co/XAm27D02Iw via
Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Russia’s invasion of Ukraine puts wheat supplies at risk
Axios
23 Feb 2022
A key ingredient in bread, cereal and baked goods is facing the prospect of supply disruptions as Russia barrels down on Ukraine.
Why it matters: Russia and Ukraine were two of the top five largest exporters of wheat before the pandemic, leading experts to fear that a war could disrupt supplies at a time when the market for the agricultural commodity is already stressed.
    “A prolonged conflict would create bread shortages [and increase consumer prices] this fall,” Alan Holland, CEO of sourcing technology company Keelvar, told CNBC.
….
Doug78
Doug78
4 years ago
China will buy more Russian wheat and less from other sources freeing them up to sell their wheat to whomever they want. I do believe wheat is not on the sanctions list same as oil and gas. Same thing for fertilizers. Russia could stop exporting wheat altogether if they wanted to cause trouble but that would piss off China and the Middle East against them. They both need the food and the fertilizer. 
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago

Russia’s Vladimir Putin did not bother to speak with Ukraine’s president, Volodymyr Zelensky, before launching his assault Thursday. But some observers see brutal similarities to Hitler’s seizure of Czechoslovakia just before World War II.

“This is all truly dictated by our national interests and dictated by care for the future of our country,” Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said Thursday after the Russian assault began.

Putin on Monday claimed pro-Russian residents of Ukraine faced “genocide.”

“The killing of civilians … the abuse of people, including children, women and the elderly, continues unabated,” he said. “There is no end in sight.”

“Neanderthal and aggressive nationalism and neo-Nazism … have been elevated in Ukraine to the rank of national policy,” he said. “How much longer can one put up with this?”

He ordered Russian troops into the area on a “peacekeeping mission” and then began a full-scale attack Thursday morning, bombarding cities, towns and villages and advancing toward the capital, Kyiv, where air raid sirens were heard.

“The argument that Hitler made is very, very similar to the one Putin’s made,” said Dov S. Zakheim, senior adviser at the Center for Strategic and International Studies, a Washington think tank, and a former undersecretary of defense. Putin, he said, is claiming that the Ukrainian government is “mistreating these poor Russian speakers in eastern Ukraine,” who need Putin to come to their defense.

“So it’s the same playbook,” Zakheim said. “When [Hitler] bit off the Sudetenland, his argument was: ‘These people don’t want to be part of Czechoslovakia. They’re Germans.’ Putin’s saying the same thing about these people in Donetsk and Luhansk: ‘They don’t want to be part of Ukraine. They’re Russians.’ Same exact argument.”

With Thursday’s attack, “he’s expanding it,” Zakheim said. And the example of the late 1930s hints at how far that expansion could go.

“Hitler wanted to take over all of Europe,” Zakheim said. “Putin … wants to restore Czarist Russia, the Russian empire. It’s a threat in particular to Finland, which was part of the Russian empire, to the Baltic states, which were part of the Russian empire, and to Poland, which was part of the Russian empire.”

Stephen J. Blank, a senior fellow at the Foreign Policy Research Institute in Philadelphia, said Putin moved more quickly than Hitler: “We never had a Munich conference, so they rolled the tanks in.”

Although their actions are not exactly the same, “the resemblances are still there.” The Russians appear to believe that “they are the conquering people, and the Ukrainians are a bunch of softies and fascists,” Blank said.

