Think carefully before answering. Details below.
Was Iran Honoring Obama’s Deal?
That’s where we need to start. The answer is yes.
This was a war of choice, by warmongers pledging to end wars.
We have Congressional Testimony proof.
Trump’s First Term Flashback
- Trump’s US State Department: Iran honoring the terms.
- Trump’s Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff: Iran honoring the terms.
- International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA): Iran honoring the terms.
- Arms Control Association: Iran honoring the terms.
- All US European allies: Iran honoring the terms.
- Every other signee of the accord: Iran honoring the terms.
- Trump’s top general Gen. Joseph Dunford: Iran honoring the terms.
- Trump’s Secretary of Defense Jim Mattis: Iran was complying with the terms of the 2015 Iran Nuclear Deal
Point 8 from AI Chrome
During his first term, President Trump’s Secretary of Defense, Jim Mattis, stated that Iran was complying with the terms of the 2015 Iran Nuclear Deal (JCPOA), despite President Trump’s strong opposition to it.
Key Details on Mattis’ Statement and Context:
- Testimony (October 2017): Testifying before the Senate Armed Services Committee, Mattis said, “I believe that [Iran] fundamentally [are] in compliance with its nuclear deal”.
- Contradicting Trump: Mattis, a career hawk, advised that staying in the deal was in the U.S. national security interest, putting him at odds with President Trump’s public criticism of the agreement as an “embarrassment”.
Iran only began stepping back from JCPOA limits (e.g., higher uranium enrichment levels, reduced IAEA access) after Trump unilaterally withdrew in 2018 and reimposed sanctions—not before.
This sequence is well-documented in IAEA reports and international statements that include Trump’s top general and Secretary of Defense.
Mattis Contradicts Trump
NYT Dateline October 3, 2017: Mattis Contradicts Trump on Iran Deal Ahead of Crucial Deadline
Days before President Trump has to make a critical decision on whether to hold up the Iran nuclear deal, Defense Secretary Jim Mattis openly split with him on abandoning the agreement, the second senior member of the president’s national security team to recently contradict him.
Mr. Mattis told senators on Tuesday that it was in America’s interest to stick with the deal, which Mr. Trump has often dismissed as a “disaster.”
“Absent indications to the contrary, it is something that the president should consider staying with,” Mr. Mattis told members of the Senate Armed Services Committee after being repeatedly pressed on the issue.
Senator Angus King, an independent from Maine, asked whether the defense secretary thought holding onto the nuclear pact is in the interest of the national security of the United States. Mr. Mattis, a retired Marine general, paused before replying: “Yes, senator, I do.”
And at his confirmation hearing in January, Mr. Mattis described the Iran deal as flawed but said the United States should remain committed to it, and to working with the other nations that negotiated it: Britain, France, Germany, Russia and China. “I think it is an imperfect arms control agreement — it’s not a friendship treaty,” Mr. Mattis said at the time. “But when America gives her word, we have to live up to it and work with our allies.”
Inside the Pentagon, Mr. Mattis and the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Gen. Joseph F. Dunford Jr., have told aides they are worried that abandoning the Iran deal could make it harder to convince North Korea that the United States would stick with any diplomatic agreement it might be able to reach to head off — or at least pause — the growing confrontation.
General Dunford testified at the same hearing alongside Mr. Mattis, and while he did not take a position on the Iran deal, his description about whether Tehran is violating the accord was at odds with the administration’s talking points. He said Iran “is not in material breach” of the agreement and that it had “delayed the development of a nuclear capability by Iran.”
On the campaign trail, Mr. Trump repeatedly threatened to tear up the deal, and negotiate a better one. In August, Mr. Trump also said that Iran is “not in compliance with the agreement and they certainly are not in the spirit of the agreement in compliance.”
Reuters Dateline October 3, 2017: Mattis says Iran ‘fundamentally’ in compliance with nuclear deal
U.S. Defense Secretary Jim Mattis said on Tuesday Iran was fundamentally in compliance with its nuclear deal, as President Donald Trump’s administration weighs whether the 2015 deal serves U.S. security interests.
“I believe that they fundamentally are. There have been certainly some areas where they were not temporarily in that regard, but overall our intelligence community believes that they have been compliant and the IAEA also says so,” Mattis said during a House of Representatives hearing, using an acronym for the International Atomic Energy Agency.
That is all on the congressional record.
Our starting point based on Congressional record is U.S. Defense Secretary Jim Mattis, General Joseph F. Dunford, and the International Atomic Energy Agency.
IAEA Says Iran Abiding by Nuclear Deal
April 19, 2019: IAEA Says Iran Abiding by Nuclear Deal
“Iran is implementing its nuclear commitments,” said Yukiya Amano, director-general of the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA). The agency has had access to “all the sites and locations in Iran which it needed to visit.”
US Allies Support the JCPOA Deal
EU Council Press Release Dateline May 9, 2018: Declaration by the High Representative on behalf of the EU following US President Trump’s announcement on the Iran nuclear deal (JCPOA)
The European Union (EU) deeply regrets the announcement by US President Trump to withdraw from the Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action (JCPOA).
The JCPOA, unanimously endorsed by UN Security Council Resolution 2231, is a key element of the global nuclear non-proliferation architecture and is crucial for the security of the region.
As long as Iran continues to implement its nuclear related commitments, as it has been doing so far and has been confirmed by the International Atomic Energy Agency in 10 consecutive reports, the EU will remain committed to the continued full and effective implementation of the nuclear deal.
The lifting of nuclear related sanctions is an essential part of the agreement. The EU has repeatedly stressed that the sanctions lifting has a positive impact on trade and economic relations with Iran. The EU stresses its commitment to ensuring that this can continue to be delivered.
Talks Resume on Nuclear Deal With Iran
Mishtalk Dateline April 2, 2021: Please cheer the good news: U.S. and Iran Agree to Resume Talks on Nuclear Deal
The United States and Iran will take part in talks next week in Vienna aimed at reviving the 2015 Iran nuclear agreement, the most extensive effort to shore up the agreement since President Biden took office in January, diplomats said Friday.
Senior officials from all participants in the accord—Iran, France, Germany, the U.K., Russia, China and the European Union, as well as top U.S. officials—will gather in the Austrian capital starting Tuesday.
A face-to-face meeting between officials from the two countries over the nuclear agreement would be the first since late 2017, months before the Trump administration withdrew from the deal in May 2018.
President Biden has said he wants the U.S. to return to the deal, which placed strict but temporary limits on Iran’s nuclear activities in exchange for a suspension of international sanctions on Tehran.
Obama’s Nuclear Accord Agreement
- Iran will give up about 14,000 of its 20,000 centrifuges
- Iran will give up all but its most rudimentary, outdated centrifuges: its first-generation IR-1s, knockoffs of 1970s European models, are all it gets to keep. It will not be allowed to build or develop newer models.
- Iran will give up 97 percent of its enriched uranium; it will hold on to only 300 kilograms of its 10,000-kilogram stockpile in its current form.
- Iran will destroy or export the core of its plutonium plant at Arak, and replace it with a new core that cannot produce weapons-grade plutonium. It will ship out all spent nuclear fuel.
- Inspectors will have access to all parts of Iran’s nuclear supply chain, including its uranium mines and the mills where it processes uranium ore. Inspectors will also not just monitor but be required to pre-approve all sales to Iran of nuclear-related equipment. This provision also applies to something called ‘dual-use’ materials, which means any equipment that could be used toward a nuclear program.
