The Crypto Crash and Why It’s Impossible For “You!” to Cash Out

Image from Michael Saylor’s Twitter Profile

The Madness of Crowds

The entire crypto market cap including Bitcoin is $834.54B as I type out. At it’s peak, the entire space was worth $2.9 trillion.

I mentioned the words “crypto” and “bitcoin” in the same sentence the other day to be informed that I was an idiot for confusing the two.

Memes of the Day 

The newly circulated idea of the day looks like this: 1 BTC = 1 BTC. 

I have seen that in perhaps a hundred Tweets recently. Yes, truly genius. And one US digital dollar = one US digital dollar. They are all alike.

$1 = $1 is equally brilliant. 

“Insane to Sell At These Levels” 

That is another one I heard repeatedly regarding Bitcoin when it fell from $69,000 to $50,000. I heard it again at $45,000, at $40,000, at $30,000, at $25,000, and at $20,000.

Clearly, it was not insane to sell at any of those prices. 

But it was insane to tell everyone who sold that the sellers were insane. 

“Can’t Go Below $20,000” 

Last week on Twitter when I noted Saylor would get a margin call at $21,000 I was blasted in two different ways.

Several people Tweeted Bitcoin could not possibly dip below $20,000 because they have seen the order flows. 

Damn, it seems the order flows did not care what those fools thought. 

That brings to mind yet another meme I heard at lest 20 times on Twitter.

“Bitcoin Does Not Care What You Think”

That’s true of course, given that Bitcoin cannot think at all. 

Here’s another “brilliant” truism. 

The Bitcoin does not care where Bitcoin believers think the price of Bitcoin is headed.

“Worst Case on Ethereum is $1,000” 

June 10 Flashbacks 

  • “No one should be selling at these levels.” 
  • Worst case is $1,000 or so

Questioning $1,000

The Ethereum Nuclear War theory new worst case is $480. 

I have to post captured images instead of Tweets because I have been blocked from reading these threads.

That’s OK. I made notes. 

Staking Theory 

But let’s discuss this new idea. “Ethereum cannot go to $100 because of physical staking“. 

This guy clearly has no idea how markets work. 

And a second irony is staking is one of the things contributing to the crash.

Please consider Staked Ethereum (stETH) Could Cause A Crypto Crash, Here’s How

Celsius, stETH, AAVE, Lido, and Ethereum are all in the mix. 

Yet, I have countless Tweets all telling me why I am wrong and why whatever the hell they believe in is different. 

Stable Coins 

The allegedly stable coin LUNA went to $0. 

Many more are headed that way. 

Margin Calls 

There’s a big debate over margin calls. Judging from the number of inane Tweets I conclude most people have no idea what it means. Alternatively, those who know the least are the most vocal. 

A margin call is triggered when someone has to post more margin as collateral for a loan drops. 

A key margin call is in play because Microstrategy CEO Michael Saylor borrowed money, posting Bitcoin as collateral to buy more Bitcoin.

His average price is over $30,000.

I wrote about margin calls on May 8 in As Bitcoin Breaks Support, Bulls and Bears Pretend to Know the Unknowable.

Let’s tune into what I said then.

There is no reason, fundamental or technical, for a bounce at the $32,000 level to hold. And if it doesn’t, the next support is at the $19,000 level.

The $19,000 level is an interesting level because margin calls are in play. 

The casino is clearly open folks, and MicroStrategy has morphed into a leveraged speculative play on Bitcoin. A margin call awaits at $21,000 with support at $19,000.

There was a margin call at $21,000 assuming the level given by the MicroStrategy CFO in a conference call was accurate.

Yet, despite that message from the company, countless people have said there is no margin call at that level because Saylor can keep pledging more and more Bitcoin as collateral all the way down to $3,500 (yet another level that allegedly “cannot” happen).

This triggered yet another ridiculous set of responses, this time from people who think they know what I think, what money is, and what money always does. 

