Covid Tracking Project: How Long to 1 Million US Cases?

Covid Tracking Project

Inquiring minds are investigating a relatively new data feed from the Covid Tracking Project.

I plot four data series for the US: Negative tests, positive tests,hospitalized, and deaths.

Hospitalizations

Arguably, hospitalizations are the most significant column but the project only has two days worth of data.

Once I have another data point or two, I will plot a trendline manually.

Trendlines

  • At the current pace, the number of positive coronavirus cases would hit 100,000 on March 26, and 1,000,000 on April 3.
  • At the current pace, the number of coronavirus deaths would hit 1,000 on March 26, and 10,000 on April 5.

Those are not my projections, those are observations of what would happen if the current trends last that long at the same pace.

Goldman Projects GDP Decline Worse Than Great Depression

On March 20, I reported Goldman Projects a Catastrophic GDP Decline Worse than Great Depression

Key Points

  1. Goldman Sachs economists forecast a historically sharp and swift recession, with second-quarter GDP sinking a stunning 24% after a 6% decline in the first quarter.
  2. The economists had expected a decline of 5% in the second quarter, after a flat first quarter but they said social distancing measures have affected many sectors of the economy and will hit the first and second quarter hard.
  3. The economists still expect a spring back in the third quarter, of 12%, but they see unemployment peaking at 9%.

Morgan Stanley -31% Annualized GDP in the Second Quarter

If you open up the article it sounds impossibly rosy.

Morgan Stanley economists said the coronavirus will inflict a deeper recession on the U.S. than previously expected, including a record 30.1% drop in gross domestic product in the second quarter.

Less than a week since forecasting a 4% contraction in April through June, the economists led by Ellen Zentner said they now anticipated a steeper drop and that unemployment will average 12.8% and consumption will fall 31% in the quarter.

The Morgan Stanley team predicts GDP will fall 2.4% in the current quarter, but will begin to recover in the third quarter. Overall, they project the U.S. economy to contract 2.3% on a fourth quarter to fourth quarter basis in 2020, taking full-year global growth down to just 0.3%.

A 30% decline in a quarter but year-over-year almost even!

What the hell are they thinking? Or Smoking?

9% of the US Has Been Laid Off Due to the Coronavirus

A SurveyUSA poll shows 9% of the US Has Been Laid Off Due to the Coronavirus

I crunched the numbers based on those poll stats and come up with a U3 unemployment rate of 12% and a U6 rate of 39.7%. See the link for details and calculations.

Conclusion: Goldman is way too optimistic on the unemployment rate.

Mike “Mish” Shedlock

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Mish

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Herkie
Herkie
4 years ago

How Long to 1 Million US Cases?

Is this a pool Mish because if it is I will put a tenner on March 28.

BillinCA
BillinCA
4 years ago

Regarding the trajectory of US cases, I thought that China was on the same path last month and I was sure they’d hit 100,000 and then 1 million shortly after. Then, quite unexpectedly to me (and others), the line curved and is now sideways. They never hit 100,000 confirmed cases. I am curious how the US chart above compares to the same data at the same point in time (say 100 or 500 cases) as cases in China and when we might (hope) for a bend in the trend. (I understand that data from China is suspect, but there are few credible sources who doubt the Chinese change in infected trajectory)

rg50
rg50
4 years ago

You no longer can rely on real numbers for Covid 19 as they aren’t testing anyone unless they are critically ill.

rg50
rg50
4 years ago

Unfortunately, we are already past 1 million positive in US. We are 40k that are confirmed a week ago. Harvard Med believes the real # is whatever the confirmed multiply by 50 .. that’s the number a week ago..

egilkinc
egilkinc
4 years ago

How long to 1 Billion cases worldwide?

Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Reply to  egilkinc

How about 7 billion?

WE ALL GONNA DIE!!!