That’s the agreement U.S. Defense Secretary Jim Mattis, General Joseph F. Dunford, and the International Atomic Energy Agency all said Iran was honoring.
Fact-Checking Trump’s Comments
PoliFact Dateline March 3, 2026: Fact-Checking Trump’s Comments that a 2015 Deal Gave Iran the Right to Nuclear Weapons
Just days after launching a war against Iran, President Donald Trump favorably compared his efforts eliminating Iran’s nuclear weapons capability to a 2015 deal negotiated by one of his predecessors. President Barack Obama’s nuclear agreement with Iran was in force until 2018, when Trump pulled the U.S. out during his first term.
Taking questions in the Oval Office on March 3 with German Chancellor Friedrich Merz, Trump said that the agreement he pulled out of “gave (Iran) the right to have top-of-the-line nuclear weapons.”
“I was very proud to have knocked out the Iran nuclear deal by President Barack Hussein Obama,” Trump said. “That was a horrible, horrible, dangerous document. They were on the road to getting (a nuclear weapon) legitimately, through a deal that was signed foolishly by our country.”
The 2015 agreement — also known as the Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action, or JCPOA — “absolutely did not give Iran ‘the right to have top-of-the-line nuclear weapons,’” said Daryl G. Kimball, executive director of the Arms Control Association.
Iran agreed to relinquish 97% of its enriched uranium stockpile and 70% of its centrifuges, which are machines used to enrich uranium. It also agreed to stop plutonium production and to dismantle a plutonium reactor. If Iran broke any of these pledges, the other signatories would be able to reimpose sanctions, a process known as a “snapback” provision.
Over the 28 months the deal was in effect, the International Atomic Energy Agency said it found Iran committed no violations, aside from some minor infractions that were addressed.
In 2018, Trump pulled the U.S. out of the deal. The U.S. then imposed economic sanctions on Iran, and Iran reduced its compliance with the deal, including curbing compliance with international inspectors.
In 2025, Trump ordered the U.S. military to join Israel in bombing nuclear sites in Iran, seeking to end the nuclear program by force rather than negotiation. Then, on Feb. 28, Trump launched a new and larger air campaign that both sought to degrade Iran’s military capabilities and take out many members of its political and military leadership.
By signing the 2015 agreement, Iran “explicitly committed not to have a nuclear weapon, reflecting their NPT commitment not to have one,” said Richard Nephew, who worked for the U.S. government on Iranian issues during the Biden administration. “The entire purpose of the deal was to make sure that they could not do so.”
Our ruling
Trump said the nuclear agreement “gave (Iran) the right to have top-of-the-line nuclear weapons.”
We rate the statement False.
Arms Control Association Assessment
- The nuclear agreement did not bless Iran’s “right” to nuclear weapons. Iran could have acquired or developed a nuclear weapon by defying the terms of the nuclear agreement.
- That’s because the agreement was based on Iran’s continued adherence to the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty, which Iran signed in 1970. This treaty deems Iran a non-nuclear state, meaning it promised to forgo developing or acquiring nuclear weapons.
Synopsis
Obama fashioned an amazing peace deal with Iran that US allies, U.S. Defense Secretary Jim Mattis, General Joseph F. Dunford, the International Atomic Energy Agency, and the Arms Control Association all said Iran was honoring.
That deal, certainly not Obamacare, was the one big and arguably only significant achievement of Obama.
I did not care for Obama then, or now. But I give credit to Obama for the JCPOA. The deal may not have been perfect, but it was workable, with inspections by the the International Atomic Energy Agency.
Trump took the deal and unilaterally tore it up against the specific advice, on Congressional record by U.S. Defense Secretary Jim Mattis and General Joseph F. Dunford.
And now, based on “advice” from Jared Kushner (Trump’s son-in-law), Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, warmonger Senator Lindsey Graham, and against the advice of current top military experts, Trump launched this mad war.
Oh, I almost forgot. Trump said he launched this war based on his “feelings”.
He also tore up his own USMCA trade deal with Canada, threatened to take Greenland by force, and threatened US allies if they would not back this insane war.
Question of the Day
Q: Is there any reason for Iran to believe anything this perpetual liar says?
A: No, of course not.
In fact, there is no reason for anyone at all to believe a damn thing the world’s biggest liar say.
Who Is the World’s Biggest Liar?
March 16, 2026: The World’s Biggest Liar Accuses the Media of Lies and Treason
“Whatever he does, he accuses everyone else of doing,” said Senator Ted Cruz.
Please click the above link for more analysis and a very funny video of the clips shown below.
World’s Biggest Liar Clips
- Ted Cruz: Whatever he does, he accuses everyone else of doing. The man cannot tell the truth, and he combines it with being a narcissist, a narcissist at a level I don’t think this country has ever seen.
- Rand Paul: And my concern is that he would grab up all power and really treat the country as his bully fiefdom.
- Nikki Haley: Donald Trump is everything I taught my kids not to do in Kindergarten.
- Marco Rubio: He’s been exploiting Americans for forty years.
- Lindsey Graham: He is a race state, xenophobic, religious bigot.
- Mike Pompeo: Donald Trump the other day said that quote If he tells a soldier to commit a war crime, the soldier would just go do it.
- Glen Beck: I don’t think Trump has read the constitution or knows what’s in the constitution.
- Rick Perry: A toxic mix of demagoguery, mean spiritedness, and nonsense.
- Marco Rubio: Donald Trump is a con artist.
- Ted Cruz: He doesn’t know the difference between truth and lies. He lies, practically every word that comes out of his mouth.
- Lindsey Graham: I think he’s crazy.
I congratulate everyone above for their accurate assessments.
Meanwhile, the lead question answer is yes because Iran was honoring the deal.
So, here we are in an incredibly stupid war of Trump’s own making against excellent advice then and now.
Recall that Trump ran on a campaign to end wars and cut energy bills in half.
But as a direct consequence of war, the price of oil, gasoline, jet fuel, fertilizer, food, aluminum, and diesel, with knock-on impacts elsewhere, are all soaring.
For further discussion of price impacts, please see Gasoline Prices Surge $1 from a Month Ago. Think this Won’t Hit the CPI?
When will we be able to stop checking for Islanist terrorists on Airplanes ???
Good grief…anyone think that this war has a single thing to do with Iran nuclear ambitions is missing the plot. The nuclear angle is a ruse, if they weren’t perusing a nuke, then the problem would be ballistic missiles and missile production in general, if they didn’t have a missile program, then the problem would be that they oppress their people, are restricting oil production, selling oil to the “axis of evil” or some other such nonsense.
Here’s the deal, Israel wants Iran shattered — period — end of story. How they package it for general media consumption is irrelevant if you understand the goal.
Iran was #8 on the Kissinger list.
Russia vs West Europe #9 – everyone gearing up for war following their masters’ orders. So far, anyway.
So we’d better start waking up. Fast. A couple of thousand insane would-be dictators against the rest of the world. One team. That’s the message.
France says 30-40% Gulf energy infrastructure destroyed
It will take 3-4 years for supplies to recover just from this much damage. And if Trump puts boots on the ground they could destroy the other 60-70% as well.
In other news Reuters calculates that Ukrainian attacks have reduced Russia’s oil export capacity by 40%.
The world is on the very of a lasting economic crisis worse than COVID. And if these two wars don’t stop it might become the worst global crisis in the modern era.
Instead of building strong, durable infrastructure and just societies, Trump and BiBi have the world dancing on a volcano of hatred, death and exploitation.