Contradictory Notes 

  • “Bitcoin is Money”
  • “It will Go Up Forever”
  • “Money Always Goes Up”
  • Alternatively $1BTC = $1BTC and $1 = $1

Cascading Liquidations

I cannot keep up with all the events. I do not know if it’s even possible. 

But I can tell you two trading platforms have halted withdrawals and anyone on those platforms is likely to be wiped out (lose everything or nearly everything).  

Fortune reports A major crypto hedge fund is wobbling as $10 billion Three Arrows Capital Sees a Spate of Liquidations

After $400 million in liquidations, a major hedge fund in the space, Singapore-based Three Arrows Capital, or 3AC, is reportedly facing insolvency, and many dominos look likely to fall next.

Cryptocurrency lender BlockFi is among the most recent to liquidate some of 3AC’s positions, according to the Financial Times. BlockFi CEO Zac Prince confirmed its exit in a Thursday tweet: “BlockFi can confirm that we exercised our best business judgment recently with a large client that failed to meet its obligations on an overcollateralized margin loan. We fully accelerated the loan and fully liquidated or hedged all the associated collateral.”

Since then, others with exposure to 3AC have come forward. Finblox, a platform offering users up to 90% yield to deposit their cryptocurrency, reduced its withdrawal limits by two-thirds and cited its relationship with 3AC. 

On Twitter, Deribit, a cryptocurrency derivatives exchange, claimed on Thursday that 3AC is a shareholder of its parent company, adding that Deribit has “a small number of accounts that have a net debt to us that we consider as potentially distressed.” 

Danny Yuan, chief executive officer of cryptocurrency trading firm 8 Blocks Capital, also claimed to have been impacted by 3AC. “We trade in one of 3AC’s trading accounts. This morning they took about [$1 million] out of our accounts. I hope you pay us back asap,” he tweeted on Tuesday. 

Since the Terra ecosystem collapsed, with failed algorithmic stablecoin TerraUSD (UST) and cryptocurrency Luna (LUNC) becoming nearly worthless, there has been a ripple effect throughout the space. One of the cryptocurrency market’s biggest lending platforms, Celsius Network, paused its withdrawals on Sunday, sparking rumors of bankruptcy. Reports concerning the state of 3AC followed soon after, pushing further fears of contagion and systemic risk.  

3AC reportedly owned LUNC alongside other cryptocurrencies, and it was a hefty investor in the Grayscale Bitcoin Trust, or GBTC, the largest Bitcoin fund. According to a January 2021 SEC filing, 3AC owned almost 39 million units of GBTC at the end of 2020.  

“A lot of people have reached out about what they know—many of whom have direct relationships with 3AC as well. What we learned is that they were leveraged long everywhere and were getting margin-called,” Yuan wrote on Twitter. “Instead of answering the margin calls, they ghosted everyone. The platforms had no choice but to liquidate their positions, causing the markets to further dump.”

Intermingled Accounts and Betting Books

3AC, Celsius, Finblox, GBTC, UST, LUNC, BlockFi, Deribit (a derivitaves exchange), and 8 Blocks Capital are all involved in this mess. 

Let’s take one statement and sum it all up: “I hope you pay us back asap.” 

A telling note on the likelihood of that comes from Finblox which is offering an amazing “90% interest” on asset pledges. That’s an indication of something headed to zero sooner than than later. 

I am also amused by BlockFi’s statement “We fully accelerated the loan and fully liquidated or hedged all the associated collateral.”

I highlighted the word “or hedged“. 

Question: How good are those hedges? What bankrupt firm will pay them? 

Fully Committed 

CryptoBriefing reports 3AC co-founder Su Zhu published a Twitter statement Wednesday stating 3AC is “communicating with relevant parties and fully committed to working this out.”

3AC is one of the largest investment firms in the crypto industry. It has made investments in blockchain projects including Bitcoin and Ethereum and has invested in DeFi platforms such as Aave and Balancer. It has even invested in the NFT game Axie Infinity.

Oops. 

I need to expand my list of comingled parties to 3AC, Celsius, Finblox, GBTC, UST, LUNC, BlockFi, Deribit, 8 Blocks Capital, Bitcoin, Ethereum, Aave, Balancer, and Axie Infinity. 