Helene84
Helene84
4 years ago

I think the Netherlands has the right approach. Let the young and healthy get infected and build immunity while keeping the old and infirm under quarantine. It is unlikely that this virus can be contained for long without extremely draconian measures. But if you keep children quarantined for the year or two it will take to get the population vaccinated, they are not getting exposed to the germs that they need to build up their immune systems. We will end up with a generation at higher risk of bad infections. Also, what if Covid mutates into something more dangerous to young people, like the the Spanish Flu did? We will wish they had gotten this strain.

NewUlm
NewUlm
4 years ago

This not raw numbers pandemic, demographics MATTER and health matters. Basically, if you are under 50 (or health in your 50s) with no co-morbidity the mortality rate will be .01-.02%, which in the H1N1 range and then you will have immunity – and if you don’t have immunity than NO vaccine will ever work. It’s the 60+ and those with high blood pressure, diabetes, COPD and heart issues that will clog the hospitals.

I can’t say I am a huge fan of Isreal, but they looked at the demographic numbers, what it takes to get immunity and have a better plan: link to youtu.be

Also, with the number – we have empirical evidence from Diamond Princess that 30% of cases, even an aged demographic are asymptomatic and study of kids out of Wuhan show nearly 50% will be asymptomatic – shutting down everyone will slow down the issue, but hospitals will be clogged just the same, 6 wks down the road – because we really never know who has it.

Then, we should put healthy folks back to work and send kids to school, and MASSIVELY support those who have to bug in, it would be waaay cheaper than the Trillion a month we are going to spend badly with current efforts.

djh860
djh860
4 years ago

Because they are sending test kits first to highly infected locations, the number infected and more importantly the percentage infected will make Covid 19 look like a super bug. Later when testing is more broadly available it will come back down to earth. They we will realize that chicken little was in charge all along .

ohno
ohno
4 years ago

So today Trump is talking about easing restrictions and getting people back to work??????? WTF! On friday Kansas City had a big news conference telling everyone that rumors of a lockdown were bogus and to turn anyone in that is spreading misinfo. On saturday Kansas City announced lockdown(the typical limited scope). LOL experts at building trust for sure. Of course, now that they have open ended qe maybe they dont care if we go out and die? I’ll stop speculating only me will tell.

WildBull
WildBull
4 years ago

The good thing about the war powers law is that the FDA will have its wings clipped in its power to pick winners and losers. I’m convinced that the FDA impeded test development in order to favor certain vendors.

Zardoz
Zardoz
4 years ago
Reply to  WildBull

Now trump is free to favor his cronies.

MiTurn
MiTurn
4 years ago

This guy is a Nobel Prize winner (chemistry) and his take on the course of the outbreak is compelling. He seems to think it will be over sooner than later (say, weeks, not months). A thought anyhow.

Now, how does this effect the markets and the economy? We don’t know. But getting this over with sooner will always be better than later.

MATHGAME
MATHGAME
4 years ago
Reply to  MiTurn

I see two possible problems with Levitt’s analysis …
(1) He believes the numbers out of China … let’s hope we can believe the numbers from any/every other country
(2) “He’s not focusing on the total number of cases in a country, but on the number of new cases identified every day — and especially on the percentage growth in that number from one day to the next.” … i.e. he is assuming that the number of new cases identified every day is reliable, apparently not considering that testing, even in countries with far better testing than the US has had, might not have kept pace with the actual spread of the virus.

I am certainly praying that Levitt and any other person espousing the “rose-colored glasses” view are proven correct. But there are an awful lot of assumptions about the reliability of the data, at this early juncture, and with so many political reasons to “fudge” data, underlying that view…

WildBull
WildBull
4 years ago

As long as industry is stepping up voluntarily, the orange one’s tactics are correct. If it isn’t distributed, it doesn’t scale. Better to have thousands of minds working on this than to have central planners at the federal level deciding who builds what. Central planning has been so successful over the last 100 years or so. (NOT!!!) Better to have a horse race to see who can build the most ventilators the fastest.

Tony Bennett
Tony Bennett
4 years ago

“What the hell are they thinking? Or Smoking?”