American families go without healthcare and healthy food, they drown in debt for mediocre educational opportunities, die destitute when the last days medical piranhas chew the flesh off of their bones.
Yet we can somehow spend trillions on Israels constant wars, expansion and fanatical aggression ~ which has never provided anything in return for our investment or, our serviceman’s lives.
Fun facts:
Israel has universal healthcare – they pay a tax of 3 to 5 of their income, with co-payments for some standard services and government funding for the rest.
Free college too – Free higher education is available to Israeli citizens and permanent residents who have completed their mandatory military or national service. The Israeli government offers a four-year scholarship to qualifying students to pay tuition costs.
fun fact!!
pretty much every country in g20 have universal health care
it is simple economics. it is cheaper to buy something in bulk,
Israel OR NOT. it is USA problem.
Also cheaper when you cut out the middlemen, the insurance companies and administrators who siphon off hundreds of billions of dollars in healthcare funding.
Israel have highest birth rate among developed countries
i am pretty much sure it is highest in g20!
i say MONEY WELL SPENT!
Wouldn’t it be great if the US were paying for the healthcare and education of its citizens rather than funding Israel’s war machine, allowing Israel to spend their own money on healthcare and education?
pure USA!!
small country of 10 mil conquered country w/ 330 mil!
i cry in the night !! :))
=mish misses most important fact
Iran is pretty much educated nation( top 20 for sure )
so if some country wanted Iran to become nuclear , Iran would get one from – Russia/ china/ n Korea/ Pakistan/india/france/ etc etc
======
BUT NOBODY WANTS this!
why ? cause Iran;s regime fundamentally fu11cked up!
and even current leaders are more or less sane, WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN IF MORE RADICAL branch take over???
do you want Taliban have nuclear weapons?
do you have radical/ communists in S. America have nuclear?
see??
alx
so
hate or love Israel, WE DONT HAVE ANY PROBLEMS /W Israel HAVING 100 *300 NUCLEAR WARHEADS, and this despite Israel having implicit/ explicit USA military umbrella
why ? CAUSE Israel Gov IS SANE!
What is the most probably way for a “RADICAL branch” to take over? A widespread attack on leadership, infrastructure and the people is a great way to encourage that.
Meanwhile a radical branch has already taken over in the United States of America…
there are internal problems and diff fractions inside iran!
Almost every Iranian speaks at least 2 languages, they are taught Arabic and farsi in school.
People act like it is some backward country ruled by religious illiterates.
it is not.
Rafael Grossi said Iran was not being transparent with the inspecting agency IAEA back in 2024. He said the same this past weekend while be interviewed by the mainstream media. If even the United Nations through its IAEA says Iran is showing lack of transparency, then why should Iran be trusted ?
https://www.armscontrol.org/act/2024-03/news/iaea-warns-iran-about-lack-transparency
he is cia tool. dont pay attention
Total CIA tool. Grossi went along with the Ukrainian lie that it was Russia attacking the Zaporozhye nuclear power plant that they – the Russians – already controlled and were operating. Western propaganda doesn’t even have to make sense and people will still believe it. The Grossi-led IAEA also fed personal data about Iranian scientists to Israel – who promptly murdered them with air strikes last June.
Mainstream media? The one owned by blood thirsty Zionists that are turning America into a debt laden military monster?
Balance whoever the hell that is with the list of people and agencies I noted.
And please note your silly timeline – it’s AFTER Trump cancelled the deal.
Sheeesh
Now do a post about he US inspections of Dimona back in the 1960’s
Iran should just build or buy nuclear weapons and deny it has them, refusing any IAEA inspections. The worst that could be said about such a strategy is that Iran is just like Israel.
If Trump would just have swallowed the fact that Obama is way above his league as a logical and fact-based thinker, we wouldn’t now be in this messed up Iran situation.
If Trump would have just swallowed a hunk of lead we wouldn’t be in this situation.
If that deep state operation in Butler PA had succeeded, Nikki Haley might be president (with Pompeo as veep). We might be in the same stupid war – although she doesn’t have an antichrist son in law.
Agree….because Trump couldn’t handle a black person being president.
But more importantly because about 30% of Americans appear to like a bit of racism and so support him. Struggling to find any other rationales for Maga.
There isn’t any other.
Obama isn’t “black” his mother is white.
do you really think USA President sits in WH and think?
Yes lots of reasons. First trump has a thing about obama. Wants to one up him. ( i would say the whole republican party )Think that is why he tare down anything hes done and then rebuilds back the same thing.
Second to keep minds off the files
Third to keep two criminals out of jail. Trump and bibi
Fourth graft to make money any way he can
Funny seeing some folks in comments below like Jojo playing 5d chess with this war. Lets chill out , this is all to quell Epstein files noise.
My take the easiest way to stop this debacle would be for rich Arab sovereign funds to just start selling US assets and cause stock crash (you know all those petro dollars supporting everybody 401k for last few decades). This would immediately put Trump on alert as Dow Jones is only thing he cares about.
When this happen Trump will just do 180 change again and all those folks now doing this grand planning of how to solve Iran thread will be left behind, as always.
Folks still didn’t learn. Supporting Donnie means you stop thinking and just follow the cult leader.”. Just don’t become to engaged in those as it might change overnight.
I’m getting the feeling that the Saudis are content watching Trump weaken America and Iran all at once, while they sit back and watch.
Where does that leave Israel?
Who cares?
Gold down 15%, but Crypto up 10%. Oil only at $90-110 when spot markets are $150+. Dow down only 7% since the start of the war. You know they’re doing everything they can behind the scenes to distort prices.
You’re right that financial damage is the one sure thing that’s going to stop the escalation, but it doesn’t look like that’s happening anytime soon.
Dow Jones is ultimate war front for Trump and he will do anything to keep it up. Everybody knows Donald now how all his announcement are done over weekend or how he TACOs out when stocks are down. Issue is at some point all those other players will also play this game and will test him.
My main point of that post was having a little laugh for all those folks below trying to articulate how Trump the prophet is saving the world and how we liberate Iran doing Gods work.
You know being in a cult is just like that, you build some narrative to try to make sense of it all.
I am sure when Donnie declares Iran war over (for whatever reason he chooses) those folks like Jojo or Doug78 will be explaining to all of us here how leaving Iran behind was always a part of plan and how Donnie outsmarted everybody.
But that is OK, every discussion board have folks like that.
They might be annoying, they might irritate folksbut but they are ours here.
Let them participate and make this board strong.
paper gold!
try to get 1000/5000 ounces gold , physical
you will be surprised
If you have the means, buy an appropriate futures contract and stand for delivery.
sure..
and at last day big boys will mark PAPER gold top price (= to sell) and next day drop into abyss!
buddy i am not 5 years old.! i have been around
=====
REMEMBER NEGATIVE OIL prices in USA 5 7 years ago?
have anyone got jailed?
It’d make absolutely no difference to the satanic Zionist theocracy in Washington and In Telaviv.
It took years to negotiate the Obama-era Iran nuclear deal, and it involved European allies and Russia to get it done. Trump would never spend months, let alone years, negotiating anything. He does not really negotiate; he threatens, he breaks things, and he breaks prior agreements in order to force an outcome. That is not negotiation as seen in the business world or in any other government-to-government realm; you see these tactics only among criminal organizations.
Do not be surprised if Trump’s “negotiations” that he keeps talking about are just a stall tactic because the several thousand soldiers in boats have not arrived yet. It is pretty clear that the prior negotiations by the real estate developer and the nepo-billionaire were just to lull Iran into a state of complacency ahead of the attack.
