Russia’s Shock and Awe Invasion of Ukraine Fails, Putin Now Seeks Unconditional Talks

Ukrainian fighter on Russian tank via Wall Street Journal.

After telling Ukraine no talks until it laid down arms, Ukrainian Forces Hold Kyiv as Talks With Russia Are Planned. That is a paywall free link.

Russian and Ukrainian officials prepared to meet for the first talks since Moscow began its invasion four days ago, as Ukraine’s defenders held on to the capital, Kyiv, and pushed back Russian troops in urban combat in its second-largest city, Kharkiv.

Russia sent a delegation to the southern Belarusian city of Gomel on Sunday, but Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky said he refused to meet in a country that has become a launchpad for Russia’s attacks.

Mr. Zelensky did, however, speak by phone to Belarusian President Alexander Lukashenko later in the day, and said that he agreed to have his envoys meet with the Russian delegation on the river Prypiat along the Ukrainian-Belarusian border. Mr. Lukashenko committed during the conversation, the two men’s first in two years, that no Russian military activity would be carried out from Belarus in the meantime, Mr. Zelensky said.

“I don’t really have much faith in the outcome of this meeting, but let’s try, so that no citizen of Ukraine would think that I, as a president, didn’t try to stop the war when there was a chance, no matter how small,” Mr. Zelensky said.

“The enemy is losing steam,” said Zelensky adviser Oleksiy Arestovych. “Another day or two, and the offensive will collapse.”

Shock and Awe Fails Spectacularly

Early on Sunday, Russian forces pushed deep into Kharkiv, an industrial city close to the Russian frontier. Many of the light-infantry troops were ambushed and killed or captured by Ukrainian forces hours later, however.

Footage shared by Ukrainian forces on Sunday morning showed five Tigr-M armored vehicles with Russian “Z” markings destroyed on a Kharkiv street, with Ukrainian soldiers helping themselves to Russian ammunition and equipment, including several antitank rockets. A Tigr-M also was seen burning at another Kharkiv intersection. Residents said the city appeared to be under firm Ukrainian control by the afternoon. “We are finishing up cleansing the city from the enemy,” Kharkiv Gov. Oleh Synehubov posted on social media.

Russia Stumbles in Biggest Test of Its Military Force

Also consider Russia Stumbles in Biggest Test of Its Military Force

The Russian military has faltered early in its invasion of Ukraine, as stiff resistance threatens to turn Moscow’s hopes for a swift victory into a protracted and costly war, U.S. officials and allied military experts say.

The Russian military has a prodigious array of artillery, rockets and air power. Employing these weapons, however, would only further antagonize the population that Moscow is hoping to draw into its sphere of influence and make it harder for the Kremlin to control a country of 44 million.

Mick Ryan, a retired Australian Army major general who has studied advanced warfare, says Russia’s failure so far to achieve decisive gains and its potential depletion of precision-munition supplies “probably will force them to use older weapons that are less precise and more deadly.”

“In the next 72 hours I expect greater lethality on the battlefield,” he added.

EU to Purchase and Deliver Weapons to Ukraine 

In a historic first, Axios reports EU to Purchase and Deliver Weapons to Ukraine.

The European Union will finance the purchase and delivery of $500 million worth weapons to Ukraine, marking the first time in the bloc’s history that it will send arms to a country under attack.

Longstanding policy taboos are falling across the EU because of Vladimir Putin’s unprovoked assault on Ukraine. The new weapons program, which will be funded through the European Peace Facility, was announced Sunday alongside new sanctions on Russian aircraft, state media and the Belarus economy.

The EU’s foreign policy chief Josep Borrell said during the Q&A portion of a press conference that member states will provide fighter jets to Ukraine, not just ammunition.

  • “[Ukrainian Foreign] Minister Kuleba has been asking us that they need the kind of fighter jets that the Ukrainian army is able to operate. And we know what kind of planes, and some member states have these kind of planes,” Borell said, in what’s likely a reference to Soviet-era jets possessed by Eastern European countries.
  • He did not immediately provide more details.

Details

  • Germany, which had come under intense criticism for refusing to export weapons to Ukraine during the military buildup, reversed its position and said it would send 1,000 anti-tank weapons and 500 Stinger missiles to Ukraine.
  • Sweden, an EU member that is not in NATO and has historically maintained a neutral position in global conflicts, said it will send 5,000 anti-tank weapons, 5,000 helmets, 5,000 body shields and 135,000 field rations — as well as $50 million in funding directly to the Ukrainian military.
  • Belgium is sending an additional 3,000 machine guns and 200 anti-tank grenade launchers.
  • Hungary said it would not provide arms to Ukraine but committed to sending 100,000 liters of fuel and 28 tons of food, according to Ukrainian authorities.

Air Space Denial 

The WSJ also notes EU to Fund Purchase of Weapons for First Time and Ban Entry of Russian Planes Into EU Airspace

European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen said the EU’s decision to finance arms purchases was “a watershed moment.” The EU traces its roots to post-World War II peace efforts and began as an economic alliance. 