Exactly.

The economy is CRATERING NOW. There will be no quick bounce back as many many small businesses will be wiped out … along with the zombie corporations. It will take years to rebuild.

Did not watch too much tv this weekend, but what “experts” I saw predicted a “light switch” V of economy when virus passes … of course, stated and / or implied – Don’t Sell … RE / stocks / whatever will be back to old valuations within a few years.

Dead wrong. Deflation on tap.

CautiousObserver
CautiousObserver
4 years ago
Reply to  Tony Bennett

Fed going all in…huge amounts of open-ended daily QE…buying corporate bond ETFs in the secondary market. Does that change your forecast?

Tony Bennett
Tony Bennett
4 years ago

No

Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Reply to  Tony Bennett

In every recession, there is always some group of stakeholders predicting a V recovery. I don’t believe we will see that type of recovery.

crazyworld
crazyworld
4 years ago

A PLAN TO GET AMERICA BACK TO WORK

Very simple find a drug which prevent most of the severe cases to happen. So the pandemic could follow its curse like a bad cold or flu we get each year and hospitals will be less loaded with critical cases.. Also with a milder outcome the consumers fear will be alleviated.

Nobody has found that drug so far. But every country is searching and a preventive drug could be discovered and proved reliable any month now. It could be chloroquine (preventively) or Garlic extract raw or fermented (Korean eat that everyday, and Japanese use that a lot as well) or curry (India) or preferably for labs some patentable molecule. That could reduce containment measures a lot and allow resuming most service activities.
Some Asian countries have less critical cases and less death than others but they contain anyway to some extends (quarantine, direct closure of a factory (temporarily for cleaning) when infected people are detected, and more), because they have to still treat the patients with serious symptoms in their hospitals in order not for those to become critical and eventually die..
I am still looking at the results China is getting each time they try to suppress containment measures. No encouraging results so far.

Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago
Reply to  crazyworld

There isn’t going to be any kind of preventative drug. Corona is like the flu. It mutates rapidly. We have a flu vaccine that only works 30-60% of the time on average because of ho the flu also mutates.

Jojo
Jojo
4 years ago

The tide is turning. Many big “names” are coming out of the woodwork, saying that stopping the economy is not an acceptable solution to COVID-19. Friedman below writes expansively on how to get the economy going again. Meanwhile, Trump issued a tweet on Sunday hinting that he will end the lockdown within the next 2 weeks (probably because he realizes that the longer it goes on, the lower his chances of being reelected)

A Plan to Get America Back to Work
Some experts say it can be done in weeks, not months — and the economy and public health are at stake.
By Thomas L. Friedman
March 22, 2020

These are days that test every leader — local, state and national. They are each being asked to make huge life and death decisions, while driving through a fog, with imperfect information, and everyone in the back seat shouting at them. My heart goes out to them all. I know they mean well. But as so many of our businesses shut down and millions begin to be laid off, some experts are beginning to ask: “Wait a minute! What the hell are we doing to ourselves? To our economy? To our next generation? Is this cure — even for a short while — worse than the disease?’’

I share these questions. Our leaders are not flying completely blind: They are working off the advice of serious epidemiologists and public health experts. Yet we still need to be careful about “group think,’’ which is a natural but dangerous reaction when responding to a national and global crisis. We’re making decisions that affect the whole country and our entire economy — therefore, small errors in navigation could have huge consequences.

….

Scooot
Scooot
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo

Those same people will be very quiet soon!

Redwashere
Redwashere
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo

Never trust an expert.

Redwashere
Redwashere
4 years ago
Reply to  Jojo

Never trust an expert.

Mish
Mish
4 years ago

“At least 1,800 people are hospitalized, with at least 450 people in the ICU.”

This is precisely the problem, not the deaths

_will
_will
4 years ago
Reply to  Mish

Under what circumstances is stopping an economy worth it for 450 people? Compare that to flu deaths and its a drop in the bucket.