The Iranians would need to be really dumb to fall for it. I’m afraid that you could be right that it’s a stall tactic, and afraid that Iran knows it and is preparing a welcome for our soldiers. It’s like watching a disaster unfold and not being able to do a thing to stop it.
excellent comments
The Iranians are carefully preparing for the US invasion……they know the “negotiations” talk is just noise.
I’m reviewing every comment. The majority want to “give peace a chance”….but we’ve given Iran lots of chances and they spit in everybody’s faces….just like Nazis. Just like Putin.
Trump spit in Iran’s face.
Stop being a moron
it is Ukraine404 bot
as soon as putin is nazi. it is clear
Iran has not attacked us and was not a threat to us—at least not until our unprovoked attacks on them this year and last year. But it goes back a lot longer than that.
The U.S. used force to remove Iran’s democratically elected leader in 1953 and replaced him with our puppet dictator, the Shah, who was ruthless and brutal in his authoritarian rule over Iranians. Iranians finally rebelled in 1979 and overthrew this brutal dictator. We worked with their neighbor Iraq to get them to invade Iran and supplied the Iraqis with biological weapons they used to slaughter thousands of Iranians. Yet you call Iranians Nazis or Putin!
Israel is the most fascist regime on the planet today. Despite the US declaring Iran terrorists, the reality is that Israel is the leading terrorist in the world, attacking almost all of its neighbors repeatedly. They have committed genocide in Gaza, rule the West Bank like a police state, routinely torturing and executing Palestinians, and are now seizing territory from Lebanon as they bomb civilians there. Israel has nuclear weapons yet refuses to comply with international nuclear laws and IEA inspections. They lie to the world and state that they don’t have nuclear weapons. The U.S. supports this lie and doesn’t care that Israel routinely and systematically commits war crimes and lies to the world.
The U.S. and Israel have massive propaganda machines that persuade people like you that it is perfectly OK for Israel to massacre civilians, to drop thousand pound bombs every day for months and years on a Gaza population that is completely unable to defend themselves from these attacks. But Iran is the problem to you. You need to wake up and educate yourself on what is really going on!
In Israel’s defense, they don’t consider the goyim humans.
Agree, the Israelis believe that they are God’s Chosen People and that Arabs are sub-human. They want them all to leave the MidEast, willingly, or as we see in Gaza, in body bags.
Newflash, they think of you as a subhuman as well….wake-up.
=just like Nazis. Just like Putin.
look uki404 bot..
still shiting in kitty box in kiev?
he majority want to “give peace a chance”….but we’ve given Iran lots of chances and they spit in everybody’s faces….just like Nazis. Just like Putin.
===
actually mo1ron IT IS QUITE OPPOSITE. IT IS CALLED projection
====
putin gave ukraine nazi lots of time since 2014 : minsk minks 2, and before that yanukovich got guarantees from Europe too in 2014 start
AND UKRAINE404 nazi / zelensky BROKE OFF ALL OF THAT!
you should be trained more… SO ENJOY your kitty box !
Posted this 13 minutes ago and it’s still on hold—-waiting for approval?
ohn
13 minutes ago
Awaiting for approval
From article…Nikki Haley: Donald Trump is everything I taught my kids not to do in Kindergarten. ……… Seems like the Donald is now entering his second childhood and still hasn’t learned a thing.
I do not monitor this 24×7
If something goes into moderation, and I do not always know why, I approve comments when I see them.
One possible reason is your IP address changed, I do not know. Just guessing.
Thanks Mike for your response — as we never know the reason for many glitches at other online sites.
fact is, Iran had made significant concessions in the weeks before the US attacked
peace was not the outcome Kushner, Witkoff, Trump, Israel or Saudi’s wanted
attack now before an agreement happened…
https://theconversation.com/iran-has-been-attacked-by-us-and-israel-when-peace-was-within-reach-277175
Correct
too close to an agreement for the Saudi/Israel tool Kushner and Zionist Wifkoff and the President compromised by millions from Saudi Arabia and Zionists decided it was time to act
an agreement and peace could not be permitted..
…Sensing how close the negotiations were — and how imminent military escalation had become — Oman’s foreign minister, Badr Albusaidi, made an emergency dash to Washington in a last-ditch effort to preserve the diplomatic track.
In an unusually public move for a mediator, he appeared on CBS to outline just how far the talks had progressed. He described a deal that would eliminate Iranian stockpiles of highly enriched uranium, down-blend existing material inside Iran, and allow full verification by the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) — with the possibility of US inspectors participating alongside them. Iran, he suggested, would enrich only for civilian purposes. A principles agreement, he indicated, could be signed within days. It was a remarkable disclosure — effectively revealing the contours of a near-breakthrough in an attempt to prevent imminent war.
But rather than allowing diplomacy to conclude, the US and Israel have launched coordinated strikes across Iran. Explosions were reported in Tehran and other cities. Trump announced “major combat operations,”, framing them as necessary to eliminate nuclear and missile threats while urging Iranians to seize the moment and overthrow their leadership. Iran responded with missile and drone attacks targeting US bases and allied states across the region…
https://theconversation.com/iran-has-been-attacked-by-us-and-israel-when-peace-was-within-reach-277175
Mr. Albusaidi made a valiant effort.
Seems as I try to post anything is is flagged as (Waiting for Approval) over 20 minutes later?
it doesn’t like certain url links…reasons
From article…Nikki Haley: Donald Trump is everything I taught my kids not to do in Kindergarten. ……… Seems like the Donald is now entering his second childhood and still hasn’t learned a thing.
I’m not a Trump guy, and it’s true that he’s a liar, a tax cheat, a serial sexual assaulter, who is regarded by historians as the worst President in the history of America. I can’t say much with authority that the Iran nuclear deal was a good solution because Iran has a long history of lying and making trouble, just like Donald Trump. Inspectors cannot find secret nuclear installations buried deep in the ground and Iran continued to develop ballistic missiles, which are often used to carry nuclear weapons.
I will say this, while I agree that Trump is a terrible leader and has corrupted a lot of federal agencies, this war in Iran made some sense to me. Iran showed us their real selves when they proceeded to attack their nearby Arab countries, who did not attack Iran. And they shut down the Strait….which is an act of war….and the ramifications affect most of the world economically.
In my opinion, which differs from Mish’s opinion, I think the war in Iran makes sense since they’ve been such a disruptive player in the Middle East and even in Europe. It’s a fact that they pay for and arm terrorist organizations, and one of those groups attacked Israel over 2 years ago. Israel was so frustrated with Hamas, that they basically leveled Gaza. You have to remember that over 1200 Israelis were slaughtered that day by Hamas…and Hamas runs Gaza. Many people in Gaza supported that strike, and every member of Hamas is from Gaza. The Israelis killed that day was proportionately far worse than Pearl Harbor, where about 3000 were killed in a surprise attack by the Japanese. Over the next 4 years we leveled Japan. Approximately 10 million Japanese died during WW2….and nobody back then called it a “genocide”.
When Iran shut down the Hormuz Strait, they basically declared war on the Middle East and every country that buys there oil and gas. It was economic terrorism. So they revealed how far they would go, even attacking countries that had never harmed them. It was very provocative. I don’t like Trump at all, but this war eventually needed to be fought, and it took a reckless psychopath to start it….Donald Trump. Now I hope our military can finish the job without a protracted war that will kill thousands of Americans.