In closing its airspace, the EU banned not only commercial airliners but any plane owned, registered or controlled by Russians, Ms. von der Leyen said.

“Our airspace will be closed to every Russian plane–and that includes the private jets of oligarchs,” Ms. von der Leyen said. 

In announcing sanctions on Belarus, Ms. Von der Leyen said that its leader, Aleksander Lukashenko, “is complicit in this vicious attack against Ukraine” and so would face bans on exports of products including mineral fuels, tobacco, wood, cement, iron and steel. Export restrictions already imposed on Russia also will be extended to Belarus, she said.

Leadership and Inspiration

Those looking for leadership, courage and inspiration can find it Volodymyr Zelensky.

He has united the world against Putin including unprecedented actions by the EU to supply arms.

In case you missed it, Zelensky turned down a US evacuation offer. For details, please see “I Need Ammunitions Not a Ride” Says Ukrainian President.

Congratulations to Zelensky and the citizens of Ukraine. 

This post originated on MishTalk.Com.

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Rbm
Rbm
3 years ago
Hard for 150000 troops to hold on to any land with a large population with big cities. 
 Especially without local support.   The peace talks give both sides time to shore up defenses.     
 
blacklisted
blacklisted
3 years ago
Shock and Awe was never the plan. Only the US is stupid enough to blow up all the infrastructure – https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/world-news/war/world-war-iii-beginning-stages-now/
Rbm
Rbm
3 years ago
Reply to  blacklisted
Yeah i always thought shock and awe was because politicians cant wage war if a lot of American blood is spilled.  Doesnt go over good at home.    Thats why more stand off weapons.  
vanderlyn
vanderlyn
3 years ago
ha ha ha.    typical amerikan who thinks wars are over in a few weeks or months.   this war has been waging since W and the cun% cia paratroopers……..put puppet goverment in georgia almost 20 years ago.     
William Janes
William Janes
3 years ago
Reply to  vanderlyn
We can now identify all the Russian propagandist in this Blog.
timbers
timbers
3 years ago
Additionally, if you knew anything about Russia, you would know – but apparently you don’t – that she has a very long standing policy of talking and negotiating to almost ANYONE. Russia has it’s diplomats undergo extensive training. They have become trusted intermediaries in Middle East conflicts on both sides partly for this and their trustworthiness.
Do yourself a favor – look up the recently released declassified docs that say dozens of Western leaders including US promised no NATO expansion towards Russia. Then look up the Azov Battalion which dominates Ukraine military, funded by various USA organs. It advocates genocide of all Russian people. Then look up Minsk agreement and note Ukraine has not honored any of as it kills and terrorized Russian Republics in Ukraine (well they aren’t in Ukraine anymore).
Then note, the USA and Europe have/are arming the Azov Battalion with lethal weapons to kill Russians.
Putin said the missing is not shock and awe…but the “de-nazification” of Ukraine and her military. As just recently Zelensky state he would seek nukes (a very easy thing to do with so many unsecured old Soviet nuclear power plants in Ukraine) and Russia lost 21 million of her people defeating Hitler…I’m surprised you do get why she is totally within legal and moral excercise of her right to eradicate UDS funded threats of Nazism with nukes at her doorstep.
William Janes
William Janes
3 years ago
Reply to  timbers
Russian response:  all propaganda 24/7.   No one wants to be a part of the Russian sphere other than the Belarus fascist.  Putin is sinking.  Russia is coming apart again.
SmokeyIX
SmokeyIX
3 years ago
It’s amazing how many people on my facebook are posting about church prayer gatherings for Ukraine, posting “pray for Ukraine” profile photos, etc. when none of them ever prayed for any of the countries the USA has bombed.  Not once in my life before this week have I seen or heard American Christians praying for bombing victims until now.  Apparently American Jesus doesn’t give an eff about children, men, and women in Iraq, Libya, Syria, etc.
Christoball
Christoball
3 years ago
Reply to  SmokeyIX
Ukraine has 72% of the population claiming Christianity. In this short video, who’s side God is on and which prayers will be answered. As always each and everyone of us makes mistakes. It is never too late to repent.
timbers
timbers
3 years ago
It’s interesting to see you and the media declare things like “Russia’s Shock and Awe Fails in Quagmire and Stiff Ukraine Resistance.” It’s as if the US is projecting all her past military failures onto Russia. Firstly, Russia doesn’t do shock and awe, at least not here. She doesn’t blow up big buildings for no particular reason that looks really cool on TV. She has precise narrowly defined objectives. Secondly, there is no quagmire as Russia seems to have already largely achieved all/most of her objectives save for mop up operations. The war is near over and the West can’t see that and declaring it a failed quagmire because “stiff resistance” from Uki soldiers fleeing advancing Russian forces.
davebarnes2
davebarnes2
3 years ago
Reply to  timbers
До свидания, толстый русский тролль
SmokeyIX
SmokeyIX
3 years ago
Reply to  timbers
Yeah, I wish the Russians hadn’t invaded but it does look like they’re capturing enormous amounts of land with minimal casualties on both sides.  Meanwhile, Zelensky in his Justin Trudeau-inspired camouflage LARP cosplay outfit is pressing 60-year-old men into service.  That isn’t what “winning” armies do.  I was watching a couple of Gonzalo Lira’s videos on YouTube.  He lives in Ukraine and he says a lot of his fat, out-of-shape middle-aged friends are currently in hiding because Zelensky is pressing old fat guys into service.