Mish
Mish
4 years ago
Reply to  Mish

This is not stopping the economy to save 450 people
This is stopping the economy so that millions do not end up in the hospital.

When it works, total jackasses will say “see I told you so”

_will
_will
4 years ago
Reply to  Mish

When should we expect millions in the hospital Mish? You have a theory that’s not testable, you can’t be wrong by your own assumptions. The outbreak is at least 60 days old, assume R0 of 2. Let’s do a doubling time of 4 days – that’s 15 doubling periods. 2^15 = 32768. That assumes only one infected patient got off the plane two months ago, we know that’s not the case. Let’s assume only 200 people entered the US infected, which seems low. We would expect to have 6.5 million infections now, 13 million in 4 days, 26 million in 8 days, 52 million in 12 days, 104 million in 14 days, 208 million in 16 days and by summer every particle in the universe should be infected.

jfpersona1
jfpersona1
4 years ago
Reply to  _will

“We would expect to have 6.5 million infections now, 13 million in 4 days, 26 million in 8 days, 52 million in 12 days, 104 million in 14 days, 208 million in 16 days and by summer every particle in the universe should be infected.”

Yes, Yes — you sure showed him. Moron.

Eventually you run out of ‘infectible’ people and the equation changes because it now depends not just on population in general, but population that isn’t immune. However, by the time you make it this far, you have millions infected, millions needing hospitalization (which cannot be provided) and millions dead.

But at least at that point you will be correct that we won’t have “millions in the hospital” because we can’t physically do that. So hurray for you, I guess.

Mish
Mish
4 years ago
Reply to  Mish

I am seriously tired of people who cannot understand exponential charts even when put in front of their noses.

marg54
marg54
4 years ago
Reply to  Mish

You must be Mish but those of us that do understand them, are very grateful for the information.

mrutkaus
mrutkaus
4 years ago
Reply to  Mish

So this is God’s Logarithm 101 Class. After school everyone will understand them.

Mish
Mish
4 years ago

“Naive exponential models say the health care system should already have melted down.”

Yet another fool does not understand the exponential models.

Not a one of them said the health care system should have “already” melted down – but Italy is on the verge now

The US will be there in a few more doubles but the model does NOT predict that. It only says we will be there IF the path continues as it has.

Perhaps it doesn’t. But idiots still dismiss the chance it will.

_will
_will
4 years ago
Reply to  Mish

Italy is on the verge because 99% of patients have pre-existing conditions, 50% with three or more serious pre-existing conditions and an average age of 80. Anything can kill people that weak, it’s silly to stop society for them. The bug has been here since January, no policing of borders meant people have been flying in for months with it. Model it out over 60 days, how many cases should we have now? How many already should have been in the ICU?

Casual_Observer
Casual_Observer
4 years ago
Reply to  _will

The virus hasn’t been here for months. Maybe 1.5. Travel out of China was restricted in early January.

Casual_Observer
Casual_Observer
4 years ago
Reply to  _will

About 70% of American adults have preexisting conditions also.

WebSurfinMurf
WebSurfinMurf
4 years ago
Reply to  _will

Majority of Americans, are not obese (60%) and under age 45 (60%). The other 40% …. move along!

njbr
njbr
4 years ago

.
@realDonaldTrump
confirms he’s offered COVID19 tests to North Korea, Iran and other countries suffering from pandemic

_will
_will
4 years ago

link to youtube.com – the doomers are out in full force but remember that this virus has been circulating since early January in the states. Naive exponential models say the health care system should already have melted down. It’s very likely the virus is much less deadly than thought, most people already got it, had little or no symptoms and never thought anything of it. Or even if they were sick, didn’t go to the hospital. Until recently testing wasn’t available, so even if they had a severe case it wouldn’t have been noted.

njbr
njbr
4 years ago
Reply to  _will

Do you feel lucky?

In 1 week this will be proven right or wrong….

There’s a stock market out there waitingfor your cash.