Any more?

Suspended Trading and Liquidations

Spotlight Babel

Founded in 2018, Babel Finance conducts its lending and trading business in bitcoin, ethereum, and stablecoins. It has about 500 customers, many of which are institutions, including traditional banks, investment funds, accredited investors, and family offices. The company had an outstanding loan balance of more than $3 billion at the end of 2021, it said in a May release.

In May, Babel Finance raised $80 million in a Series B round that valued the firm at $2 billion. Prominent venture capital firms including Jeneration Capital, 10T Holdings, Dragonfly Capital, and BAI Capital participated in the financing round.

If you are coming to the conclusion that it’s impossible to untangle the contagion, then you are coming to the correct conclusion.

Dip Below Previous Cycle

Cult Hero Worship

Cult Hero 

Look at @saylor betting the company on it with leverage.  For what? Another million dollar house, boat, island? Then he parades around like a laser-eyed idiot, expecting and getting hero-cult worship from those who got in early.

For What?

An ego trip and hero worship.

Miners Losing Money 

Meanwhile, the price of Bitcoin has fallen so much that bitcoin miners are losing money on their mining operations. 

Not to worry, that’s another thing I am told is virtually impossible.

This post is long enough if not too long already, but there is one more important idea to discuss.

“You” Can Cash Out But “You!” Cannot

  • What’s the difference?
  • You is an individual 
  • You! is the collective 

At an individual level, “You” can still get the current quoted bid for a Bitcoin ($17,600 as I type) 

But “You!” cannot get the current quoted bid. If everyone tried to sell, the price would crash to $500 or whatever the price marginal buyers are willing to pay.

Looking ahead, “You” may be able to get more than $20,000 tomorrow for a bitcoin but “You!” certainly cannot.

But hey that’s OK because I have it on great authority that $1 BTC = $1 BTC and nothing else matters because “Bitcoin is Money” and “Money Always Goes Up.”

Blood in the Street

Saylor has enough coins to stay solvent down to 3000$. But at 11,500$ he will refuse to meet the Silvergate margin call. He will have sold 19K coins for 220M. THEY will own them. And liquidate them. THEY are a bank, defending loans on imaginary collateral?

Meanwhile As Bitcoin Breaks Support, Bulls and Bears Pretend to Know the Unknowable

My support points for Bitcoin are posted here: Fundamentally and Technically the Entire Crypto Space is a Huge Mess

This post originated at MishTalk.Com.

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kewtiepie
kewtiepie
1 year ago
I’m not worried about cashing out my crypto because I follow people that make sense, like Jim Cramer and Warren Buffett. People that have proven track records for success. Not people that whine and moan and do anything to get a click on their lame website. Just think if you had invested more wisely all the money you would have now instead of worrying about not being able to cash out your crypto investment! You know slow and steady is the way you get rich not by destroying the environment and being selfish like that. People like you are getting your comeuppance right now. And the poor fools that followed your bad advice!
SAKMAN1
SAKMAN1
1 year ago
After perusing the bitcoin reddit, I think I know how this whole thing ends. It ends on massively low volume.
There is a concept of a “wholecoiner” going around. The novelty of being someone that owns a whole bitcoin. Since there are only 21 million BTC ever, and those people HODL to their novelty, transaction volume drops.
None of these people are working to have a bitcoin economy, it is simply a novelty or an investment. When 21M people have just one, it dies.
Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
1 year ago
Crypto is a methodology.
Bitcoin is a religion.
KidHorn
KidHorn
1 year ago
Crypto was like the internet in 2000. Back then a lot of internet startups rushed to go public and sell their shares. Even though they had no profitable business model. They were trying to take advantage of the latest ‘This time is different’ or ‘If you have to ask, you don’t get it’ craze.
Zardoz
Zardoz
1 year ago
Hey, I still have my nft tamagotchi. I’m sure it loves me, and isn’t that all we need?
ColoradoAccountant
ColoradoAccountant
1 year ago
Didn’t some Senator ask JP Morgain what money is? Morgan said: “Gold, and everything else is credit.” That makes a lot of sense and accounts for why Russia, China, and others are accumulating it.
ROGO1
ROGO1
1 year ago
GM, Mike
Great due diligence & right on point,
M.S.=”Master Shiller” 🌷🌷”Bitcoins Life Doesn’t Matter”🌷🌷
Bitcoin is dead as far as expecting any new ATHs in the 10 yr. project which its secretive creator Satoshi Nakamoto actually walked away from and also left holding upto 1MM Bitcoin!?..