plashadpobedy
plashadpobedy
3 years ago
Reply to  SmokeyIX
Biden should raise recruitment age in the US to “no ceiling”, so everyone (of any age) can participate in the Ukraine war. Millennials in the US are chomping at the bit to cut their mettle in this patriotic war. Recruitment centers in the US are being swamped with recruits. But just remember, that you have to be “fully-vaxxed” to get in. In the mean time, all prospective freedom fighters, should read “From Here to Eternity” (1951) by James Jones. It tells you everything you need to know about army life. For the time it was written, the monthly pay for a “sojah” was US$21/month. That’s plenty of money to have a good time. Let’s go Brandon!!! See you at Ft. Bliss. 
William Janes
William Janes
3 years ago
Reply to  plashadpobedy
These Russian propagandist are crawling out from every dark corner to post.  Interesting.
KidHorn
KidHorn
3 years ago
Reply to  SmokeyIX
Didn’t Germany do the same in 44 and 45?
William Janes
William Janes
3 years ago
Reply to  timbers
Incorrect.   You thermobombed  Allepo , Syria, and made the city a shell.  You carpet bombed Chechnya till  it was rubble, and then hired a despicable tyrant to rule over it.   There is no limit to Putin’s brutality:  the new Stalin.
StukiMoi
StukiMoi
3 years ago
Reply to  William Janes
If UN, or even Ukranian (those guys would have no reason whatsoever to understate) civilian death tolls are even remotely accurate, what is most amazing about this invasion from a military execution POV, is rather how incredibly careful the Russians have been at targeting only military installations and targets.
130-350 civilian deaths in a span of 5-6 days…. The entire Red Army supposedly storming a giant country, yet they hardly even manage to keep up with an average night’s kill count by hoodlums in Chicago. Likely why Russia did not follow the US’ example to lead with massive aerial bombardment prior to a ground invasion. Since, as the US always end up being caught red handed demonstrating, even the fanciest bombs inevitably end up killing and maiming lots and lots of civilians when dropped in large enough numbers to be effective.
Comparing this to Aleppo and elsewhere in Syria, there is absolutely no doubt that, to Russian military decision makers and soldiers, to put it in popular terms: White Ukranian lives matter an awful lot more than brown Syrian ones. As well as an awful lot more than brown Iraqi ones matter to US war participants….
Even compared to recent US campaigns and invasions; again assuming death toll numbers are even remotely accurate: What The Brutal Tyrant(tm) is presiding over, is an incredibly restrained and precisely executed intervention. Not that being precise about it, somehow justifies bombing people and invading countries. Didn’t when America claimed it did. Doesn’t know. But this “ground invasion without initial aerial campaign” approach sure looks to set new standards, that anyone wishing to brag about “precision targeting” will have to meet in the future.
At least up until now, this seems to be the case. Any time you stick a hundred thousand heavily armed guys into cities, there’s always going to be the risk that they start getting scared for their own lives, once they can no longer effectively differentiate who is a true “civilian/non-participant” and who is out to kill them. Kind of like letting 100,000 cops loose in Watts with military weapons, if those cops start believing anyone with dark skin could well be a cop killing Crip….
KidHorn
KidHorn
3 years ago
I’m not sure this is good news. I would guess Russia could flatten Ukraine, but is trying to take control with limited damage. But if the war drags on, they make go full blitzkrieg. Killing a lot more than would otherwise be killed. I just want the war to end quickly.
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Reply to  KidHorn
They’d be killing soldiers and Russian citizens cousins, grandparents, relatives.  That will cut him off at the knees.  If he levels utilities and infrastructure, then assuming Putin gains control at sometime, he has to rebuild everything.
CristiC
CristiC
3 years ago
It is a false assumption, spread by UK and US propaganda, that Russia intended a shock and awe strategy. This is typical for someone that does not understand or spread misinformation. Shock and awe strategy that US used in Iraq simply destroyed the cities and the infrastructure. It put everything to the ground.
Russia never intended this. Because once you do this, there is no way you can negotiate a neutral status. You can only conquer Ukraine and we can see today that Iraq is not US ally.
Too bad people are talking nonsense. Russia only wants to kill ultra-nationalists and paramilitary units.
William Janes
William Janes
3 years ago
Reply to  CristiC
You do not mean they want to kill Russian Ultranationalist?  There will be enough Russian soldiers returning in coffins to the Russian homeland as it is.   Many Russian reservist never wanted to be in this invasion to begin with.
Doug78
Doug78
3 years ago

Just a
quick thought on gold. By cutting off Putin’s ability to use his hard currency
reserves gold would be a good way for him to pay for needed goods without
leaving much of a trace. That implies two things. Russia will pay with gold
which will increase the supply of physical gold on the world markets possibly
depressing the price. Two the gold window has certainly not been overlooked by
the Western powers. A large increase in gold prices would benefit Putin in
buying goods. Therefore the gold price will be managed to keep the gold price
from moving up excessively. Gold is pretty much a managed market already so it
will continue to be managed and not in Putin’s favor.