We should be arming dissident groups in Iran so they can fight this regime with real weapons. If necessary, we should help them with back-up military support. If I were Trump, I’d be dropping into Iran 20,000 machine guns, shoulder-fired missiles, grenades and small weapon systems to arm an insurgency. A serious civil war in Iran would keep the Republican Guard, and other Iranian troops, busy….too busy to support insurgencies outside the country that attack Saudi Arabia, Israel, Yemen and Lebanon. When a hated government has to fight a civil war to protect their power, they don’t have the time and money to finance Terror in Syria, Gaza, Lebanon or anywhere else. That’s my 2 cents.
Hamas leader personally went to putin before the attack. I figure putin wanted a distraction from Ukraine.
Yes Netanyahu wanted a war just isn’t getting what he expected. So much winning almost every day. Is everyone tired yet?
It seems to me if the orange man-baby hadn’t torn up the JCPOA deal we could have normalized relations by now. Hell, we even have a relatively decent relationship with Vietnam, despite all we did to their country. Instead the world’s dumbest man, who’s also the world’s biggest a-hole has brought us to the brink of strategic defeat and the end of American hegemony.
You can’t “normalize” with religious driven terrorists. Religious leaders should never be in political control of a country!
AIPAC has entered the chat
And the far right
Like the fundamentalist christian fanatics yapping about red heifers and the rapture?
They aren’t in charge. They are PART of the leadership but don’t have absolute control as the Islamists do in Iran.
Correct. Netanyahu is running US foreign policy. He just uses the evangelical rubes.
Oh really? Hegseth isn’t babbling on about how the military is supposedly doing the Lord’s work?
“You can’t “normalize” with religious driven terrorists”
Does MAGA qualify? Christian Nationalism certainly does. The Sec of Defense thinks (or states) that this is a war for Jesus.
regime change? Not that I thought that was the reason for this incursion but attacking Iran has not turned the people against those in power This is an example of how the people of Iran are pulling together/organizing to defend their homeland/country:
https://www.wired.com/story/iranians-dont-have-a-missile-alert-system-so-volunteers-built-their-own-warning-map/
There are 20-30 million people in Iran who were special treated as members of the IRGC and the Islamic theocracy. Of course they will fight for the continuance of the Regime. .
But there are 60 million who consider themselves oppressed by the Regime and want their freedom.
From your past posts, you sound like an IRGC member or perhaps a family sympathiser outside the country. Hope they catch up to you.
So Trump should go himself and stir up a rebellion since you’re such an expert on what Iranians want.
Compared to yourself, I am indeed an expert in likely everything.
You hide your light well.
From what I have read America wants to control the Global Oil Markets as a strategy to undermine China who has a monopoly on Rare Earths, etc. Russia and Venezeula and Middle East have been supplying the Oil that China needs and now all 3 of these areas face American agression. Iran is the strongest country in the Middle East who is now supported by Russia and China with modern weapons and technology. If Iran goes under than China will be hobbled getting Middle East Oil. Israel works with America to undermine Iran as they are the last big obstacle for America controlling energy policy throughout the Middle East. Iran will only satisfy the USA by totally disarming and becoming a serfdom under American policies. Iran has decided to fight rather than roll over and that is totally unacceptable for Americans Energy control goals. All 3 of these American supported wars are mostly just to hobble energy supply to China?
fast forward to today Drone Attack On Parked U.S. Army Black Hawk In Iraq A Harbinger Of What’s To ComeThe ballooning threat from FPV drones pose a major risk to American aircraft parked on ramps in war zones and in the United States.
https://www.twz.com/air/drone-attack-on-parked-u-s-army-black-hawk-in-iraq-a-harbinger-of-whats-to-come
In return. Another Mossad operation? 😁
Obama’s agreement was seriously flawed.
While it put a fence around Iran’s nuclear program development, it left wide open Iran’s missile programs, regional influence peddling and funding of proxy terrorist groups, all of which helped create further destabilization in the Middle East.
Plus the early sunset clause in the original agreement gave Iran the right to then resume their nuclear bomb ambitions, while having benefited from years of no sanctions.
All in all, Obama’s agreement was seriously lacking. Too much hope and dreaming!
Because it wasn’t possible to enter another agreement? And I thought we were butthurt about nuclear weapons? Now you’re adding conditions?
Some people believe doing nothing when presented with a clear imminent danger is somehow wise. myself I see it as sticking your head in the sand. Obama’s policy just pushed the problem down the road. Of course at the time we didn’t yet have the means.
By that logic, Israel (or any other country) *might* be a problem down the road, so we should attack them now on any pretext.
Yes, which is why we should do North Korea next. Their puny nuclear arsenals will be of no real concern.
For a moment I thought it might be sarcasm, but then saw “Jojo”. Sigh. North Korea has ICBMs (with possible incorporation of Russian design aspects) which we are unlikely to be able to intercept. If all of those are housed on these ICBMs, there’s little chance we could avoid destruction of many urban complexes across the U.S. unless all were destroyed before they exit their silo.
They also have diesel submarines. They could send a few of those out on short notice to provide a capability to destroy several U.S. cities even if we managed to decapitate their leadership.
Edit : also note that Russia has a comprehensive defense treaty with North Korea. If we take out North Korea, Russia will finish us off.
Don’t confuse him with facts.
“Russia will finish us off.”
Russia hasn’t been able to finish Ukraine off in 4 years! Whatever you are smoking must be powerful! 🤣🤣🤣
Nuclear weapons, fool.
You go, tough guy.
Anyone who believes in Rule of Law can see the problem here. What is the Rule of Law for this situation? It appears to be that if a nation believes, in its sole determination and without any international review, that another nation is a threat, or even a potential threat at some point in the future, that the nation making that determination has the right to attack the threatening nation militarily.
The problem with that Rule of Law is that it means that if Iran or China or Russia or any other country believes that Israel or the United States is threatening, then we have to accept that they have the right to attack Israel or the United States militarily. Right?
Sorry, meant to direct this to Doug
“Covenants without the sword are but words”.
Hobbes
There is no “International Law” because there is no world policeman to enforce them. There are agreements, covenants and even courts but there is no way to make a large, powerful country from doing something except by force be it moral, economic or military or a combination of. Iran wanted nuclear weapons and use them to blackmail the region. With long distance missiles that blackmail would have spread to Europe. Their past behavior and their ideological view of the world makes almost certain that sooner of later they would be used. Many say so what. I don’t want to get involved but they are already involved even if they don’t want to be. Nuclear-tipped ballistic missiles do not recognize borders nor international law.
EXCLUSIVE VIDEO of Europeans when asked to help unblock the strait of hormuz
https://bsky.app/profile/hadas.bsky.social/post/3mh63exy3x223
To answer the question: yes. There is no deal with Iran that will satisfy Trump’s overlord in Israel.
Bingo! We have a winner!
Exactly, Israel wants all Islamic countries in the Middle East to be neutered and have no ability to defend themselves. Israel wants full control of the entire Middle East.
No one who really wants peace makes a regular habit of murdering negotiators in Middle East peace talks. Israel does it systematically and routinely. Israel wants permanent war where they are the best armed nation in the region.
I believe that Trump tore up the JCPOA for one reason and one reason only: he could not stand that Obama had actually achieved something substantial which was working. The facts didn’t matter–he had to destroy Obama personally. He is still that way, moving Obama’s portrait to a hidden stairwell with a plaque labeling Obama “one of the most divisive political figures in American history.” If we just put the previous JCPOA back in place but called it “Trump’s nuclear deal”, then maybe we could end this stupid war?