Unless you are one of those savvy geeky nerds who purchased Bitcoin <$100 that have been using the incredible fortune made from Bitcoin Tulip 2.0 to FOMO false narrative 24/7 of the 10 year old projects broken btc UI/UX & unproven SOV, Bitcoins life does’nt matter to the true crypto sphere which only adoption has been Bitcoin laser eyed GAAP fraudsters, Collaborating miners, Billionaire pissing contests, Hustling YouTube influencers & Bloviating Bankster’s most of whom never managed a phone booth let alone the fiduciary responsibility of their own wallets!..

Bitcoin is the first to market & first to fail of the true vision of its creator of being an outlet away from the corrupted crony inflationary madness of fiat currencies!..

“It’s Easier to Fool People Than It Is to Convince Them That They Have Been Fooled.” – Mark Twain …
Top Ten Fads..

10. My Pet Rock 1975

9. Tickle Me Elmo 1996

8. Bottled Water 1999

7. Jersey Shore 2009

6. The Hula Hoop 1957

5. The Tamagotchi 1996

4. The Atkins Diet 1972

3. The Snuggie 2008

2. The iPhone 2007

1. Bitcoin Laser eyes 2020 – present

There is something unethical & egregiously wrong in unknown creator/s digital creation holding up to 1 million Bitcoin created out of thin air being placed on publicly traded companies balance sheets!..

