President trump awaits orders from Saudi Arabia.
Saudi Arabia Gets to Set the Terms
“Saudi Arabia oil supply was attacked. There is reason to believe that we know the culprit, are locked and loaded depending on verification, but are waiting to hear from the Kingdom as to who they believe was the cause of this attack, and under what terms we would proceed!“
US Claim
Who Did It?
Support for War
J Street for Peace
Though the administration has pointed the finger at Iran, as of right now many details of the attack remain unclear. But here’s what we know for certain:
1: Saudi Arabia should not determine “under what terms” the United States enters into armed conflict.
2: President Trump lacks the authority to launch a military conflict without congressional approval.
It’s evident from this tweet that the president believes otherwise — and, if left unrestrained, he could use this attack on Saudi Arabia’s oil facilities to drag us into a disastrous war with Iran.
That’s why it’s essential that Congress finally pass the Khanna-Gaetz amendment, which denies Trump funding for a war with Iran without congressional approval.
The amendment has the support of the majority of the House and Senate. Its fate is in the hands of a small group of legislators putting together the final version of the National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA).
J Street Flyer
The above paragraphs are from a J Street email flyer to a friend of mine.
J Street is a nonprofit liberal advocacy group based in the United States whose stated aim is to promote American leadership to end the Arab–Israeli and Israeli–Palestinian conflicts peacefully and diplomatically.
My friend comments “Jewish opinion is not monolithic and Netanyahu and his government are not Israel.”
If there is proof or even strong evidence that Iran did this, then show it.
Mike “Mish” Shedlock
And, another question that no one seems to be asking,. If the drones and/or missiles were launched from Iran or Iraq, then they had to fly over the Persian/Arabian Gulf, which is full of US Navy vessels from the fifth fleet based in Bahrain. If that is the case, then surely we (The US) would have seen it on radar and there would be no doubt about where they came from. Beyond that, if they came from there, why on earth did we not shoot them down? Did we not see them? If that is the case, that sure is scary, as they could have been aimed at our ships. And, if we did see them, why weren’t we concerned enough to shoot them down? Were we not capable? Just things to think about….
“Saudi Arabia Gets to Set the Terms”
It was Saudi Arabia that was attacked and it is Saudi Arabia that would bear the brunt of any response to the attack, that could go beyond the point of triggering a major war in the gulf.
Your Brain on Public Schools – Dumb people answer questions
This is just an attempt by Trump to manufacture leverage against Iran where there is none, in order to get them to come to the table and make a deal with Trump. His goal is to strike the same deal Obama did with a couple of minor differences, and then claim a “tremendous victory, the best deal in the history of the world”.
War is just an extension of politics. Big government –> big politics –> lots of wars.
Mish supports left wing nut job comments, while banning anything to the right of Chicago (which is everything except San Francisco). He clips democrats out of anti-vietnam cartoons, and then acts (poorly) like he didn’t see that coming.
Mish sure likes stirring up the pot, but doesn’t like the divisions that result from what he does.
Time to retire
For those who don’t want wars ) or at least make them short: Bring back the draft with no deferment. Whe congressman/senators/CEOs etc see their kids go to the front and being killed they will think about wars more carefully. Put their skin in the game..
Better yet: Get rid of the standing army. Let those militiamen who feel like it, take their own guns to the Middle East. Leaving the rest of us out of it.
Actually that happened during the Spanish civil war. They were known the as the Lincoln Battalion
More civilized era, more civilized people, more civilized America. Thems were the good ole days…. Or, at least less unequivocally bad.
Nothing wrong with Lindsey Graham going to battle for something he believes in (as if…. ). Wrong starts when Lindsey, instead of going himself, bringing whatever kit he can scramble up at his local gunshop, gets to force other people’s children to go. And other people to pay for it.
This is all so unimaginably and totally corrupt and so utterly doomed to complete, absolute failure that I just wish it would do so as quickly as possible. Please.
A growing number of us wish for that constantly. If we’re going to fail, let’s hurry up and rip off this band aid so we can start over.
Unfortunately the central bankers have been adept at collusion. People have to get even more annoyed before anything starts to happen, and of course bankers had the foresight to shield themselves from voter wrath.