The main reason why the US came up with the JCPOA is that there was no other viable alternative. The Pentagon had been war-gaming/simulating a total war scenario with Iran for decades and the outcome was always a no-win scenario or a pyrrhic victory at best.
It was well known that Iran could destroy the Gulf’s infrastructure and close the Strait, and there was little the US could do about it. This war is playing out exactly as the Pentagon had predicted it would.
MAGA folks, mainly due to intellectual handicaps and low EQ development, cannot comprehend that there are strategically unwinnable military scenarios, no matter how strong you are. Iran is one of them. A total war with Iran It wasn’t tried before not due to lack of courage.
No wonder it took Bibi 30 years to find a president intellectually stumped enoguh to start this war.
Bibi took a “1-2-3” approach with Trump: step one was convincing him to get out of the JCPOA. Step two was convincing him to bomb Iran’s nuclear facilities. Step three: attempt regime change, ostensibly to get the enriched uranium that was still in Iran. Step four (when step three fails) will be to convince Trump to nuke Iran.
I fear that is coming very soon.
You people forget that there are probably 60 million or more Iranians (at least 2/3 of the population) hoping and praying that the US will put boots on the ground and free them from the oppression of the Islamic theoarcy that lords over them.
With a little help from the US< they would be willing to take up weapons we give them to hunt down and execute all IRGC members.
Any war can be won if you’re willing to fight for real, which as I said is what Genghis Khan and others did in the historical past. That is, to kill as necessary and even when unnecessary to make a point as to who is in charge.
Where is it in the Constitution that it is the US government and tax payer’s responsibility to liberate other countries?
Is that what Trump ran on, on liberating the Iranian people with boots on the ground? What happened to ‘America first’?
You people seem to “forget’ lots of things.
The Constitution is old writing on old paper by men who are long dead and wouldn’t understand our modern world.. It is best ignored.
Spoken like a true fascist. So much for “America First!” – it was always just a cheap marketing slogan.
Who died and made you an expert pn Iranian public opinion?
These facts are all well-established. Those that don’t believe them are simply in denial due to 1. love of war/chest-pounding, 2. bigotry against muslims, 3. an irrational devotion to Israel and whatever it wants.
The IEA and the UN both cleared Iraq of a nuclear weapons program. That didn’t stop the war criminal US.
The IEA is art of the UN. Both are not exactly trustworthy entities. They would rather roll over and get their belly scratched than actually bite someone.
You’re part right. The IAEA did provide Intel to Israel on Iranian scientists so they could be murdered last June.
The problem is, the war wasn’t waged because of nuclear weapons. That was just the excuse that was used.
The irony of all time is going to be when the U.S. or Israel use nukes against Iran in an attempt to win the war. They really are that deranged.
Agree fully. We started this war on Israel’s behalf because Israel wants Iran – the most powerful country in the region – destroyed. Just like they wanted Libya and Iraq and Syria destroyed. They also want the Gulf Arab states destroyed – which is why they bombed Iran’s gas field – so that Iran would attack Qatar’s.
I used to think that Israel would use their nukes. Then I heard Dr. Robert Pape https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Pape predict that Israel would get the US to do it – just like they prod Trump into everything. Apparently we’ve already sent 1-2 E-6B Mercury (doomsday) planes to the region. If anyone uses a nuke first, it will be the US. Hopefully Iran is racing to have several atomic bombs that can ward Trump off from doing something so insane.
Yeah, it will probably be the U.S. doing the dirty deed. They’ll bomb one of the supposed nuclear sites with a nuke and perhaps a military site in order to intimidate Iran into surrendering. Well, Iran is not going to surrender even if nukes are dropped. Then what?
The problem may come with what Iran decides to do in response to being nuked, which is probably fire all they have against Israel to severely damage their infrastructure. Then what? More nukes on Iran probably, this time coming from Israel. As long as things keep escalating, this is where it could lead.
We need some new nuke photos with more explosive power and modern photography! Those old WWII versions are tiring.
The rest of the world may step in and stop the US and Israel. Unleashing nukes could be world ending or close to it.
They prob worked on some nukes after they were attacked last summer.
Hope so.
Which is why they were attacked again and if necessary will bein the future.
As far as we know, no evidence was presented that nuclear weapons were being developed at the time the war began. Tulsi Gabbard, who confirmed no evidence existed as of March 2025, on March 18 dodged a line of questioning at the legally required annual threat assessment hearing before Congress. She refused to state that it was the intelligence community’s (IC) assessment that Iran presented an “imminent threat”, instead pointing at Trump as “the only person who can determine what is and is not an imminent threat”.
We also had Witkoff state to the media that he interpreted Iranian admission to still having 420 kg of 60% enriched uranium (sufficient to build 11 nuclear bombs) as a boast and an immediate threat to the United States and Israel.
So we appear to have a situation where the IC did not conclude there was an imminent threat, but may have been overridden by the opinion of Trump’s zionist interlocuters who have no experience other than doing business deals. Tulsi seems to put the blame for determining “imminent threat” squarely on Trump.
You don’t know bupkis. Your opinion is of zero value. And no one in power gives a hoot as to what you opinion might be in any case Now go kick your dog.
You forgot to add “stupid goy”.
I’d kick you from the forum if I could, and I couldn’t give a shit if it happens.
Trump as “the only person who can determine what is and is not an imminent threat”.
That statement should terrify the world and align every other nation against the US as long as the trump regime is in power. When will the American people stand up and eliminate this threat?
I doubt that. The former supreme leader had in place a religious fatwa since the early 2000s prohibiting their development and use which was never announced as dropped. From a line of questioning using Google AI, there are aspects I find concerning which further calls into question the wisdom of killing Ali Khamenei. Apparently, as a religious fatwa which never was codified as a government decree, upon his death at the start of this war it is considered no longer binding. Unless his son imposes a new fatwa, it becomes a political/military decision. My guess is that, seeing the existential nature of the war which may be renewed regardless of possible negotiations, they will go forward with building nuclear weapons.
I think those who believe a Fundamentalist Shiite regime would (could not) long-term negotiate coexistence terms with a crusader West and, would never be inclined to NOT have complete power to administrate and (through force) control the gulf and strait when that regime decided it needed to believe that regime would eventually have such weapons – and, who knows, needed a path and time to finance, get there and avoid conflict until such time as it could dominate. IOW, such people just did not believe the JCPOA was right and (ultimately) effective.
As we can see by what is happening (right vs wrong, just vs unjust aside) Iran would destroy commerce to serve its purposes when it had to. It is just being pushed to “had to” sooner than it expected.
The world cannot (should not) leave such a vital world commerce sea way welfare to such a regime. Destroy the regime and do what we can to aid a more Liberal regime to take charge in Iran. As for the likely civil war? So be it. We, soon, may have our own to worry about and resolve.
Spoken like a true warmonger in a MAGA hat who has not learned a dam F’ing thing from Vietnam, Afghanistan, Libya, Iraq, etc.
What the flying F do you not understand about the assessment of literally everyone but Trump.
I hope you are volunteering along with Lindsey Graham to lead the charge in this insane effort.
God how stupid.
Wow I applaud your tolerance of opposing viewpoints
Ok to be upset because we are all paying for this futile war and the blood of our children will be next price to pay. Oh yeah, while Trump and his family will be enriching themselves to the tune of hundreds of millions of dollars (billions?) at our expense.