Scooot
Scooot
3 years ago
Reply to  Doug78
How would he deliver the Gold to his trading partners? 
Doug78
Doug78
3 years ago
Reply to  Scooot
Hand to hand. Very inefficient and slow. Russia would have to pay upfront, no credit with lots of delivery risks. There is a good reason why gold is no longer used as a medium of exchange. 
Scooot
Scooot
3 years ago
Reply to  Doug78
Risks to the trading partners too, as presumably they’d be breaching the sanctions. I’d guess the transactions would be “black market” so wouldn’t touch the exchanges and affect the price. 
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Reply to  Scooot
And how would he take delivery of what he brought with his gold?
KidHorn
KidHorn
3 years ago
Reply to  Doug78
There’s no way Russia is going to smuggle gold into another country piecemeal to buy goods. If they sold gold, it would be in mass to another central bank which would then hold it in reserve. They hold a lot of foreign currency. Wouldn’t it be a lot easier to trade with Euros than gold bars?
Scooot
Scooot
3 years ago
Reply to  KidHorn
They’re banned from trading with other Central Banks. They might be able to trade Euros outside of the swift system but they’d be a trail which would expose their counterparty to penalties for breaching the sanctions. They’re in a very difficult financial position. 
KidHorn
KidHorn
3 years ago
Reply to  Scooot
Not every country is supporting the sanctions. And not all transactions go through swift. Many of their bordering countries won’t impose sanctions.
Scooot
Scooot
3 years ago
Reply to  KidHorn
Then they’d be exposed to having sanctions imposed on them. Also I believe a lot of Russia’s reserves are held with the Bank for International Settlements so they can’t now access them. 
Anyway, it’s very difficult for Russia.
Doug78
Doug78
3 years ago

 

The Russian
military has shown to be unable to achieve their objectives by a long shot and
that has surprised a lot of people because the Russian military was supposed to
have been rejuvenated by Putin into a quasi-unbeatable machine full of
high-tech weapons and well-trained professional soldiers. Additionally it was
expected that the Russian Air Force would own the skies over Ukraine wiping out
the Ukraine airfields and shooting down the Ukrainian fighters and then
attacking Ukrainian ground forces. To be brief, the expectation was a Russian
version of American shock and awe but it turned out that the Russian did not produce
shock and consequently no awe.

The
weakness in the Russian military is becoming evident. First is that their
stocks of smart weapons are low so they have to use them sparingly. Second is
that their ability to furnish their front-line troops with food, ammunition and
gas is weaker than expected. The territory behind the front lines is not
controlled by the Russians but by the Ukrainians who piecemeal attack and
destroy supply columns bringing the means for the Russians. Consequently the
Russian tanks have little gas and little ammunition on hand and have to use
them sparingly. They have tried to takeover airports using air ported troops
but have failed with terrible losses so they cannot fly in supplies and must
make do using trucks driving over territory controlled by Ukraine special
force-lead partisan troops. As Napoleon said an army marches on its stomach.
Amateurs study strategy and tactics while professionals study logistics. No
supply equals no fight.

The
Ukrainians and their allies apparently knew exactly how to pull apart the
Russian military machine. First the Ukrainian command and control has not been
taken out by the Russians because they were ready. Secondly Nato with its
ability to gather real-time data on what is on the ground in Ukraine knows
exactly where the vulnerable supply vehicles are and can transmit to the
Ukrainian teams real-time who then know where and when to attack. Russia apparently
doesn’t have the means to block these communications.

Some say
that Russia will by necessity have to resort to the really destructive weapons,
ones that can level a city block, to regain the initiative. That might be so
but if that happens Nato will have widespread support to immediately take over
the air over Ukraine and destroy these weapons. Nato has the assets in place to
do that and are just waiting for the word. They already know where they are and
Nato air could take them out within hours.  

Putin has
lost and those around him know that already. Threatening Europe with nuclear
weapons backfired and was the last straw. All Europe is united and now wants
his blood and is going to get it.