Or the incident was a ruse to boost the price of oil. With so much oil capacity and global manufacturing slowing, OPEC wanted the supply/demand curve to move in their favor. The US also benefits because it produces a lot of oil. A “tax” without Congress’ approval.
The Houthi claimed the drone attack apparently everyone forgot about the Islamic religious political armed movement that chants death to America, Jews and Saudi’s. Most of the world wants them gone them they are in Yemen. A 5% reduction in oil should not cause the price needle to move. Don’t blame trump.
Like the last time he was “locked n loaded: lol,calls up Tehran,asks them pretty please with a cherry on top if he could lob a few tomahawks in the middle of the desert so he could like a tough guy,Iranian foreign minister laughed at his pussy ass and hung up…..that “locked n loaded”?
Whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power and not of truth
Friedrich Nietzsche
Touche!
“Politics is war by other means.” Clausewitz
Funny how the Germans knew so much about power.
Three things are for sure… if the nobel peace prize -sshole were still in the white house
Please stop with the “pallets of cash” to Iran nonsense. It was their money that had been seized decades ago.
You said above that people should not take Trump tweets seriously, then you repeat a dumb meme (similar to the Russiagate story that won’t die) that circulates because of Trump’s tweets.
It was pallets of cash that did not belong to Iran, returned under secrecy to get Iran to sign a piece of paper they weren’t going to follow anyway.
Please stop being a racist and holding Obama to a lower standard than you would other Presidents. He was a disaster
Wait, you’re saying that money wasn’t Iran’s in the first place, yet it was “returned” to them? What are you even trying to say here?
Also, bringing “racism” into the argument shows you have already lost. Obama was a bad POTUS, just like all of them in my lifetime. Stop playing the red/blue game that if you dislike one politician you must adore another. They’ve all become bankster puppets with different PR campaigns.
You’re wandering into troll territory with race baiting, Country Bob. Don’t go there.
TY Tengen! “When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser.” – Socrates
Not lost, the pallets of cash is an ignoranus meme trump started up. The money was stolen from the Iranians decades ago and was being “unfrozen” as part of reaching a deal. Do some homework.
I like your quotes!
The Trump Derangement Syndrome trolls are going to ruin what is left of mishtalk… and it doesn’t seem like mish minds at all.
Time for Mish to kick you off the comments section if he wants anything close to a balance
US dollars belong to the US, but they were allowed to be used to redeem (return) Iranian asset claims (whether dollar account or other) . Same as congress was lied to being promised Iran would be kept out of the US banking system wrt accepting the accord. Not too hard to understand.
Obama knew that bribing Iran with a pallet of cash was slimey and would never be approved… which is why he did it in secrecy and behind America’s back. Obama knew it was wrong and did it anyway.
If Trump hadn’t disastrously ended the Iran deal and imposed total sanctions on them, against international will, Iran would not be behaving this way.
Neither Obama nor Iran ever thought their private agreement would last. It wasn’t ratified by Congress and was not presented to the American people. It was negotiated in secret, most of the terms (and the pallet of cash) were discovered only after the fact.
Same goes for Obama promising mendelev (on a mic Obama didn’t know was still on) that he could screw America once the election was over.
It’s not an accident that we never successfully think ourselves through these critical pre-war episodes: The decision room is invariably filled with pissed off alpha males itching to send somebody else’s kid to war.
Trump could serve us best just now by calling an emergency meeting…in Brussels and invite the ECU to present their best shot proposal to preserve THEIR energy lifeline from the Middle East, observing as how we seem to be energy independent. If he deems it a good pitch, he should bring it back to congress to see if it sells.
He should then commission a Manhattan Project to complete and scale up Liquid Fluoride Thorium Reactors and get the world off petroleum owned by medieval camel drivers, goat herders and religious fanatics.
Come on Mish… Do some fact checking
Trump isn’t waiting for the Saudis to tell him what to do, Trump very clearly stated he did NOT promise to defend Saudi Arabia, and he is waiting for the Saudis to provide evidence the Saudis claim to have, and to propose a response — which Trump may or may not accept.