RonJ
RonJ
4 years ago
Four invocations of Hitler. “…the resemblances are still there.” You can go back in history and find resemblances to Hitler, before Hitler. Viking days, for one. Rome took over a chunk of Europe. Etc.
 
jiminy
jiminy
4 years ago
Reply to  RonJ
human nature
grazzt
grazzt
4 years ago
Why is it always Hitler? Couldn’t you say “Putin’s attack on Ukraine echoes Bush’s invasion of Iraq” or “Johnson’s war on Vietnam” or “Clinton’s bombing of Bosnia” or “Obama’s military action in Libya” or etc… There are numerous American military incursions to choose from since the end of WWII. In fact, you’d be hard pressed to find an entire year from 1946 thru 2022 where the US wasn’t involved on some sort of military confrontation somewhere on the planet.
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Reply to  grazzt
Because the US is a democracy and republic with high degrees of freedom and liberty.  In other words freedom and liberty are the foundation of on which right and wrong is built. The only true comparison is Hitler and Czechoslovakia because Russia is very low on the list when it comes to free and fair elections, liberty and freedom. Why is this so hard to understand ?
StukiMoi
StukiMoi
4 years ago
“Because the US is a democracy and republic with high degrees of freedom and liberty. “
My Dear Leader is always the bestestest of all the other Dear Leaders! The Man on TeeVeee always says that. No doubt in Russia as well.
Any possible American liberty died, completely, just as surely as any Russian one ever did and will, the day the leeching class could print themselves the purchasing power to de facto force the rest into bondage via debt.
There are no magically “good” and “bad” governments. They all tell their easily duped saps that they are somehow the good one. Yet they are all the same. All bad. Only difference is, some are bigger and more powerful, others smaller and less powerful. Lack of power to do so, is the only restraint on any of their attempts at enslavement, harassment and robbery of their captive peoples.
FlyNavy1
FlyNavy1
4 years ago
Judging from palladium’s candle chart today, it wasn’t included in the sanctions.
Mish
Mish
4 years ago
A Word About Swift MasterCard and Visa 
WarpartySerf
WarpartySerf
4 years ago
Russia also produces roughly two-thirds of the world’s ammonia nitrate. ( need food, anyone?)
Plus 10% of the world’s oil.   Let’s see if tough guy Biden sanctions oil and ammonium nitrate .  
Mish
Mish
4 years ago
Reply to  WarpartySerf
Yep, that was my fertilizer comment
Doug78
Doug78
4 years ago
Reply to  WarpartySerf
Ammonia nitrate is made by the Haber process which fixes nitrogen from the air to make ammonia and sunsequently ammonium nitrate. It was developed by the Germans in WW I when their supply of nitrates from mines in Chile was cut off. It is not a high-tech process and is made in many countries through out the world. Some plants closed in Europe recently because of high gas prices made it too expensive. Gas in the US is cheap and fertlizer production will ramp up in countries who have access to gas. This not rare earths or palladium or something like that. Prices will be higher but prices will higher in most things anyway. Phosphates are mined in the U.S., China, Morocco, Tunisia and more. Potash is mined in Canada, China, Germany and a few others outside of Russia.
Doug78
Doug78
4 years ago
Reply to  WarpartySerf
China will be the most hit by a fertilizer shortage than Europe or the US.
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Reply to  WarpartySerf
People will become suddenly healthier if no fertilizer is used. We use none and grow vegetables just fine.
Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Fertilizer is needed to grow at scale.  If farmers can’t get enough fertilizer their yields will decline.  I have no idea how much but I am confident that it would be at least 20%.
Eddie_T
Eddie_T
4 years ago
I will say I thought the idea of shutting Russia out of SWIFT was ill-advised and I’m glad they didn’t play that card. 
Maximus_Minimus
Maximus_Minimus
4 years ago
Reply to  Eddie_T
Very pragmatic for two reasons. One is expediency, but the second is Russia would be forced to switch to the Chinese SWIFT, and that would give it a final boost. I don’t think the short thinkers thought about that.
Doug78
Doug78
4 years ago
Reply to  Eddie_T
SWIFT is just an accounting payment system. It does not transfer cash (electronic cash). The bank sanctions hit the ability to transfer actual cash and that hurts.
jiminy
jiminy
4 years ago
Reply to  Eddie_T
I guess it would impact the demand for dollars and the value of the buck.
FromBrussels
FromBrussels
4 years ago
Thanks Mish, for your smart analysis of this situation…..It convinces me that I don t have to be mad at every American 😉
Dean_70
Dean_70
4 years ago
How is gold down below $1890 right now after all the geopolitical tension and uncertainty????
Captain Ahab
Captain Ahab
4 years ago
Reply to  Dean_70
My guess is panic overpricing to begin. Price stabilized at about $1920. Stock market reversed somewhat. With earlier losing positions being closed out, perhaps Gold is being sold to cover losses.
Esclaro
Esclaro
4 years ago
Reply to  Dean_70
The bullion banks made a nice profit and then drove the price down with tons of paper gold to sell. Criminals every one of them!
MPO45
MPO45
4 years ago
Reply to  Dean_70