Casual_Observer
Casual_Observer
4 years ago
Reply to  njbr

Do you think in 1 week we will know ? That is not how viruses work. They mutate , get stronger or weaker based on humidity and temperature and come back in different forms. This is the 3rd major strain of coronavirus.

_will
_will
4 years ago

Natural selection makes viruses less deadly. They need asymptomatic or minor cases to survive. If all cases were severe, or even most – this would already be done.

JonSellers
JonSellers
4 years ago
Reply to  _will

Yes, but viruses don’t get to choose how they evolve. If you kill the 20% of the population that doesn’t breed (older folks) and leave the younger to go about their lives, you can still be a very effective, happy virus.

Casual_Observer
Casual_Observer
4 years ago
Reply to  _will

Anecdotal data from my wife who is a doctor and reads every minute of every day on this says hospitals are in large metro areas like New York and LA are having a capacity problem in the ER and ICU. Most of the country hasnt felt it yet but I suspect we get multiple ups and downs through this summer. Then by late summer we will get treatments that are known to work in preparation for the fall. All my sources say 6 months from now life will he back to normal but months is a long time. Expect worse than 9/11 economically. Also expect deaths in the thousands like 9/11.

_will
_will
4 years ago

link to bloomberg.com – this illness is deadly to those with multiple pre-existing conditions, but so are most viruses. This ranks closer to bad flu

Carl_R
Carl_R
4 years ago
Reply to  _will

njbr is right. That’s the great thing about the stock market. It reflects the collective wisdom. If you are smarter that the market, you’ll be a millionaire. Just put your money where your mouth is, and if you are right, you’ll be rich. You only lose if you are wrong.

Casual_Observer
Casual_Observer
4 years ago
Reply to  _will

This is not about death. It is about sustainability of the medical system. Having 1 ventilators for 8 people who need it like Italy is a disaster. Right now if we dont bend the curve the US will need 200k ventilators. The country has about 6000. So about 194k people will die.

Stuki
Stuki
4 years ago
Reply to  _will

Certainly an different perspective. Backed up by what seems like a unique, and very comprehensive, testing and followup regimen for the 10,000 tests he referred to.

Blindly betting that “the difference” between almost undetectable outcomes, and what went on in Wuhan and is currently going on in Italy, Spain and increasingly elsewhere, is just air pollution level differences between Germany and Italy, seems pretty reckless, though. At a minimum, he should then go back and see if his own material shows enormous differences in mortality between people living in high air pollution locales (near roads) and lower pollution ones. As well as people in high vs low exposure professions.

njbr
njbr
4 years ago

CALABASAS, CA (WENY) — Discount tool and equipment retailer Harbor Freight is joining the fight against COVID-19.

The retailer announced it will donate its entire supple of personal protective equipment (PPE) items to front line hospitals with 24 hour emergency rooms in areas where there is a Harbor Freight store.

The PPE items being donated include:

  • N95 masks
  • Face shields
  • 5 and 7 mil Nitrile gloves

Hospitals with 24 hour ER departments are asked to contact Harbor Freight with the information needed to determine if a donation can be made. Requests cannot be made at local Harbor Freight stores or call centers.

In an email, owner and founder of Harbor Freight tools, Eric Smidt says, “. America depends on these heroes every day and in the days ahead we will depend on them even more. At Harbor Freight, we want them to know that they can depend on us too (…) Although we certainly won’t have enough of these supplies to fill everyone’s needs, we’re going to donate everything we’ve got. We also recognize that there are so many other critically important people responding to this crisis and that there is need everywhere. We’ve chosen to focus our efforts on hospitals with a 24 hour emergency room with the hope that we can help as many people as possible right now.”

Hospital procurement offices should click here to submit a request.

Stuki
Stuki
4 years ago
Reply to  njbr

Nice!

Anda
Anda
4 years ago

Mish – still same page blocking on Android browsers. Only way round I have found ( without testing every browser on the market ), is to load firefox browser with NoScript blocker (Tor has similar also). Set default no script as everything disallowed, then as page loads set maven.io and moneymaven.io as trusted, with only script and fetch allowed in trusted. If you set all permissions as trusted for the site, it blocks also on firefox.