In the meantime, the US is trying to independently verify who launched the attack, who sponsored the attack (who provided weapons, etc), and what sort of response is even plausible. He is gathering the facts instead of going off half-cocked like some media pundit.
I don’t care about the Tweets. Trump doesn’t take his tweets nearly as serious as the media does, and its really obvious Trump enjoys screwing with the media’s heads.
Pompeo isn’t the President, nor are any of the screwballs in Congress from either party. Trump is President, and when he isn’t tweeting you into an insane rage, he is wisely double and triple checking facts as best he can — as well as evaluating whether an attack would actually help the US’ situation. Ergo he called off the earlier ratings bonanza attack on Iran that Bolton wanted.
When Obama wasn’t perpetuating wars, starting new wars, setting racial relations back decades, the little bastard was making a bad healthcare system even worse. And as he was leaving, Obama authorized Brennan and Comey to stage a coup against the rightfully elected president. Trump owes no allegiance to Washington DC and its warmongers, they tried to screw him and he knows it.
The cartoon is just stupid. JFK and LBJ started Vietnam, Nixon of all people ended it. Why would you include the part poking fun at the GOP but clip the part you claim blames the Democrats who started that war???
I get it Mish, you are anti-war. Good for you. A lot of people agree with you on that part (including Trump it seems). Between the cartoon half-truth and then the misquote, this partisanship is undermining your credibility
Good points…Trumps tweets are designed to straight up troll the press and Mish is getting a little caught up in the trolling…
I am liking this Country Bob. Keep up the great posts.
He He. Trump the fact-checker…
Confirmation could come from the “Defense” Department in the form of stock photos from another incident that happened months ago. We haven’t been able to trust any administration on these issues for years now, why would we trust them now?
What’s the big deal with a couple of drones anyways? The USA has been using thousands of drones for over 10 years in about 37 countries, generally without their permission. Killing about 40 innocents (including hundreds of children) for every CIA designated bad guy murder — the very definition of terror. In Pakistan mothers scare their kids into compliance by evoking drowns instead of ogres.
As I recall, one of the earlier successful extra-judicial murder-by-drone was Abdulrahman Anwar al-Awlaki, 16 years old, while eating dinner at an outdoor restaurant in Yemen. Abdul was collateral damage, not a target. Oops.
Yemen. Yikes. Could this be blow-back??
Good point.
Drones are cool.
If nothing else, they are the most democratic form of weaponry to have been invented since those, much nastier, suicide bombers. Which are, no doubt, why those used to “guns for me, taxes to pay for them for you” are so busy demonizing them.
America no longer belongs to Americans. The Art of the Deal.
It has always belonged to the 1% of Americans.
It’s rich that the case for war is being spearheaded by Mike “we lied, we cheated, we stole” Pompeo. I’m also sure the Saudis will give us wise guidance, as any regime with a policy to deny their neighbors food and potable water is an obviously upstanding one.
Bolton’s recent departure isn’t the only coincidence here, with the Israeli Knesset elections tomorrow. Will the specter of the long-awaited war with Iran be enough to boost the Likud? They didn’t have enough seats to form a coalition in April, maybe they will now.
Ha Ha. Outsource intelligence to Saudi … Save some money?
Let the guys who told us Jamal Kashnoggi left the Istanbul embassy decide what the truth is, and if they want the designated culprint to be Iran.
As if that mattered.
Yes, I found that to be vacuous, insanely naive and willfully ignorant of history. That horse left the barn in the Truman Administration!
“and under what terms we would proceed!”
…
Naturally.
I learned all I need to know from Trump (thoughts on Saudi Arabia) following Khashoggi’s murder. Within a day or 2 of murder Trump voiced concerns on US pending $100+ Billion arms deal with Kingdom. Obviously, DJT did nothing – nor will do anything – that will impact arms deal(s).
Even more interesting, Trump intervened to head off Erdogan’s campaign against the House of Saud. Who knows what kind of deal we made with Turkey to stop hounding MbS, but it probably involved letting them buy weapons from Russia and looking the other way while they shell Kurdish positions.
Trump will do ANYTHING to get reelected, including using nukes.
“The cartoon is a bit rich. Vietnam, the most pointless war in American history, was an invention of the Democratic party.”