Gold doesnt pay dividends like Apple stock

Gold doesnt innovate like Apple

Gold doesnt create anything but Apple does

Gold doesnt grow, split and grow again like Apple stock does

Gold looks pretty in jewelry but an iphone/ipad/imac can do 1 billion+ things gold cant do.

I could go on but you get the point I hope.  I will save this post to my notes with a note to check back in 3 years from now.  we can check the price of gold vs the cumulative return of apple (dividends, growth, etc).  
Scooot
Scooot
4 years ago
Reply to  MPO45
Yes correct, but nor does the Dollar, Euro, Yen or sterling etc. Gold is just money with intrinsic value, it’s not an investment in a going concern. Why would anyone expect it’s value to outperform a going concern? The only qualities we want from money is that it maintains its purchasing power over time and continues to act as a medium of exchange. 
Esclaro
Esclaro
4 years ago
Reply to  Scooot
Bingo! Exactly right. Unlike company stocks which can go to zero, gold is money. Always was, always will be.
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Reply to  Esclaro
But gold has not produced the return Apple has. 
Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Opinion | Guest Essay
The West Must Show Putin How Wrong He Is to Choose War
Feb. 24, 2022, 12:01 a.m. ET
Richard N. Haass – Mr. Haass is the president of the Council on Foreign Relations.
The moment, after a standoff stretching for months, has arrived. Russia’s invasion of Ukraine is underway.
On Wednesday, President Vladimir Putin said that he has decided to carry out a “special military operation” in eastern Ukraine. Earlier this week, he had ordered his military into two regions in eastern Ukraine, giving the lie to the claim — often repeated by Russian officials — that he had no intention of invading. As well as an act of aggression, it’s a blatant violation of the basic legal principle that international borders are not to be changed by force and that sovereign countries are free to make their own decisions.
It is also unwarranted. There are two types of war: wars of necessity, to protect vital national interests and involving the use of military force as a last resort, such as World War II and the Persian Gulf war of 1991; and wars of choice — armed interventions taken either in the absence of vital national interests or despite the availability of options not involving military force. Into this category fall the wars in Vietnam, Iraq and, after a limited initial phase, Afghanistan.
Mr. Putin’s conflict is, decidedly, a war of choice. The Russian president’s justifications hold no water: There was and is no consensus about bringing Ukraine into NATO in the next decade or later. There was and is no threat to ethnic Russians in Ukraine. And the United States and NATO have voiced their openness to discussing European security arrangements that take legitimate Russian interests into account.
Instead, Mr. Putin is choosing the path of war. This calls for a determined, comprehensive reply from the West. Mr. Putin’s war of choice demands a response of necessity.
….
TexasTim65
TexasTim65
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
I wonder what this author wrote when the US invaded Iraq, Syria, Libya etc.
Did he feel then that the rest of the world should have sanctioned America for those invasions? My guess is that he did not and instead wrote something about how we needed to go there to save the locals from some oppressive government in the name of freedom.
Clearly this is a war of choice for Russia. But since America has partaken of quite a few of those lately we should hardly be surprised when other countries want to do the same as America does.
Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Reply to  TexasTim65
It doesn’t matter.  You fail to understand that Russia/China are the bad guys and we are the good guys.  That’s the narrative.
TexasTim65
TexasTim65
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
Channeling my best Obiwan Kenobi: “From a certain point of view”  🙂
dbannist
dbannist
4 years ago
For the first time in my life I watched a sitting US president admit he knew there was another country under attack and offer to do absolutely nothing to stop it.