Mish
Mish
4 years ago
Reply to  Anda

Thanks Very Much for that descriptive update – Will Pass on

Scooot
Scooot
4 years ago
Reply to  Anda

I haven’t had a reply box for a month or so now.

eFrustrated
eFrustrated
4 years ago
Reply to  Anda

Try Brave Browser… it solved sooo many issues for me, but mostly blocking ads.

njbr
njbr
4 years ago

1,000,000? How about 100,000,000?

….Ventilators. Masks. Gowns. Gloves. Swabs. Health-care equipment large and small — all lifesaving — is in extremely short supply as American hospitals prepare to be overwhelmed by the coronavirus.

There’s a drastic wartime tool at President Trump’s disposal to try to get hospitals what they need, but Trump has been reluctant to use it despite bipartisan pressure. After saying he had invoked it, he said Saturday he wouldn’t. It’s not clear why.

The Defense Production Act would allow Trump to push U.S. manufacturers such as automakers and clothing companies to pivot to making medical equipment for hospitals and medical workers who say they are out of equipment or will be soon to treat the expected onslaught of coronavirus patients….

Donny DF Trump doesn’t understand the logarithmic rate of change thing…

JonSellers
JonSellers
4 years ago
Reply to  njbr

Maybe someone told Donnie that American manufacturers no longer have the sophistication to pivot fast enough to make a difference.

njbr
njbr
4 years ago

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ETweUXIWAAAmzSP?format=png&name=small” alt=”Image”/>

Latest NYC Covid-19 numbers: 10,764 positive cases, 99 deaths

Borough breakdown:
BK: 3,154 cases
Q: 3,050
M: 2,324
BX: 1,564
SI: 666

At least 1,800 people are hospitalized, with at least 450 people in the ICU.

RayLopez
RayLopez
4 years ago
Reply to  njbr

NY state has gone exponential. Doubling every 24 hours. Lockdown needed now. Sadly they will infect the whole USA. Stupid fellow Americans…

Stuki
Stuki
4 years ago

Going from 100,000 to 1mill positives in 8 days, would require the ability to test 100K+ daily…… And that is, assuming you bat 100% with your tests.

New confirmed cases will likely be limit locked by testing ability very soon, if those trends continue.

Once that happens, you don’t know who is infected. A week after 4/3, with similar growth rates, you won’t know more than a few % of infecteds…

Meaning, there is no other way of getting in front of it, than a full blown Wuhan intensity lockdown. Tight enough to where you can almost mathematically guarantee that all possible contagion pathways are closed. Maintained without exception until all those locked down, are either dead, or have been recovered long enough to no longer be contagious.

Anything less intense, and you’ll never catch up, but at best hang on to the tail slowing the carnage down a bit, while at the same time dragging it out even longer.

tokidoki
tokidoki
4 years ago
Reply to  Stuki

So basically China wasn’t “lying”, rather they too were limit locked by testing capacity at the start.

Greggg
Greggg
4 years ago
Reply to  tokidoki

Depends if you listened to panicky medical professionals there or the CCP/regional authorities who were trying their best to look good.

Stuki
Stuki
4 years ago
Reply to  tokidoki

No doubt.

They caught on to the fact that this was a novel virus almost conspiracy-inducingy quickly. But there was still no doubt many who died of unspecified pneumonia in the beginning.

Then, it still took them some time to zero in on accurate tests and creating sufficient testing capability. For awhile, they were so far behind in testing, that they let doctors confirm covid with chest X-rays….

They did seal off Hubei just in time to prevent the whole country from reaching the same runaway state, though. And then locked Hubei down hard.