I never
understood why some people thought Putin was playing 3-D chess. He plays judo:

 

https://d2lve7p4f3mpwb.cloudfront.net/assets/lhodahtvmgetfa3k5d09mfc1ztj4?83Mh6zFidOXhwrfcz6kkhDcfINqzSoiBES5rAHvP8fSJbwUjsViT_fFnCsxPR-eUyNg39lK25oKbB-JSe65l_kYjMQRyZ37kCXMMuKazRazqEPrRNEoURKuEzzUFfwKpSIE8MrwjStXfVqk–xr8EjB0Tw6X1LD2T6PApAY

Roadrunner12
Roadrunner12
3 years ago
Reply to  Doug78
Your post eerily reminds me of Vietnam, we’re winning and winning and winning and we got them where we want them and its just gonna be a bit more but now we need a little more  (Nato) because we’re winning.
Doug78
Doug78
3 years ago
Reply to  Roadrunner12
No. I was around at that time and the narrative was completely different. 
Roadrunner12
Roadrunner12
3 years ago
Reply to  Doug78
“No. I was around at that time and the narrative was completely different. “
Bullsh   it.
I forgot to add, to your narrative, and again to add to the Vietnam parallel, the enemy is so incompetent, he cant even put his boots on the right feet.
And again this is all about the US putting nuclear missiles less than 10 minutes from Moscow. Is it real imperative for Ukraine to be in Nato? No, but their is a definite drive to get them in.
thimk
thimk
3 years ago
Reply to  Doug78
excellent info
Kimbo252
Kimbo252
3 years ago
Mish,
I thought you would have done your home work, and not just believe the msm propaganda narrative spewed out.
Try this site for some clarity.
Russia is on the move again now.
Roadrunner12
Roadrunner12
3 years ago
Reply to  Kimbo252
The first casualty of war is the truth. The MSM propoganda machine is in overdrive.
This is Russias Cuban missile crisis. Sit back and think for a bit, is it really a safer world if US can put nuclear missiles less than 10 minutes from Moscow?
The US is so concerned about Ukraines soverereignty that it has to place  nuclear missiles in Ukraine.
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Reply to  Roadrunner12
It would be hard to believe that we don’t have nuke missiles in satellites that could be let go whenever we choose. 
William Janes
William Janes
3 years ago
Reply to  Roadrunner12
Please stop the propaganda link.  Russia is on the retreat.   The next question is who will instigate the Coup?  My money is on Medvedev.
jhrodd
jhrodd
3 years ago
Reply to  Kimbo252
It really is disappointing.  Mish has it completely backward.
denker
denker
3 years ago
I can wholeheartedly agree with the pacifist/isolationist Mish (for a change)!
thimk
thimk
3 years ago
IS this the end of the “NEW GREEN DEAL” –Russia-Ukraine War Must End the Failed Globalist Agenda and Dump Biden’s Costly Greenie Weenie Manifesto . 
Biden’s fatal  mistake:
caradoc-again
caradoc-again
3 years ago
Putin believed his own bullshit and the bullshit he was fed by others.
A lesson for everyone.
Ziad
Ziad
3 years ago
Isn’t it a bit premature to say Russia failed after just 4 days? So far they have taken second city, Kharkov, a number of towns along the Black Sea, Kiev is surrounded, and they did it with (compared to US invasions) very minimal civilian and even Ukrainian military casualties.
And Negotiations haven’t even started yet. Let’s see what confessions the Ukrainian side is prepared to make before calling it a loss for Russia.
caradoc-again
caradoc-again
3 years ago
Reply to  Ziad
He’s toast. Might take a while to see the back of him but he’s embarrassed himself massively and Russia. No easy way out and even the military will turn on him given enough time bogged down in a war with a questionable prize. Bridges burnt.
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Reply to  caradoc-again
I’m impressed with all the people in Russia, who despite the threats of prison time and black check son their social records, continue to protest this war.
Ziad
Ziad
3 years ago
Reply to  caradoc-again
You’ve made a testable hypothesis. In a few weeks,
1) Putin will either be “Toast”
2) The current Ukrainian government will ask for a ceasefire, offering a written guarantee never to join NATO or allow western troops in Ukraine. Which is precisely what Russia’s objective always was.
3) Russia is bogged down on a costly guerilla war, or
4) They just annex the eastern half of the country and leave the western half to its own fate (likely gobbled up by Poland and Hungary.)
Let’s come back in a while and see which of us has been closest to the truth.
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Reply to  Ziad
It’s like when they call an election at 8:10pm.
Jackula
Jackula
3 years ago
Notable that Chairman Xi mentioned that the solution is Ukraine being a neutral country and all hostilities should stop immediately. While I’m no fan of the CCP he is showing a level of world leadership beyond the deranged western leadership we have today. A long time ago I learned in a fight you don’t have to win, you only have to make the fight painful enough for your antagonist that they will come to the table to hammer out terms. Unlike the Afghani puppets we were supporting Zelensky showed he is no p*ssy and a helluva wartime leader as well and it will be very expensive to take Ukraine, especially when armed to the teeth with stingers, precision anti-tank rockets, drones and the like. Putin expected a run and hide reaction out of Zelensky and made a huge miscalculation, this may cause him the leadership position of the Russian Federation if it continues to play out the way it looks like it is going to.
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
3 years ago
Reply to  Jackula
The beauty of it all is not a single American soldier had to fight and the US , maybe for the first time in history, fought a war purely on technological means. While countries like Russia were fighting with 20th century strategies and tactics, it looks like Ukraine (which has a VERY smart citizenry that is as technologically capable as anyone anywhere), took the help the of the 21st century tactics of the west where they needed the most, and continues to fight their own battle.  
Doug78
Doug78
3 years ago
Bingo
Ron Cataldi
Ron Cataldi
3 years ago
Reply to  Jackula
Why should Russia be able to dictate what its neighboring sovereign states do? Is former membership in the USSR to be a badge of dishonor, that precludes these former satellite states from self-determination?
Johnson1
Johnson1
3 years ago
I am guessing the U.S. and all other NATO countries are supplying Ukraine with high tech satellite tracking and other types of high tech surveillance so that the Ukrainians now where all the Russian troops and armor is currently located and where they are heading.
Now everyone and his brother is supplying Ukraine with anti-tank and anti-air weapons….I think Russia will lose this battle. 
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
3 years ago
Reply to  Johnson1
I read they were supplied with a bunch of drones by Turkey that could fire anti-tank missiles. I think we will learn a lot of about this war after it is over but it appears Russia is still fighting the way they did in Afghanistan in the 1970s with very poor training and overall capabilities while having advanced weapons while Ukraine is fighting the smarter battle. Russia will be set back to the economy of the 1970s and 1980s after all is said and done and an economy that is isolated until they have free and fair elections and a system of democracy. Any lifting of sanctions should have this and Putin’s resignation along with arrest and being tried as a war criminal in the Hague.  Whatever happens, Putin comes out the loser here along with his oligarchs who will be bankrupted by this.  The Russian people will suffer. It feels like we have been shot back to the late 70s or early 80s. Putin was thought to be smart but the truth will come out about what actually happen to him the last 2 years. My guess is he only has a few years to live and he did this to accelerate the path he wanted to Russia to go down.
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
3 years ago
Here is an example of Drones firing a missile at Russian trucks and tanks. This is literally 21st century vs 20th century warfare. The Russian soldiers look like they were caught off guard. 
Christoball
Christoball
3 years ago