Every single one of those sanctions he mentioned are completely worthless.  Everyone in the room knew it and Mr. Market knew it.

Russia isn’t going to be cut off from anything….China will happily provide them with whatever they need.  If anything, this is going to drive Russia\China relations to an all time high.

Putin just got the green light to take all of Ukraine and nobody’s going to stop him.

Who is next?  Latvia, Lithuania or Estonia?  Probably all three.

Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Reply to  dbannist
So what would you want to hear or see done?
dbannist
dbannist
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
See, that’s just it.
The West has no answer to this.  The west isn’t used to this kind of conflict.  It hasn’t seen this in 50 years and there are now two generations of people (myself included) that don’t have experience pushing back against this kind of attack by a major power.
The Eastern mentality is different and tougher.  They will absolutely keep pushing until the West decides to build a brick wall.
It’s where that brick wall will be built and how far away it will be built that troubles me.

Everyone knows Taiwan will eventually be attempted to be taken though no one knows when.  I think the timeline may have just been pushed a bit higher.

China is 2x as strong today as it was 10 years ago and that is not expected to change direction.  Eventually, the East can and will challenge the West.

Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Reply to  dbannist
Chinese and Russian people are not free compared to European or American people. Better ideas and freedom and liberty will win. This is why people are still fleeing China and Russia when they get a chance. 
dbannist
dbannist
4 years ago
I agree freedom is better.
However, I think you seriously underestimate the Chinese culture and pride in that culture.  Chinese people are very very different in mentality than the West and do not view freedom the way the West does, at all.
I do agree better ideas and freedom ultimately win…but there’s a whole lot of blood involved as history bears out.
That’s what troubles me.  I grew up to see the Berlin wall fall and the USSR dissolve.  I’m afraid I’m going to live to see a Red wall built and the USSR revive.  Russia will not occupy Ukraine.  No, that’s too expensive.  They’ll set up a puppet government just like the old USSR days and let the people think they still have national identity but in reality Russia will control everything.
It’s already happening actually.  China is slowly taking over the East, breaking all  kinds of international laws (artificial islands, aka “unsinkable aircraft carriers” being built under the guise of research) and no one has done anything to stop them.

It does not help matters that Russia and China share a very large border and can freely trade.  Biden offered no comfort about China’s willingness to censure Russia, which was very telling.  

Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Reply to  dbannist
Chinese people are brainwashed. They cannot be trusted until they commit to leaving China permanently and renouncing their citizenship. Same goes for Russian people. 
Sadly I agree with much of what you are saying. 
StukiMoi
StukiMoi
4 years ago
If Chinese people and organizations were not effectively freer than Western ones, they would not be able to allocate capital so much more efficiently than their Western peers.
Just try matching the lack of restrictions on the 50,000 odd freely interacting little firms making up the Shein ecosystem in The US, to see how massively clogging US restrictions in reality really are. Over there in Commiestan, the lack of friction in flow of information, payments, hiring and firing, materials movement, who knows what,, is mind blowing. Over here, everything is effectively frozen in headlights. On account of reporting this, making sure they are not violating that, or getting dragged into kangaroo courts for this-and-that. All while being priced out of everything, by illiterate nothings with party connections; who can just print themselves infinite purchasing power, in order to “take over” anyone and anything they want to, despite never having created a single lick of value themselves.
50 years ago, sure, The West was a lot freer than China and the Soviet Union. But the latter have stayed the same (or perhaps even improved). While we’ve fallen through the floorboards, in our quest to catch up with Peron in uncritical Princess Bimbo worship of strongmen and the like. For every one restriction the CCP places on speech, the ambulance chasers in the US effectively place ten. For every restriction on making a living Chinese five year planners place on people; illiterate Fed Welfare queens on “Wall Street,” other rent seekers making up the US privileged classes, the aforementioned ambulance chasers, and other FIRE racketeers; place twenty.
Even in Russia, even if perhaps only due to lack of ability, speech is de facto less restricted than in the US. Simply because the US Government has more control over more communication channels than Kremlin has. Facebook and the like, are much more effectively controlled by US ambulance chasers and regime hacks, than by Russian and Chinese ones.
The US government has much easier access to block people’s ability to bank and make payments, than the Russian one does. And they use it. All the time. Pretty much noone anywhere in the world, suffers from being shut off from neither speech nor payment systems, on account of big, bad, evil Putin. Which is not at all the case, wrt The Senile Orange Gang and their hangers on of kleptocratic leeches.
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Reply to  dbannist
The mistake Biden made was not moving troops into the Ukraine as soon as he got into office. But the American palate for this isn’t tasting good. Politicians go which ever way the wind blows. The problem is that Russia and China are also members of the UN and can block anything. This was a power that should have never been given to countries that are not democracies. It is time to expel China and Russia from the UN and remove them from the WTO and any other intl organization.  It is time to end globalization as we know it.
FromBrussels
FromBrussels
4 years ago
the biggest war criminal on earth is the fn US of A, so what are you on about …Hypocrite !
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Reply to  FromBrussels
Why are you still here ? 
Esclaro
Esclaro
4 years ago
Exactly right. They must be treated like North Korea. I would immediately blockade every cargo shipment from Russia and China. Let them eat it!
TexasTim65
TexasTim65
4 years ago
Reply to  dbannist
Not sure how old you are but I don’t recall:
1) Any US President offering to intervene in the Iran-Iraq wars during the 80s (other than to supply weapons so we could profit)
2) Any US President offering to intervene in any of the Israel-Arab wars (67, 72 or any incursion into Palestine)
3) Any US President offering to intervene in the Falkland Islands war between Britain-Argentina (early 80s).
4) Any US President offering to intervene in the Pakistan-India skirmishes in Kashmir (more than 1).
5) Any of the countless invasions/border skirmishes between African countries in the last 40 years.
You can easily find an amazing list of conflicts between countries in the past 50 years. In any given year there are probably a half dozen or more going on.
dbannist
dbannist
4 years ago
Reply to  TexasTim65
None of those were major powers.
Russia is at least 1 or 2 magnitudes greater than any nation you mentioned.
That’s the big difference.

If you look at my comment, you’ll see I specified major nations.  