Well fuck you too. I’m far from a MAGA. But I understand the Power Politics of the day. Right or Wrong, Trump has handed “the world” a chance to really protect itself from the Iranian regime. Trump may have screwed up a chance to delay risk and problems via the JCPOA but that was then (his first term) and this is now. We are where we are “now”. No, I did not vote for that either but it has been handed to us both. Stupid is as stupid does (Forest Gump) and it will be stupid to leave that regime in charge. There are others in Iran who are (I guess) stupid too. Not as much any more as an estimated 30K have been wiped out trying.
Let me guess? 9/11? Nope, Sunni fanatics, sponsored and funded by Saudi Arabia and the Gulfie tyrannies.
Al Qaeda? Nope, Sunni fanatics, sponsored and funded by Saudi Arabia and the Gulfie tyrannies.
ISIS? Nope, Sunni fanatics, sponsored and funded by Saudi Arabia and the Gulfie tyrannies.
But go on, tell how bad Iran is.
This is how bad Iran is. And why, other (Sunni) nations are concerned.
https://landwise-production.s3.amazonaws.com/2022/03/Iran_Constitution_1979.pdf
What exactly is your point and why do you want us to be dragged into someone else’s religious beef?
Iran closed the Strait. It’s an act of war. I think Mish likes this exchange. It’s contentious. Leave Iran alone and they will have an ICBM that can reach Washington in 2 or 3 years. Once you kick this hornets next, you must finish them off….or they’ll come back harder.
Did you forget that we lost to the Taliban?
“Iran closed the Strait. It’s an act of war.”
The real act of war was the United States and Israel’s unprovoked attack on Iran. The Strait being closed by Iran is the natural and logical result of our attack on Iran.
Why did Iran close the Strait? Just out of sheer meanness? Or was it in response to an American and Israeli attack on them, just maybe?
And since you’re whining about an “act of war” you forget that the United States committed an act of war when it attacked Iran.
It started in 1979. You must be a youngin.
Yup. 47 years and they’ve never attacked the U.S. even after we supplied the chemical weapons to Sadam Hussein that killed 300,000 Iranians
They had no means to attack the US. They were working on those means in the form of their atomic weapons while destabilizing the Middle East.
We took preemptive action (call it a sucker punch). Too bad for all the dead Regime members and their families that benefited from the corruption of this religious theocracy. I wonder of the families of the dead leaders still get admitted to the special food co-op just for Regime and IGRC members? I hope not.
Some day, you may make a post that is based on using your brain, instead of just spewing out partisan rhetoric. I’ll be waiting for that day.
I’ve never heard we supplied the gas. Do you have some proof of that?
Rumsfeld joked that we knew Saddam had chemical weapons because we had the receipts.
I tried to link to an article, but it is “Awaiting for approval”
Here is what Chat GPT says:
U.S. Involvement in the Iran-Iraq WarSupport for IraqDuring the Iran-Iraq War (1980-1988), the United States provided significant support to Iraq. This included:
Chemical Weapons UsageIraq employed chemical weapons extensively during the war, including:
Strategic ImpactThe use of chemical weapons had a profound effect on the war:
U.S. AwarenessThe U.S. was aware of Iraq’s chemical weapons program and its use during the war. Reports indicated that:
This complex relationship highlights the geopolitical dynamics of the era, where the U.S. prioritized strategic interests over humanitarian concerns.
It started in 1953 when the CIA (with British intelligence) violently overthrew Iran’s democratically elected leader and replaced him with a brutal dictator
Wait, Iran closed the Strait 47 years ago and nobody told anyone?
Or are you bringing up something entirely unrelated to the Straits of Hormuz?
Iran is a dangerous, Islamic/fascist state who has openly attacked many gulf countries. That is undeniable. Closing an important international seaway is an act of war. Everybody knows that. Saudi Arabia is privately encouraging Trump to put an end to the Islamic Republlic. They may be backing it up with money, which Trump loves very much. Trump takes payoffs…we know that. Switzerland gave him a gold brick to lower their tariffs and he did it. Who knows what Trump is getting in “gifts”? Saudi Arabia “gifted” Jared Kuskner (a Trump family member) $2 billion…and other Gulf states chipped in another billion dollars. We cannot know exactly what’s going on, but for almost 50 years, I’ve watched Iran. I consider the people running Iran to Islamic Nihilists who will do just about anything. I’m a registered Republican and did not vote For a Criminal like Trump, but sometimes it takes a loudmouth and bully to take on another loudmouth and bully. My fear is Trump will back down and Iran will continue developing ICBMs (and they can hit Europe now) and nuclear payloads. I consider Iran to be so dangerous, nothing should be off the table. If we put soldiers in there, I’d like to see soldiers from UAE, Oman, Saudi, Kuwait…all of Gulf States…in there with us. I would compare the Islamic State to the Nazis. Islam has made a lot of people crazy. Trump wants to start with the electric grid, but I’d start with the mosques, because that’s the source of the ideology driving Iran. They want all the Infidels dead..
The USA is a dangerous, Christian/fascist state who has openly attacked many gulf countries both directly and through their close ally Israel. That is undeniable. A sneak attack on an unsuspecting country during negotiations is an act of war. Everybody knows that. Saudi Arabia and Israel are privately encouraging Trump to put an end to Iran.
“Iran is a dangerous, Islamic/fascist state who has openly attacked many gulf countries”
The last time Iran attacked any country was in the 1790s. “Undeniable” my ass.
You are quite the busybody. Are you by chance on an HOA board?
SAD…
Mish, I respect your intelligence and the writer you’re calling “stupid” has a right to his opinion, even if it conflicts with yours. In some polls, many Americans support this war. That doesn’t make them stupid. There’s a lot of ways to look at this problem….and nobody can really know for certain what Iran’s real intentions are. What we know is what they’ve done….they’ve attacked innocent countries, sometimes destroying oil and gas infrastructure. It’s blackmail….and an act of war. UAE, Kuwait, Dubai and Qatar did not start this war. They did not attack Iran. Yet Iran sent hundreds of missiles, maybe thousands, into neighboring countries that did nothing to Iran. Iran is a problem and the solution will be costly if regime change is the goal. I don’t believe Iran is a benign player in all of this. They’ve consistently for 40 years referred to America as the Big Satan. They hate us. And they must hate UAE, Oman and the others too.
“they’ve attacked innocent countries, sometimes destroying oil and gas infrastructure”
That’s BS. Before Feb 28, Iran warned these countries they would be considered hostile if their territory was used to launch attacks (i.e. host U.S. bases involved in operations or allow flyover operations). Still, Iran has applied restraint for what has been targeted, but as promised they have retaliated against energy assets when their own energy infrastructure is bombed.
These Arabs nations probably are in disbelief how defenseless they are against Iranian bombardments, and how ineffective Patriot systems have been (should have asked Ted Postol about it). But that does not excuse their behavior. Given prevailing confidence about American military power against Iran, they probably thought they could get onside with the United States and pretend to be sort of neutral with words but not actions and not experience severe consequences. If they wanted no part of a clearly-telegraphed war, they should have ordered the Americans to leave!
You have been conditioned by 70 years of AIPAC propaganda, whose main goal was to make sure Americans heard only one side of the story—the Israeli side. AIPAC has worked very hard to eliminate any contrary narrative by bribing politicians and attacking mainstream media who ever presents an alternative viewpoint. The point is to eliminate debate and provide ONLY Israel’s view to American citizens. Why can’t you see the film ‘No Other Land’, which won ‘Best Documentary’ at the Oscars 2 or 3 years ago? The Israel lobby worked very hard to ensure that it could not be distributed in America and threatened to tell the press that a distributor was antisemitic if it did not refuse to carry it. This is the way things work in America. Read The Israel Lobby by John Mearsheimer if you want to better understand its workings.