Thank you for the great due diligence 👏
SleemoG
SleemoG
1 year ago
Reply to  ROGO1
“It’s Easier to Fool People Than It Is to Convince Them That They Have Been Fooled.” – Mark Twain
If someone attributes a quote to Mark Twain, it can’t be proved that Mark Twain said it.
kiers
kiers
1 year ago
Reply to  ROGO1
but, but…..”I have seen the order flow”, said someone, referring to a fake screen, in a completely un-regulated, un-audited business, with trading rules and regs that don’t exist, an order routing algorithm not vetted, regarding electrons as the underlying asset.
amigator
amigator
1 year ago
Great post learned a lot.Thank you for taking the heat!
Yea I much prefer Tulips!
Carl_R
Carl_R
1 year ago
A minor point: You said “The allegedly stable coin LUNA went to $0.” LUNA was not a stable coin. TerraUSD was the stable coin, while LUNA was the coin which would be destroyed, if necessary, trying to keep TerraUSD at $1. It was destroyed, but even that was not enough.
Bam_Man
Bam_Man
1 year ago
Buffett called it “Rat poison, squared.”
It’s actually a lot worse than that.
Bam_Man
Bam_Man
1 year ago
Unfortunately, there will be mass suicides upcoming among the crypto “True Believers”.
Fortunately for them, fentanyl is cheap.
bobcalderone
bobcalderone
1 year ago
Reply to  Bam_Man
Normally my financial news isn’t this dark.
Keep up the good work!!
Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
1 year ago
Reply to  Bam_Man
Just another example of a Darwinian process for improving the species.
Unfortunately the Woke people have severely impeded these processes as of late.
kiers
kiers
1 year ago
Reply to  Bam_Man
does it not bother you that there is SO much securities regulation governing the sale of offerings of investments to the public and they let the kids put their hands in a live blender on this one, and sat back and ate popcorn? does it bother you? where were the parents.
Irondoor
Irondoor
1 year ago
Crypto,
I can assure you nobody has the big picture. Impossible to know, but it appears the prominent names are Chinese. So every “investor”, every fund, every lender, every “exchange” is screwed now. The meltdown is now picking up steam. So who is going to be the bidder? Where’d the money go? Somewhere in Asia, of course.
Captain Ahab
Captain Ahab
1 year ago
Reply to  Irondoor
I ‘suspect’ we are in the stampede-to-the-exits phase–behavioral economics is the big picture. Believers will stay with BTC to the bitter revelation–their investment is worth zero!
Bam_Man
Bam_Man
1 year ago
Reply to  Irondoor
It went to “Money Heaven”, that’s where.
And the morons who are now being wiped out will hopefully have enough money left to buy enough fentanyl to “ease their pain”.
prumbly
prumbly
1 year ago
Reply to  Irondoor
The money didn’t go anywhere really. Crypto was always a zero-sum game.
PreCambrian
PreCambrian
1 year ago
For the last six days, USDT (Tether) has been losing about $1 billion each day in market cap. Since it is a “stablecoin” pegged at $1, it means that holders are redeeming $1 billion per day of USDT for dollars. Soon they will run out of collateral. As soon as they stop honoring redemptions, then USDT will go to basically $0, bringing BTC and ETH along with it. A lot of crypto is purchased with USDT and there is a large amount of speculation that a substantial amount of USDT was issued at much less than $1, which helped to artificially (and fraudulently) support the price of BTC and ETH.
Siliconguy
Siliconguy
1 year ago
A=A is the reflexive property of math. I remember learning that in ninth grade algebra.
Then we went on to the symmetric property and the transitive property. The bitcoiners should discover them next.
Wait until they find out that zero times anything is still zero.
Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
1 year ago
Reply to  Siliconguy
Scarier still they probably believe that dividing by zero means something.
PreCambrian
PreCambrian
1 year ago
Reply to  Lisa_Hooker
To infinity and beyond.
ColoradoAccountant
ColoradoAccountant
1 year ago
Reply to  PreCambrian
LOL!!!
8dots
8dots
1 year ago
BTCUSD back to BB #1 : Nov 25 hi/26 lo 2020
Six000mileyear
Six000mileyear
1 year ago
The cryto crash may have saved oil from going through the roof. Since the financial system is so over-leveraged, One bubble popping generates margin calls that can only be met by selling other investments in a bubble. Pun intended, oil is a very liquid asset, so it gets sold too. At this point liquidity is drying up very quickly as indicated by prices in general falling on slightly above average volume. This next round of selling will intensify as those who didn’t have to meet margin calls take action to preserve wealth.
SAKMAN1
SAKMAN1
1 year ago
Reply to  Six000mileyear
Good.
Captain Ahab
Captain Ahab
1 year ago
Thank you!
I have no doubt that some form of encryption will play a role in future currencies, NO different than a small rectangle of plastic allows me to make purchases without using a check or paper money, or make bank deposits and withdrawals. Likely, we’ll see body-embedded RFID chips replace credit cards in the next decade.
What makes BTC valuable depends entirely on perceptions of value, which seem to be declining rapidly as people wake up. Add in some key facts about technological progress, and anonymity and the internet, and ‘private’ transactions’ are anything but.
JackWebb
JackWebb
1 year ago
Reply to  Captain Ahab
In fundamental terms, crypto was the answer to a problem that didn’t exist.
Irondoor
Irondoor
1 year ago
Reply to  Captain Ahab
Visa is faster, cheaper, and processes multiple transactions per minute of any crypto. And uses the worldwide instantly accepted dollar currency, or converts into the local currency automatically. And withdraws from your bank account immediately. Your transactions are protected from fraud to a point and you can protest any unauthorized transaction. No fees to the user. What’s not to like?
Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
1 year ago
Reply to  Irondoor
Agree about Visa and MasterCard being more efficient.
But not all those cards are debit cards.
Credit cards don’t debit your bank account until you intentionally pay.
Interestingly, the amount of credit you create by using a card is essentially “printing” short-term money, just like a bank.
Jack
Jack
1 year ago
Reply to  Captain Ahab
We already have body-embedded RFID chips for retail purchases.
Chip is in my iphone – apple pay.
The way people cannot part with their cell phones these days, cell phones are essentially an appendage.
I have not used a credit card or debit card for a couple years now – apple pay is the replacement.
In some states physical drivers licenses are now redundant – it is loaded to apple wallet.
Do not have to wait 10 years – it is here.
Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
1 year ago
Reply to  Jack
Folks keep mistaking their cell phone for a communication device, although that’s one of it’s functions.
They are actually a transponder similar to those on ships and aircraft that are used to identify and locate owners.
Zardoz
Zardoz
1 year ago
Reply to  Captain Ahab