TexasTim65
TexasTim65
4 years ago
Reply to  dbannist
OK, fine (though Britain is a pretty major nation IMHO).  How about:
1) Any US President offering to intervene in the Russia-Czechoslovakia invasion in 68.
2) Any US President offering to intervene in the Russia-Afghanistan war in 79 (other than supply weapons so we could profit).
3) Any US President offering to intervene in the China-Tibet invasion in 50 and 59.
4) Any US President offering to intervene in the China-India war in 62.
There is also the Hungarian uprising that was put down in 56 by Russian forces.
Cocoa
Cocoa
4 years ago
Reply to  TexasTim65
All these hardliners trying to throw heaters at Russia except Russian batting average is a lot better. 
Mish
Mish
4 years ago
Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Reply to  Mish
[Shrug]  Why is this any more important than a decline in the market in the USA?  The vast majority of people in either country aren’t invested in the stock market and it doesn’t much matter to the average person what direction it goes.
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
Vast majority ? I think over 50% of people are invested in the stock market in some form. Even if you have a pension, you are likely invested in it .
Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
The vast majority are in via mutual funds.  So what will they do?  Whine that their unrealized stock investments are going down due to some dumb country they couldn’t even find on a map 3 weeks ago?  What’s your point?
StukiMoi
StukiMoi
4 years ago
Nominally, perhaps. Which is completely irrelevant.
When there are two sources of purchasing power; Income and Stocks; those for whom income represent the vast majority, are not only “not invested” in the stock market, but are in fact negatively invested in it. And the bigger a share of total purchasing power “stocks” comprise, the bigger the negative. Such that, by now, the vast, vast majority of Americans would be much better off with the Dow at 0.0, than at anything within an order of magnitude of current levels.
I suppose I could explain, but honestly, please…….
Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
The only real solution is to neutralize Putin.  That can only take two forms.  He can be assassinated in one of the many possible ways of doing something like this or the USA, Nato and others can militarily respond to Russia.  Once Russia is conquered and Putin is captured as Saddam Hussain was, Russia gets divided up into smaller countries so as no longer capable of being a threat to the rest of the world.
KidHorn
KidHorn
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
I don’t know about you, but I don’t want to be nuked because Ukraine has a new pro Russian government.
Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Reply to  KidHorn
Russia isn’t going to let their nukes loose.  If that’s the best argument you’ve got, then we may as well just say to Putin “take whatever you want”.
KidHorn
KidHorn
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
Are you sure they wouldn’t nuke an enemy about to conquer them? Or a country that assasinated their president?
Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Reply to  KidHorn
Are you sure that there aren’t elements in Russia who would be happy to be rid of Putin and would, just as with Trump, refuse to release the nukes on a hypothetical command?
TexasTim65
TexasTim65
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
There might well be plenty of Russians who would be happy to see him gone and see themselves take control of Russia. But you’d be exceptionally hard pressed to find any who would also want to see Russia split into many smaller countries and their military + nukes dismantled.
Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Reply to  TexasTim65
Then they had better not lose.
Mish
Mish
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
Is the only real solution for Putin to send missiles flying to DC in advance?
Does Russia have hypersonic missiles?
Stop the idiocy
Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Reply to  Mish
Huh?  Say what?
TexasTim65
TexasTim65
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
Mish is suggesting that if NATO responds with military force in the Ukraine or God forbid Russia itself, that Putin would almost certainly unleash hypersonic Nukes into America. If I was him, that’s how I’d respond.
There is no way to have any military response other than nukes because there are no real ground forces in Europe and by the time we built something up enough Putin would have seen it coming for months in advance and responded appropriately.
Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Reply to  TexasTim65
Well, I guess lucky that neither of you two are Putin or in his mind.
FromBrussels
FromBrussels
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
 Is it somethin in the water  that turns you into warmongers ?  The fn US and the fn US only is  responsible  for this situation !
Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Reply to  FromBrussels