Iran showed no inclination to control flows through the Strait of Hormuz except as a necessary pressure point to eventually force U.S./Israel to agree to terms which stop further illegal acts of aggression. It was the U.S. which built military bases throughout the region and it was U.S. cooperation with Israel to create persistent instability and destruction which threatens global energy security.
But, again, let’s remember, there is among many Americans the belief that Iran would eventually gain weapons they would gladly use to dominate the Middle East.
Now I don’t know if “imminent” (by Trump) means months or years, but our children and grandchildren will be here longer than I will. I hope we take what ever steps are necessary to navigate what many smarter people than I are saying is a world in hard change. (see Ray Dalio, for one).
I stupid, (says Mish). If so, through my life, I must have been very lucky. And so must all those who have similar views.
If it makes you feel better, you might not be stupid – just propagandized. There is literally no way this war can work out well.
It all depends on what military weapons Iran was building or not. If (if) in fact, Iran was closing in on rockets powerful enough and nuclear warheads, then the war is absolutely necessary. No other force can politically negotiate with that regime. If they were “close”, when the indeed became capable of that destructive leverage, the entire world would be affected by any closure of the Persian Gulf Iran chose to assert. I don’t see how that is a tolerable condition for the Liberal era.
If they were NOT closing in, but were heading there, the potential problem would still exist.
if they were NOT, then for sure, we have demand accountability for what we are doing.
I don’t think we know yet – at least, few, if any of us believe what the other side states. What a terrible political and social circumstance we are in.
We do not have the ability to subdue the country of Iran.
This “imminent” BS getting thrown about gets tiring!
So we need to wait until what? Until Iran showed a picture of a nuke they built and a photo of them inputting the GPS coordinates of Tel Aviv, or Washington, DC? Perhaps this is the “imminent” that people are thinking of?
Instead of imminent, everyone needs to reorient and think of preemptive. That is the operative word and the action Trump took!
Thankfully, he wasn’t a wimplike Biden or Obama.
I love how you conflate a city in our country with a city that is NOT IN OUR COUNTRY.
We heard similar BS during the runup to the War On Iraq.
“But, again, let’s remember, there is among many Americans the belief that Iran would eventually gain weapons they would gladly use to dominate the Middle East.”
You mean these Americans?
https://www.zerohedge.com/political/meet-stupidest-spring-breakers-america-who-fk-ayatollah
“Black out with my rack out”
They’ve been shouting “Death To America” for 47 years. WAKE UP! The Islamic Republic is a dangerous regime. Our military can take them out. It just depends on how far they’re willing to go….and how long we will fight them. Eventually, we’ll find all their launch sites, their missile manufacturing sites, and the military safe bunkers. In one year we can seriously degrade Iran. My opinion…it’s worth it. But I’m old. I’ll never be sent there to fight. Admittedly, there’s going to be a lot of pain for everybody if this war continues. Our oil companies love it. I’m sure Trump’s getting paid off, which what guides his foreign and war policy..
So? I don’t get to shoot my next-door neighbor if they chant “Death to Mick”.
Importantly, understand what “Death to America” means. Their former supreme leader said he interpreted it as death to our policies and arrogance, not death to American people. But even if it did, that wouldn’t be a valid reason to go to war. Although I hate the idea that people around the world might actually wish death on Americans, I choose to accept that and perhaps we can work on being better people rather than killing innocents in the name of (choose whatever reason we make up today).
Another dumber than a log Irishman!
To add to your point, who else do they chant “death to’? And if it is only America they chant that about, maybe we pause and try to understand why.
BTW your neighborhood analogy is perfect and could be developed further to help maybe some of these non-Lindsey Graham types understand the absurdity of the propaganda they are parroting.
They’ve been shouting that for 47 years, and we’ve been totally fine – aside from our slide into bankruptcy due to pointless wars. Now this dipshit president, led by his antichrist son-in-law, has attacked them for no good reason and they’ve responded exactly how they said they would. And Trump is surprised. So this weekend we’re sending 5,000 Americans to invade a country with a million man army.
Since I dont see anyone rushing to help us in our endeavor, the World appears to be just fine with things the way they are.
Besides, as Maga knows, an armed society is a polite society.
That’s true and that’s on Trump and how he chose to go about this. He has many enemies. But Saudi Arabia and some other ME nations may not disagree with what Trump is doing and my point of view. We’ll see – in time.
I don’t know (factually or by probability) how at risk any nation other than Israel and ourselves was threatened by this regime, but an analysis of that needs to take more than TDS into account.
I say this as a (apparently stupid) Independent voter who refused to vote for either Prime Party since Perot ran – until Hillary Clinton and Kamala Harris ran. Now, what choices did we all have?
I understand their are may well meaning and well intended smart Democrats.but I disagreed with their policies. There was a time when people in our nation disagreed and promised to protect the rights of each other to disagree. Not any more. You’re either stupid or evil – today, I guess. Ask Mish!
Read the Iranian Constitution and tell me, then, how stupid I am.
https://landwise-production.s3.amazonaws.com/2022/03/Iran_Constitution_1979.pdf
Thank you to the two of you who think deeper. I feel like Henry Fonda in the “Twelve Angry Men” movie….only this is the Twelver Angry Suicidal Empathy Men.
Point out what aspects of their Constitution bother you the most, then I’ll decide whether to call you stupid. BTW, many countries have such documents but for these matters it’s better to judge them by recent actions than founding documents (that would also apply to the U.S.A).
As opposed to Saudi Arabia, which is an absolute monarchy and sponsor of terrorism?
Iran elects its parliament and president, but they’re “bad” while Mohammed Bone Saw (Saudi dictator) is the “good” guy. There’s no amount of bullshit these neocons can’t be spoon fed.
Bone Saw wants Trump to continue bombing Iran.
He does not want negotiations.
According to a chatGPT query you are wrong (s usual).
Did you ever think why Saudi Arabia is not on the list? You know, maybe our terrorist lists are influenced by politics and money.
Why is Donald Trump photographed in the White House shaking the hand of the former Al-Qaeda headchopper who is now head of Syria? Why was he removed off the wanted list? Huh, interesting.
I never said one word about you personally or your intelligence.
what exactly in the Iranian Constitution supports going to war with Iran?
While Iran is a threat to American interests it is not a threat to America. you maybe right, in the future, it may become a threat. However, that does not justify a war.
my brother murdered a gang banger about 25 years ago. This guy was definitely a threat, but my government imprisoned him for 15 years for it. you see, being a threat isnt enough to justify murder. I will definitely hold my government to the same standard they did my family.
having grown and made something of.myself, I work with Iranians,Magas, the Libs and I have Israelis and a host of nationalities from the mideast as clients. the one thing we can all agree on, the people who rule over us all suck.
the world isnt the internet. real people can still talk and learn from each other.
and just using an amoral risk base analysis, i would say the risk is greater in trying to prevent them from getting a nuke then dealing with them IF they got a nuke.
I, personally, don’t like the word and don’t know how others may be using the word “punish”. If Iran is working to produce a nuclear weapon and rockets to transport them, then I perfer the word “purge”.
Saudi Arabia couldn’t beat the Houthis. UAE? They’re like Liechtenstein.