Israel refuses to join 87 countries in backing a U.S.-led
resolution to condemn Russia’s invasion of Ukraine at the UN Security
Council on Friday.

Israel has attempted to maintain good relations with both Russia and Ukraine during the crisis, and has offered to mediate a truce.

It sounds like this might be useful. Perhaps they can foment a de-militarized zone in the Ukraine. No Nato or Russian forces.
whirlaway
whirlaway
3 years ago
Reply to  Christoball
India has decided to stay neutral as well.  And so has the UAE.   
Jack
Jack
3 years ago
Reply to  Christoball
Russians would only stand aside if they had a puppet government in Ukraine.
A demilitarized zone in Ukraine would only ensure Putin had total control of their neighbour.
Would need to also demilitarize Russia for this to work.
StukiMoi
StukiMoi
3 years ago
Reply to  Jack
Russia seems perfectly OK with Finland’s current status.
It’s not as if the US is only content with a “puppet government” in Mexico. They just don’t want a government there, which is hellbent on hosting as much Russian and Chinese rocketry as they can get their hands on. Nor do they want a Russian naval base in Tijuana and a Chinese one down the coast.
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Reply to  Christoball
Time to cut off Israel’s annual handout from the USA.
StukiMoi
StukiMoi
3 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
It has always been the time to cut off anyone, anywhere’s handouts from the USA. Something which will never change.
Democritus
Democritus
3 years ago
Reply to  Christoball
It would be the height of cynicism if Israel would condemn grabbing land and bombing people! That whole nation is built upon it.
Carl_R
Carl_R
3 years ago
As an interesting side affair, there is apparently a cyber war going on. The hacker group, “anonymous” has declared war on Russia, and has apparently taken down RT, at least at times, and some government websites, and replaced the content with the Ukrainian flag and Ukrainian music. Meanwhile, Russian hackers/ransom wear specialists, have attacked Ukraine, and have declared they will hunt down anonymous. I have no idea what, if anything, all of this will amount to.
ohno
ohno
3 years ago
I don’t know if any of this is good news or not?  Had(not over yet) Ukraine fallen fast mission accomplished(maybe) but now we have the problem and worry of exactly how far is Putin willing to go?  Will it now just drag out and get more nasty by the minute with Putin refusing defeat at any costs?
Also, I’ve seen several people claim multiple biological warfare? labs near the Russian border that were all destroyed.  I haven’t researched this and was wondering if any of you could verify this one way or another.
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Reply to  ohno
Putin can only go so far before people in his government stage a coup.  
conservativeprof
conservativeprof
3 years ago
An unprovoked attack against a peaceful country. Putin = Hitler. The world clearly understands the threat of Russian aggression with this barbaric attack and ugly threats to level Europe. Most likely, most Russians do not support this invasion, but Putin’s terror will likely suppress opposition. Unfortunately, retaliatory actions against Putin cannot be separated from the entire Russian country. Until Russia stops and renounces this senseless and brutal invasion, boycott everything Russian, expel Russian diplomats, and send arms and supplies to the brave people of Ukraine. Death to the Russian invaders!
whirlaway
whirlaway
3 years ago
Can you please clarify that you are not parodying the TDS-afflicted DONORcrat Party fans?   Because it does look like it!
conservativeprof
conservativeprof
3 years ago
Reply to  whirlaway
I speak for myself. I am a conservative so I detest Democrats. Democrat weakness enabled Putin’s madness.
Jack
Jack
3 years ago
Reply to  whirlaway
In case you have not noticed, real people are fighting for their lives and country.
Not sure why you bring this back to partisan American politics.
whirlaway
whirlaway
3 years ago
Reply to  Jack
Expanding NATO eastward has bipartisan support in the US.    It was 0-bama who got rid of Ukraine’s democratically elected government in a violent coup in 2014, and it was Trump who armed Ukraine against Russia and dangerously escalated tensions between the US and Russia.   But both the parties cast each other in a negative light.  The DONORcrats call the Republicans “puppets” of Putin and the Republicans label the DONORcrats as being “weak”.   
Jack
Jack
3 years ago
Reply to  whirlaway
Each party did what they felt was the best option at the time with the data at hand – for better or worse.
Let’s stop the blame game – the past the past – let’s move on.
jhrodd
jhrodd
3 years ago
This is not a USA style “Kill anything that moves” operation.  As Gonzalo Lira points out Russian troops have virtually tiptoed into the Country. They want to change the regime not destroy the infrastructure or antagonize the civilian population.  If Russia wanted to utterly destroy the Country they would have no trouble, they own the airspace.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1vdiEABLFoo
Jack
Jack
3 years ago
Reply to  jhrodd
I do not think even Putin believes a failed state (or province) next door is in Russia’s best interest.
They do seem to be tiptoeing but for how long – they took out gas and oil depots last night.
Electricity and water is still flowing.
Doug78
Doug78
3 years ago
Reply to  jhrodd
A video from a guy called “coach red pill”?  
GodfreeRoberts
GodfreeRoberts
3 years ago
The EU will prolong the conflict at no cost to its members, in order to ingratiate itself with its military occupiers. The EU is morally and ideologically bankrupt.
If China staged a coup in Mexico, installed a hostile puppet regime and funneled weapons to it, and the regime shelled Texas, New Mexico and California for 5 years and killed 15,000 American citizens, then every government member would call it a provocative act of aggression and, correctly, invoke our nation’s right to protect itself. We firebombed Panama City for  much, much less.
Russia had the full legal right to invade the Ukraine from several perspectives: to defend its allies in Donetsk and Lugansk; to defend itself against Ukrainian WMDs, which the Ukrainian president threatened to start producing at the Munich Security Conference; and to stop NATO from continuing its advance toward Russian borders in violation of its previous commitment of “not an inch to the east.” Russia exercised its right of self-defense under article 51 of part 7 of the UN Charter. The Ukraine had forfeited its right to territorial integrity under the 1970 UN Declaration by refusing to honor the rights of its Russian-speaking population. It also refused to renew its Friendship Treaty with Russia and therefore no longer had a defined border with Russia that Russia was obligated to honor.
Irondoor
Irondoor
3 years ago
Reply to  GodfreeRoberts