So as I asked below of someone else, what would YOU suggest we do?  Turn our backs and say to Putin, “go where you want, take what you want?”.  How about we give him Brussels and see if that appeases him?
Esclaro
Esclaro
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
We should offer him Brussels right now. In fact we should give him your house.
FromBrussels
FromBrussels
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
Stop ranting will you ! Answer me, Would  the US really give a sh it about Ukraine if it wasn t part of their strategy to screw Russia ? Since when have  you become philantropes then ?   
jiminy
jiminy
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
Why is any of this my business?  
FlyNavy1
FlyNavy1
4 years ago
Reply to  FromBrussels
Relax Francis.
Cansip
Cansip
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
You sound like a Neo Conservatives who think they can do anything they want in the world. 
Pitun is not a problem so nobody needs to solve it.  Just respect Russia’s request ( NO Nato in their backyard Including Ukraine ) all problems will go away, but we are doing opposite and dont like the outcome.
bobcalderone
bobcalderone
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
“Neutralize Putin”? You watch too many James Bond movies.
Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Reply to  bobcalderone
You’ve seen over the years how Putin has no qualms about poisoning people with exoctic posions when they cross him.  Tell me you don’t believe that the USA’s CIA/NSA doesn’t have the same capability.  We wouldn’t have heard about anything they did if they did a good, clean job.
Or we could call on Israel perhaps.  You’ve heard of this story?
StukiMoi
StukiMoi
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
“The only real solution is to neutralize Putin.”
That one scary 70 year old vicious little gnome, who is singlehandedly invading a whole country and being mean!
SuperSenile, or even better SuperSenile’s liberated wife, should don a rubber suit, babble some gobbledygook, karate kick him and save the world! Then all the little children can cheer for the happy ending to their comic book understanding of their good and evil little world!
Mish
Mish
4 years ago
Doug78
Doug78
4 years ago
Reply to  Mish
The Ukrainian company Iceblick Limited is responsible for all of Ukraine’s and part of Russia’s neon gas exports. Iceblick in the last couple of years has set up manufacuring in several other countries so supply is already somswhat diversified. You do not make neon gas, you collect it then purify it. It is a byproduct of steel manufacture which is worldwide. 
Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Biden speechifying today claimed the sanctions are “significant” but will take time to work.  Which is why they should have been imposed a month ago.  As Ukrainian president Zelensky asked at the recent German security brouhaha [paraphrase] ‘what good are sanctions AFTER Russian invades?’
FromBrussels
FromBrussels
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
Clown should ve declared Ukraine neutral territory, giving special status to the russian regions ….but the US sponsored Nazis in Kiev wouldn t have agreed and neither would their fn sponsorer  ….Now they got what they been working on for 8 years since the CIA coup,   But hey, be fn proud of your woke nation !
Doug78
Doug78
4 years ago
More teeth in the new sanctions. looking into making it difficult for Russia to trade in dollars, Euro,Yen, Pounds and probaly more. That will hurt. Of course sanctions will hurt us too but what is the alternative? Do nothing and expect everything just works out fine? It never happens that way. There will be pain.
MPO45
MPO45
4 years ago
Is the apocalypse over?  Nasdaq up 0.61% as I write this…I bought Apple at 155 thinking it would keep going down but already at 159.
Fed has an excuse not to raise rates now.  How are those bond yield inversions coming?
Scooot
Scooot
4 years ago
Reply to  MPO45
I would have said the opposite, they don’t have to worry about the market, they can blame it on Russia. Plus there’s going to be more shortages and inflation. They could easily hike by a quarter without much impact. 
KidHorn
KidHorn
4 years ago
Reply to  MPO45
The stock market views this as a regional conflict that will likely be over soon. We apply sanctions on Russia that they’ll adjust to. And in a few weeks, it will be like nothing happened.
MPO45
MPO45
4 years ago
Reply to  KidHorn
So then apple will be back at $170 in no time and I bought in at $155.  How much money did the gold bugs make here?  I will only make 10% in a couple of weeks unless I sell OTM calls out a month into the future and and rake in another 5% in premiums and repeat until I get assigned and go back to cash and keep power dry for the next crisis.
Got gold or long dated bonds?
Update: Aapl at $160.89 right now.
TexasTim65
TexasTim65
4 years ago
Biden on the phone to Putin regarding the invasion:
“Stop or I’ll say Stop again”
That’s about how useful the West response will be. The West will be paper tigers in the Ukraine.
Mish
Mish
4 years ago
Doug78