Bitcoin has never been viable for currency, but there are quite a few blockchains that could support a currency without the massive energy waste and transaction costs. One of them will rise from the ashes in a few years. My bet is on Algorand, but we’ll see…

SAKMAN1
SAKMAN1
1 year ago
Why? Fundamentally BTC was always equal to BTC, and nothing else.
Some people got rich on BTC, I got rich on things that actually create prosperity through imprpvements in trust, trade, and technology. I’ve been barely able to watch the whole thing because it is sick.
Everyone who was ever involved in any of this nonsense is a destroyer not a builder, but they dont care and they will do it again. So sad.
Bam_Man
Bam_Man
1 year ago
Reply to  SAKMAN1
A relative handful of people got rich off this mania, and a multitude will have been completely ruined by it.
Same as it ever was.
JackWebb
JackWebb
1 year ago
Reply to  Bam_Man
I find it very, very hard to conjure up the slightest bit of sympathy.
JackWebb
JackWebb
1 year ago
All of these cryptos will go to $0.00. My main question is the degree to which this will spread beyond crypto.
Scooot
Scooot
1 year ago
Reply to  JackWebb
It might make some people rethink the safety of any leveraged positions they might have, or the affect other people’s leverage might have on prices.
JackWebb
JackWebb
1 year ago
Reply to  Scooot
If that’s all that the crash does, I’m happy to sit and laugh. We shall see, because all crypto is going to zero. We’re going to learn whether or not there are material external connections.
Scooot
Scooot
1 year ago
Reply to  JackWebb
I suspect there are. I have wondered if it might affect the financing of the Ukraine war in some way. Was Crypto being used I wonder?
Captain Ahab
Captain Ahab
1 year ago
Reply to  Scooot
Insightful and true. Now is not a good time to be leveraged. Risk (of all types) is rapidly increasing, and yields/interest rates are reacting accordingly. Leverage is a killer when SHTF.
SAKMAN1
SAKMAN1
1 year ago
Reply to  Scooot
Go to wallstreetbets to watch the people selling deathstixs rethinking their lives.
Scooot
Scooot
1 year ago
Reply to  SAKMAN1
This made me laugh 🙂
Captain Ahab
Captain Ahab
1 year ago
Reply to  JackWebb
Conceivably BTC can go negative–a fine for the gross misuse of energy.
Jack
Jack
1 year ago
Reply to  Captain Ahab
What happens when no longer feasible to run the mining computers.
When miners turn off their machines to save money, the market will be effectively shut down.
SAKMAN1
SAKMAN1
1 year ago
Reply to  Captain Ahab
Yaaaaas!!
Bronco
Bronco
1 year ago
Well, at least tulips are pretty … and don’t waste a lot of energy.
Read that Microstrategy average purchase cost past 2 years $30,700 per coin. Savvy.
Continues to tank today. Down 10% at the moment.
Carl_R
Carl_R
1 year ago
Reply to  Bronco
Yes, Tulips are pretty, and don’t use a lot of energy. Confederate dollars were not unattractive, either. My parents wallpapered a bathroom with stock certificates which, while valuable in 1929, were no more than pretty paper by 1933. If gold loses it’s value, you still have a shiny chunk of metal that is pretty to look at. If BTC goes to zero, what do you have? I guess you can keep a digital wallet on your desk, and imagine that it contains something of value.
shamrock
shamrock
1 year ago
1btc=1btc, that’s funny. I’ve seen similar sentiment from people holding gold though. 1oz gold = 1oz gold.
JackWebb
JackWebb
1 year ago
Reply to  shamrock
At least gold is gold. Bitcoin is … what, again?
Mish
Mish
1 year ago
Reply to  shamrock