You may say that Russia has all those “rights”. But it can’t dictate the outcome unless it resorts to nuclear weapons of some type. That would mean WWIII and involve all the nuclear powers. The entire free world is now stepping up against Putin and his brutality. I hope Xi is warning him not to go there. 

So, we’ve gone from Russia and China being hosts of the Olympics to the brink of World War. Madness.
whirlaway
whirlaway
3 years ago
Reply to  Irondoor
Whether Russia has the right to do it or not, the fact is that the situation has devolved to this state because of incessant US/NATO provocations in the region over the last 20+ years.     
conservativeprof
conservativeprof
3 years ago
Reply to  whirlaway
Nonsense. This barbaric invasion is the action of a madman. Putin = Hitler.
StukiMoi
StukiMoi
3 years ago
While barbaric, and perhaps even mad; it is still orders of magnitude LESS of both, than the US invasions of Iraq, Afghanistan, Vietnam and anywhere else much, much further away from any conceivable “security buffer zone” than Ukraine is to Russia.
NATO presence in Ukraine, is no different, in any way, from unlimited Russian and Chinese military presence, including a nuclear umbrella, in Mexico. Russia is no more, nor less, “mad and barbaric” for opposing the former, than the US would be for opposing the latter.
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Reply to  Irondoor
If Russia tries to go nuclear, do you think they are really going to try and lob missiles our way?  Or will they shoot their missiles at Europe?  The world wind blows west to east.  The radioactive cloud might wind up over Russia.  Or China and they won’t be happy about that.  If they shoot the missiles at us, we will shoot most of them down.  Some will get through.  But a lot more of ours will hit Russia, making large parts unlivable for decades.  And the country will be divided up, their remaining nukes taken away and hey will never again be allowed to to be a large state.
Jack
Jack
3 years ago
Reply to  GodfreeRoberts
Are you saying Poroshenko and Zelenskiy were not democratically elected?
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Reply to  GodfreeRoberts
You’re delusional.
Christoball
Christoball
3 years ago
The best possible outcome for Ukraine and the world at large would be for this region to become somewhat of a de-militarized zone. No Nato, and no Russian presence.
Jack
Jack
3 years ago
Reply to  Christoball
I like it – are you going to tell Putin to demilitarize?
Christoball
Christoball
3 years ago
Reply to  Jack
I would reason with him; but short of Chuck Norris, I don’t think anyone could”tell” him what to do.