Doug78
4 years ago
Reply to  Mish
Germany is still dragging its feet but they are starting to get their heads around what the stakes are. 
Tony Bennett
Tony Bennett
4 years ago
Uh, does this mean no more mail order Russian bride ads?  Asking for a friend …
MPO45
MPO45
4 years ago
Reply to  Tony Bennett
Better stock up on Asian brides as the invasion playbook has been set (for your friend).
TexasTim65
TexasTim65
4 years ago
Reply to  MPO45
If his friend like Asian then there are plenty of other countries besides China to order from…
Christoball
Christoball
4 years ago
Reply to  MPO45
I have been taking my time on the Asian Bride thing. I was told once you go Asian you never go Caucasian. I was also told by an authority on the subject that the problem with Chinese brides is half an hour later you are hungry for more.
Billy
Billy
4 years ago
Reply to  Tony Bennett
I hope you guys realize that the Russians own 99% of all sex trafficking, regardless of race. That’s just what my friend tells me.
Bam_Man
Bam_Man
4 years ago
Reply to  Tony Bennett
The Ukrainian mail order brides are better looking than the Russian ones.
KidHorn
KidHorn
4 years ago
I think we should wait and see the end result before issuing sanctions. Waiting a week or so for sanctions won’t make a difference. And it will give us time to think through all the repercussions.
Tony Bennett
Tony Bennett
4 years ago
Reply to  KidHorn
“Waiting a week or so for sanctions won’t make a difference.”
Xi will see weakness.
KidHorn
KidHorn
4 years ago
Reply to  Tony Bennett
Do you really think sanctions we impose on Russia will effect any decision China makes?
Tony Bennett
Tony Bennett
4 years ago
Reply to  KidHorn
Absolutely.
KidHorn
KidHorn
4 years ago
Reply to  Tony Bennett
Then lets take our time to do it right, factoring in how Xi might respond. Instead of rushing in everything without thought and leaving us with no bargaining chips.
TexasTim65
TexasTim65
4 years ago
Reply to  KidHorn
What are we waiting a week for?
By Sunday the war will be over and the Ukrainian forces will have surrendered. The splitting of the country into smaller parts will be finished by next weekend.
KidHorn
KidHorn
4 years ago
Reply to  TexasTim65
So we make the right decisions and don’t look like we panic rushed in sanctions.
Eddie_T
Eddie_T
4 years ago
Pathetic response so far.  Not expecting much of real consequence. No matter what you think about the current leadership in Ukraine , we should remember that this was a country with nukes that gave them up with the understanding that NATO and the West would offer some protection. I think Putin will push and push until someday we will have no choice but to push back. No good choices here that I see. 
TexasTim65
TexasTim65
4 years ago
Reply to  Eddie_T
It’s not that there are no good choices. Rather there is no choice at all. Europe and the US only had 1 choice and that is to do nothing because there is no possibility of military action (not enough forces, not close enough to arrive in time even if they had the forces etc).
TexasTim65
TexasTim65
4 years ago
Reply to  Eddie_T
Forgot to mention it but the best thing to happen for the West is that we’ve finally gotten to see the Russian army in action. It’s been a very long time since they had an actual coordinated attack of any real consequence.
This invasion is showing how the Russian army plans and coordinates operations now including the build up of forces and how the invasion plan itself. We are seeing their ground and air forces in action, their cyber warfare (apparently attacking Ukrainian websites) capabilities etc. The US forces have been on display a lot in the last 20 years so it’s going to be very helpful for the US military to get this look at how well the Russian army works.
KidHorn
KidHorn
4 years ago
Reply to  TexasTim65
Seems to be working well. We’ve seen them fighting off and on in Syria for the past several years.
Maximus_Minimus
Maximus_Minimus
4 years ago
Reply to  TexasTim65
Hardly a show of an all-out war. CNN car, standing beside the road, showing Russian tanks snaking their way through local traffic.
This is hardly an operation to win hearts and minds, but trying to avoid creating bad blood.
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
4 years ago
Reply to  Eddie_T
I think the only option now is start seizing a bunch of random islands that Russia supposedly owns but never made any official claim on via the UN. We actually need an Allied fighting force that will simply surround Russia. Putin has threatened to fire missiles (possibly nuclear) but he’s made no statement saying this will stop in Ukraine. If a single Russian troop crosses into any more countries, there should be grave consequences. 

Broadcast live on television at 5.45am Moscow time, President Putin said: “Whoever tries to impede us, let alone create threats for our country and its people, must know that the Russian response will be immediate and lead to the consequences you have never seen in history.”

“All relevant decisions have been taken. I hope you hear me.”

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