Because of the seal-off, the rest of the country’s resources could then be focused on Hubei. Were it not for that, it may not have been possible to lock it down as hard as they did. Imagine the entire China (or America) unable to leave their apartment at all, for months on end. Not just “social distancing”, but literally no activity at all. Just sitting locked in indefinitely. That may not even be possible, without un/less affected areas to temporarily fill for the loss.

xilduq
xilduq
4 years ago
Reply to  Stuki

it is not logical to suggest sealing Hubei stopped the spread to (or in) other chinese cities (especially beijing, shanghai, …) while allowing it spread to (likely) every other country in the world.

Stuki
Stuki
4 years ago
Reply to  xilduq

It didn’t “stop” it. It was already everywhere by the time Wuhan was shut down. Every province in China had cases. But the exponential explosion in Wuhan/Hubei ran into walls, resulting in much smaller and more manageable outbreaks outside Hubei.

Of course, in China and some other East Asian countries, those much smaller outbreaks were then dealt with early and, so far, effectively.

While elsewhere, despite Trump getting off to a good early start with his China flight ban, everyone instead sat on their rears, or at most saw the outbreak as a new opportunity to aid their connected leeching classes in stealing some more.

So instead of walking up and down Manhattan spraying disinfectant, Powell instead sat at the printing press stealing trillions for his comrades-in-theft. Pelosi was busy indirectly bailing out peddlers of “student loans” instead of disinfecting San Francisco, and the GOP kept looking for excuses to bomb Iran instead of to spray Washington.

While in Hubei, noone gave a toot about neither student loans, “liquidity” nor Iran. Focusing instead on stopping the virus.

George Phillies
George Phillies
4 years ago
Reply to  Stuki

Your other choice is to say the good of the many outweighs the good of the few, and save the economy at the expense of the Covid-19 sufferers who die as a result.

tokidoki
tokidoki
4 years ago

Please infect yourself first and tell us how it went, and then we’ll chat again.

RayLopez
RayLopez
4 years ago

@George_Phillies – but the death of Covid-19 sufferers –and it’s not just old people–will negatively impact US GDP even more than a 14 day total lockdown would. A lockdown, as @Anda agrees, would only flatten the peak, and you still will get “flair ups” of the disease, but, it buys time for the 18 months or more needed to find a vaccine. It’s worth doing 14 days of lockdown in the USA, then “South Korea style” massive testing of everybody (using their smartphones to track them) for Covid-19, until such time a vaccine is found. But sadly, given a good number of Americans don’t believe in evolution (as a scientific proven theory, I’m not talking about the Baptist religion here, where you can believe whatever you want), nor in global warming (much less anthropogenic GW), I doubt the above happens. Hard landing for America. DJ-30 to below 10k.

Anda
Anda
4 years ago
Reply to  Stuki

Trouble is there is no clear way out of that scenario, because there are always going to be reservoirs ready to expand once measures are relaxed. I’m not sure about flattening the curve either, it looks right with a few tens of thousand cases, but if the peak of the curve were tens of millions or more, and the bell stretched over half a year without flattening, but reduced to a permanent million for years, then it isn’t an ideal answer. So I guess it is up to inoculation and treatment, because this virus is not going further away than to be heavily suppressed by the look of it, and there are limits to that.

Stuki
Stuki
4 years ago
Reply to  Anda

Once you’re out in front of it, so it’s no longer overwhelming you, you can then knock down flareups the way the “Little Chinas” (Taiwan, HK, Singapore) are doing. With highly efficient contact tracing, and quick action aimed at cordoning off and knocking down flareups before they grow out of control.

One way or the other, Hubei, not to speak of China, is in a much better position wrt covid today, than Italy, Spain and the rest of The West is. They still have to be vigilant, so aren’t fully out of the woods by any means. But I doubt there are any Western country’s CDC, which wouldn’t be elated to be where China/Hubei is wrt covid, compared to where they themselves are at today.