I added context for the image.
The actual Tweet says both parties support war – and they do.
True Trump has not started any wars yet, and I have mentioned that before.
People focusing on nit-picking instead of the main point.
OK so attack the cartoon : good grief.
Trump didn’t do that. He just wrote a poorly worded tweet. Let’s wait and see what actually happens.
I actually expect Trump will walk this down – But I also expect his appointments to urge him to bomb
I agree. But the orders are not coming from SA. The claim that they are waiting for SA to tell them the terms is just a misguided attempt at looking reasonable. Instead, it looks stupid.
Woefully short of an apology for the cartoon half-truth Mish
Trump isn’t waiting on instructions from Saudi Arabia either.
You really think the KSA is driving US policy?
The cartoon is a bit rich. Vietnam, the most pointless war in American history, was an invention of the Democratic party.
Much, much more complicated than just blaming Democratic Party for Vietnam war. The origins go back to WWII and French-Indochina being a colony of France. Kennedy was actually a proponent of free-determination of the Vietnam people to decide the direction their country should take. France didn’t want to give up their colony. Kennedy needed France on his side more to confront aggressive actions by the USSR and thereby gave France a free-pass to handle Vietnam in any manner which they wanted. Led to insurrection and then to war of which we became involved. We backed a corrupt South Vietnamese gov’t.
Attached is a link to the Pentagon Papers. Very long, but fascinating history. We had an opportunity to extricate ourselves from the oncoming quagmire, but chose not to….awful mistake.
“…war of which we became involved”
Yup! We just, like, became involved. Like we just had a recession.. Kind of, like, just happened. Like, you know…
” We backed a corrupt South Vietnamese gov’t.”
We didn’t just back it; we installed it. In fact, it mirrors what happened in Korea, except that the Vietnam War was fought to a conclusion.
The WW2 Allies separated the country, the communists took the North and fought the French to a draw. The intent after the Geneva Conference which led to a cease-fire and a DMZ between the two halves of Vietnam was for country-wide elections to be held in 1956, but this didn’t sit well with Uncle Sugar, because the communists were better organised and were sure to win the elections, be they fair or rigged, so the US installed a puppet government in the South in1955 (under Ike, FWIW … “President Kennedy” was still just a gleam in Joe’s eyes) to keep that part of Vietnam “on-side.” The rest is history.
Obama was good at killing, too. The dems are just jealous they aren’t the ones that get to kill and get reelected.
This is the least war happy President we have had in 20 years.
Pathetic article
They all are, until the day they are not. Jury’s still out on Orange.
“I think POTUS is working on confirmation. Your statements make no sense.”
You reply makes no sense.
And Trump is going to believe Saudi Arabia?
Have we learned nothing from the death of Jamal Khashoggi ?
Believe that you have overreacted, you missed the phrase, “under what terms.” An ocean liner could pass through that qualifying phrase. The Saudi reference is merely to buy much need time to consider if evidence can be brought to bear on Iranian responsibility and how to respond. Some on here would say “don’t respond” and “get out”, but would you enjoy living in a world where Iran controlled the oil and gas supplies moving out of the Gulf. I wouldn’t.
Mish, I was also upset that it seemed like Trmp was waiting for permission. But I’m concluding actions speak louder than words. Looks like a stall tactic. He knows when he’s being played.
Mish – Could this be revenge from Turkey, for the murder of Kassogi in the Saudi embassey in Turkey…?? so now they support the Houttise ??
I recall reading that the whole deal about the petro dollar was that the USA would protect the saudi royals, IF they ONLY accepted us dollars…..so now the cons have conned the saudis with trillions in paper bonds that can NOT compete with gold in PREserving capital.
I think POTUS is working on confirmation. Your statements make no sense.
But his finger is on the trigger already, confirmation notwithstanding. Bravado, I have no doubt, but measured language is what is called for here. Statesmanlike behavior.
But no, “we’re locked n loaded!”
How can you even defend that?
It’s already confirmed: There was no attack on America.
Even if it came within Iran does that mean Iran did it? Also, if Iran knew they were going to get bombed then why would they pull off such a piss ant attack?