If you really do not care about price, then thinking “I have X ounces or X btc” is defendable as some sort of hedge. But I doubt that is even 1% of the cases.
Captain Ahab
Captain Ahab
1 year ago
Reply to  Mish
Here’s a question… Does the IRS consider losses on Bitcoin-to-dollar transactions as tax deductible? Somehow, I doubt it. It would be analogous to a claiming a loss on conversion of dollars to Euros, and back again… I suspect you might for a business engaged in currency trading, to be taken against gains.
1 bTC now = 19247.24
Mish
Mish
1 year ago
Reply to  Captain Ahab
Absolutely there are tax consequences.
Hells bells Using Bitcoin to buy a fishing pole has tax consequences from a legal standpoint. This was discussion of a big Tweet thread I was involved in. Let me see if I can find it.
Mish
Mish
1 year ago
Reply to  Mish
People are actively promoting Bitcoin as a means of tax evasion
Think the government does not know
Captain Ahab
Captain Ahab
1 year ago
Reply to  Mish
The tax on a BTC gain is one thing. Not stating the gain on your tax return would be a big problem.
Is there a deduction allowed for BTC losses? If yes, are there opportunities for trading bitcoin losses?
JackWebb
JackWebb
1 year ago
Reply to  Captain Ahab
Capital loss, deductible from gains I’d expect.
Scooot
Scooot
1 year ago
Reply to  shamrock
Harold Wilson said it about the pound in the late 60’s.
“From now the pound abroad is worth 14% or so less in terms of other currencies. It does not mean, of course, that the pound here in Britain, in your pocket or purse or in your bank, has been devalued.”
Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
1 year ago
Reply to  Scooot
Reminds me of $24 gold = $35 gold, but you can’t have any.
Captain Ahab
Captain Ahab
1 year ago
Reply to  shamrock
I have five copies of Microsoft Word from 2001 on CDs. How much am I bid?
I also have five LPs of Beatles recordings. How much are they worth?
Bam_Man
Bam_Man
1 year ago
Reply to  Captain Ahab
I have a bunch of lint in my pocket.
bobcalderone
bobcalderone
1 year ago
Reply to  Captain Ahab
Take good care of the Beatles LPs.
Use the Microsoft CDs as coasters.
Jack
Jack
1 year ago
Reply to  Captain Ahab
Vinyl has value these days – came back in vogue 10 yrs ago. Probably same as what you paid but in today’s dollars.
MS Word – keep it. May have value as collector item in 10 more years.
Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
1 year ago
Reply to  Captain Ahab
I have a still shrink-wrapped copy of MS-DOS 5. But I think it’s a bootleg.
shamrock
shamrock
1 year ago
Like watching the titanic, horrible. From what I understand MSTR has 130,000 bitcoins and a $200m loan. So even if bitcoin drops to $1,000 they still only need to pledge 100,000 coins as collateral. Where did $3,600 come from?
Mish
Mish
1 year ago
Reply to  shamrock
Statements Saylor made, $3,500 I believe
Most of us think the liquidation price is way higher because
1. In a fast market near the trigger the market makers will just do it
2. I am not sure how much of a liar he is
Captain Ahab
Captain Ahab
1 year ago
Reply to  shamrock
The Titanic was horrible. The collapse of Bitcoin is sad for the holders, funny for everyone else.
Jack
Jack
1 year ago
Reply to  Captain Ahab
Next is tesla?
Zardoz
Zardoz
1 year ago
Reply to  Jack
Elon has decided to throw in with the climate deniers and piss off his customer base. Tesla will be in very deep Trouble before long…
Carl_R
Carl_R
1 year ago
Reply to  shamrock
MSTR has a $200m loan to Silvergate, but it is not their only loan. They have a total of $2.2 billion of debt. What collateral is pledged to the other $2 billion in debt?

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