Anda
Anda
4 years ago
Reply to  Stuki

There must still be restraints in those countries though, because I just don’t see how you can contain a virus where one in ten are asymptomatic transmitters with people travelling freely around the country. I mean for one in ten cases they are going to be two weeks maybe behind the first person infecting others ( he is infectious for a week, the person who shows symptoms gets tested a week after being infected, when symptoms show). Imagine that going on with a few hundred or more people infected moving around the country and I’m not too positive giving close chase is going to avoid occasional major outbreaks. Maybe it is the best that can be done though.

Stuki
Stuki
4 years ago
Reply to  Anda

I hear you. It sure does seem like constantly keeping an awful lot of balls in the air, without any of them crashing down.

Intense surveillance, of among other things location histories gleaned from cell phones, seem to help: As soon as someone tests positive, health authorities can access everywhere he has been for the past week, and find everyone else who crossed paths with him. Then test all those, and repeat for anyone who turns up positive…..

BaronAsh
BaronAsh
4 years ago
Reply to  Stuki

A pity the US isn’t sufficiently advanced and well run to take the S. Korean approach which has proven extremely effective without closing down businesses and schools. Instead, the economy is being deliberately sabotaged, political shenanigans abound, corrupt govt agencies abound, media hysteria abounds, TDS Type 1 and 2 abound and so forth.

55,000 died this year from seasonal flu in the US. Somehow this puts no stress on the system.

Something is seriously wrong about this whole business.
I smell asymmetric war.
I smell globalists versus nationalists.
I smell treachery from within.
As a boomer, I smell most of my lifetime savings going up in smoke in my accounts, and into the hands of the investment banks who are always on the other side of liquidation trades by funds, pension etc. Biggest shakedown in world history.
I smell smoke and mirrors.
I smell the end of the US Republic and One Party model being adopted worldwide as part of globalist governance.
I smell Team Trump being the last hope to reverse all this, but being entirely over-matched.
I smell all who are willing to destroy the country in order to get rid hf him one day deeply regretting the disaster they are contributing to.
I smell turning away from this modern world to enjoy retirement far from the madding crowd, far from increasingly totalitarian societies.
I smell a Big Surprise from the Trumpster along with the V-bottom he is promising.
I smell fear that this won’t happen.
And so it goes…

xilduq
xilduq
4 years ago
Reply to  BaronAsh

you are projecting tds (loudly)

BaronAsh
BaronAsh
4 years ago
Reply to  xilduq

As we used to say in school in England:
“He who smelt it, dealt it!”

BaronAsh
BaronAsh
4 years ago
Reply to  xilduq

Replied to wrong chap, sorry:
As we used to say in school in England:
“He who smelt it, dealt it.”

There’s also another one:
“Judge not that ye be not judged.”

You could object to points made in the post.
But basic ad hominem like that is rather pathetic.
High school tactics.

Curious-Cat
Curious-Cat
4 years ago

“What the hell are they thinking? Or Smoking?”

I suspect they are always late with the bad news because they don’t want to spook the markets any more than they already are. But I could be wrong.

Greggg
Greggg
4 years ago

xilduq
xilduq
4 years ago
Reply to  Greggg

clearly photoshopped

footwedge
footwedge
4 years ago
Reply to  xilduq

Well duh!

footwedge
footwedge
4 years ago
Reply to  xilduq

Well duh.

Herkie
Herkie
4 years ago
Reply to  Greggg

That would be Rand Paul’s test results?

MorrisWR
MorrisWR
4 years ago
Reply to  Herkie

? Paul tested positive for the virus.

Herkie
Herkie
4 years ago
Reply to  MorrisWR

Yes, he took the test last week on Sunday and said he had no symptoms, so how was he able to get tested when sick people can’t get tested? Well, he continued to go to the senate gym and pool and attend committees and vote on the floor of the senate the whole time without telling anyone, and finally his test came back and he was positive. Just an asshole? No, he is a doctor for crying out loud, he knew the drill and ignored the protocols so he should be arrested for reckless endangerment. Maybe share a cell with all those republican senators that were selling off their portfolios while they were getting inside information of the real devastating news of the virus yet kept insisting to the public there was no reason to worry. The entire lot of them are as amoral as humans can be.

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