Israel refuses to join 87 countries in backing a U.S.-led
resolution to condemn Russia’s invasion of Ukraine at the UN Security
Council on Friday.

Israel has attempted to maintain good
relations with both Russia and Ukraine during the crisis, and has
offered to mediate a truce.

It sounds like this might be useful. Perhaps they can foment a de-militarized zone in the Ukraine. No Nato or Russian forces.
StukiMoi
StukiMoi
3 years ago
Reply to  Jack
Suggesting Mexico is to not host Russian and Chinese missiles pointed at US targets; is a bit different than suggesting the US demilitarize, isn’t it?
When you have 3 ostensible nuclear “superpowers,” each about as far away fro eachother as they can get on the globe: The three of them NOT placing military equipment in 3rd party countries right up on the borders of the others, is just basic prudential strategic management of a limited size planet.
goldguy
goldguy
3 years ago
Once you understand that 10% is for the big guy, it all makes sense.
TheWindowCleaner
TheWindowCleaner
3 years ago
I would love to see this be a huge loss for Putin, but unfortunately outcomes are still undetermined. However, Ukraine is a large country and 44 million people will be almost impossible to supress forever. My wife is Romanian and we are impressed by the charity of Romanians and Polish in welcoming refugees with open hands and hearts. The Ukrainians are worthy of our highest admiration for their courage so far. Let us hope for the best possible result…the end of Putin’s reign and a possible move toward detente as a result. 
Tberend
Tberend
3 years ago
If people want to contemplate Putins 4-d chess here, maybe he did this to prove that NATO would grant de-facto membership to Ukraine. At that point, he would try to justify his security concerns. We have to remember that the energy card hasn’t been played yet. Its also probably pointless to speculate as outsiders
Six000mileyear
Six000mileyear
3 years ago
Reply to  Tberend
The world has seen Putin play 3D chess when he points out instances of US hypocrisy on the global stage. His arguments are spot on. Using Belarus as a launch point for an attack from the North is consistent with a well thought plan. The 3D chess game starts to fall apart considering the use of a ground assault to create shock and awe when US forces in the middle east had great success opening with an aerial attack supported from the ground. So either a massive aerial attack is coming, or COVID prevented the build-up of air-air and air-surface missiles.  The fundamental decision to attack Ukraine makes no logical sense and appears to serve the purpose of stroking Putin’s ego.
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Reply to  Six000mileyear
If Belarus gets actively involved, they will also face heavy sanctions and will be less able than Russia to hold out against them.
ajc1970
ajc1970
3 years ago
I don’t understand what’s going on with Russia in the Ukraine.
Recognizing that puts me light years ahead of most of you.

https://twitter.com/Cernovich/status/1498011961321136130

whirlaway
whirlaway
3 years ago
I now see some TDS-afflicted DONORcrat fans saying the same things.   But they also maintain that everyone is in danger because Putin could be another Hitler!  

So, which is it?   Putin failed miserably at the very first hurdle?  OR, Putin is a mad strongman that will conquer all of Eastern Europe?   It can’t be both!   

Ron Cataldi
Ron Cataldi
3 years ago
Reply to  whirlaway
What Putin intends =/= what Putin gets
Putin intends to conquer … Putin is failing miserably
Not mutually exclusive
Think harder
Green_Squirrel
Green_Squirrel
3 years ago
Do not assume nor take for granted that the initial shock and awe has failed.
Russia Generals are not stupid, they have not sent in their best/elite troops yet.
They first sent in their lower level combat troops, as a probing exercise to get a feel where there would 
be the most resistance.
Now that they know where the most  troubling hotspots are, you can expect a much more bloody campaign
and total annihilation of where the Ukrainian troops are hiding out.
Putin is just taking a break to extend the hand of peace to the President of Ukraine, that they surrender.
Most likely after the peace talks fail, the Second wave of shock and awe is going to be much more deadly.
Now that the Russian Generals know exactly where to hit them.
whirlaway
whirlaway
3 years ago
Reply to  Green_Squirrel
I agree with you that people are jumping to conclusions a bit too quickly.    What if this is a ploy on the part of Putin to claim that he is the more reasonable party in the conflict?    
Ron Cataldi
Ron Cataldi
3 years ago
Reply to  whirlaway
Squirrel is spinning so fast that he attracted a whirlaway
Greenmountain
Greenmountain
3 years ago
Reply to  Green_Squirrel
I agree – no humanity will come from Putin.  But Ukrainia has shown us what courage looks like.  I wish I could join them, but send every energy I have.
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Reply to  Green_Squirrel
“Now that they know where the most  troubling hotspots are, you can expect a much more bloody campaign
and total annihilation of where the Ukrainian troops are hiding out.”
Nope.  Russia/Ukraine is a special situation since there are close family ties between peoples in both countries.

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