Year-Over-Year Productivity Negative for 5 Quarters, That’s Never Happened Before

Labor Productivity from the BLS, chart by Mish

Today the BLS released Labor Productivity and Costs for 2023 Q1. Let’s take a look.

Labor Productivity Details 

  •  Labor productivity, or output per hour, is calculated by dividing an index of real output by an index of hours worked by all persons, including employees, proprietors, and unpaid family workers. 
  • Nonfarm business sector labor productivity decreased 2.7 percent in the first quarter of 2023
  • Output increased 0.2 percent and hours worked increased 3.0 percent.
  • From the same quarter a year ago, nonfarm business sector labor productivity decreased 0.9 percent, reflecting a 1.3-percent increase in output and a 2.3-percent increase in hours worked. 
  • The 1.1-percent rate of productivity growth in the current business cycle thus far is a historically low productivity growth rate; no other previous business cycle had lower productivity growth, except for the brief six-quarter cycle from 1980 Q1 to 1981 Q3, which exhibited 1.0 percent growth. 
  • The 0.9-percent productivity decline is the first time the four-quarter change series has remained negative for five consecutive quarters; this series begins in the first quarter of 1948. 

Unit Labor Cost Details 

  • Unit labor costs in the nonfarm business sector increased 6.3 percent in the first quarter of 2023, reflecting a 3.4-percent increase in hourly compensation and a 2.7-percent decrease in productivity. 
  • Unit labor costs increased 5.8 percent over the last four quarters. 
  • Real hourly compensation, which takes into account consumer prices, decreased 0.3 percent in the first quarter of 2023, and declined 1.0 percent over the last four quarters.

Labor Productivity and Costs, Percent Change from Prior Quarter

Labor Productivity from the BLS, chart by Mish

What’s Going On With Productivity?

  1. Biden rules and regulations
  2. Biden’s clean energy push including the ridiculously-named Inflation Reduction Act (IRA)
  3. Retiring baby boomers are replaced by less skilled workers 

What’s Going On With Wages?

  1. Quiet Quitting, Doing Only What’s Necessary at Work and No More
  2. Act Your Wage is the New Meme as Career Ambitions Plunge

Costs Up, Output Down 

With special thanks to the IRA costs are soaring but output isn’t.

For more on the IRA please see The Inflation Reduction Act Price Jumps From $385 Billion to Over $1 Trillion

This post originated at MishTalk.Com.

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Counter
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11 months ago
Soaring wages have not kept up with inflation.
New York tied its minimum wage to inflation — but exceptions in Governor Hochul’s plan will likely cancel wage increases in many years.
What happens to inflation when wages go up…
Nodak1
Nodak1
11 months ago
Actually the stated damage caused by an increase in CO2 is a scam, the actual % is 0.004% of atmospheric totals, if a 0.003% is reached
the plant life on the planet will end, the science of the 195 countries stated is only due to the financial incentives that are bestowed upon
the intuitions that fall in line with the globalist’s need for a control economy and governance that needs to have a emergency to impose
their will on the populace.
soho70
soho70
11 months ago
the only reason this happened nursing homes and mental institutions are full so they put BIDUMB in DC bunker
Christoball
Christoball
11 months ago
With the medical industry accounting for 20% of GDP and 5% of GDP spent on Stock Buybacks, it is hard to accurately measure productivity.
Bam_Man
Bam_Man
11 months ago
Bullshiite jobs for the most part being “performed” by incompetent, unmotivated slackers.
omera
omera
11 months ago
This is one of your wishy washy articles pointing fingers without any data to support it. I am always amazed about productivity measures or metrics in particular. No one can deny Covid19’s effect on peoples behavior, even after more than a year after most restrictions are lifted. I personally cannot say how much IRA has impact on productivity. But I see more retirement age people are working whether by choice or have to. I also know last summer many summer related activities lowered their schedules/events due to lack of employees. What all these tell you? There is some shifts in the economy. Is it enough to look at some productivity numbers and say “oh well it is IRA” as your top 2 out of 3 reasons? I doubted it.
Salmo Trutta
Salmo Trutta
11 months ago
This is the GOSPEL

Member Bank Reserve Requirements: Analysis of Committee Proposal, Box 107 (stlouisfed.org)

Salmo Trutta
Salmo Trutta
11 months ago

The future of the United States holds that it will be forced into (1) a high degree of economic isolation, (2) reflect an increasingly totalitarian mold, (3) and operate under a command economy.

DXY is down on a good payroll report.

Christoball
Christoball
11 months ago
This is too be expected in an Economy with over 20% of GDP spent on the Medical industrial Complex; much of it on Geriatrics. Add in that 5% of GDP is spent on Stock Buybacks and you have too large of a Broken Window Economy to accurately calculate true productivity. Hard working people are still getting the job done.
Salmo Trutta
Salmo Trutta
11 months ago

Reuters: “These officials also noted the Fed at some point could even lower short-term interest rates as it continues to draw down the roughly $8.5 trillion balance sheet, and that such a move would not be at odds with wider monetary policy.”

The FED should cut interest rates NOW – and continue with QT. The 1966 Interest Rate Adjustment Act is prima facie evidence.

Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
11 months ago
Reply to  Salmo Trutta
The FED should cut interest rates below zero right now by sending everyone lots of money right now.
What could go wrong?
Bam_Man
Bam_Man
11 months ago
Reply to  Salmo Trutta
Yes, we should go “Full Erdogan” immediately!
RonJ
RonJ
11 months ago
And another “That’s Never Happened Before,” since the Covid, government economic lockdowns.
PapaDave
PapaDave
11 months ago
Most here cannot see the forest for the trees. By focusing on the US only, everyone fails to grasp a situation that is actually worldwide. In addition, the desire to blame Biden, the Fed, the education system, the old, the young, etc etc prevents people from seeing what is actually going on worldwide (though on a tiny scale, all of those things contribute something to the overall situation).
Also, by focusing on the short term, rather than the long term, most fail to notice the trends that have been in place for decades. For example, productivity improved for 3 decades worldwide (though not in a straight line) from 1980 to 2010. The main worldwide drivers for this (though not the only drivers) were positive demographics, better education, more low priced energy consumption, globalization, and technological improvements.
But all trends come to an end. Global productivity gains have been declining since 2010, and have now reached a point of negative productivity in some countries, such as the US. There is no one to blame for this. Its just a continuation of the long term trends that have changed from positive to negative. The gains from better education and technology have run their course. The big improvements from Globalization are over as the world reorganizes into trading blocks and beggar-thy-neighbour policies. Demographics are now working against productivity gains instead of supporting them. The energy transition is resulting in higher energy costs which will hurt productivity for the rest of this decade. And finally, the worldwide Pandemic accelerated “some” of the long term trends.
I find that focusing on the macro big picture is more useful that focusing on the micro. I also find that its a waste of time to look for someone to blame for things that they have little ability to control.
vanderlyn
vanderlyn
11 months ago
Reply to  PapaDave
great take Papa D
PapaDave
PapaDave
11 months ago
Reply to  vanderlyn
Thanks. Just trying to provide a longer term, big picture, perspective.
Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
11 months ago
Reply to  PapaDave
PapaDave, nothing goes to heck in a straight line!
Demographics, for anyone that bothered to look, have been telling us for many decades that things will be going to heck.
We have done little to try to adapt to this situation except for the new Climate Change religion.
PapaDave
PapaDave
11 months ago
Reply to  Lisa_Hooker
Worldwide Demographics is “one” important factor in the productivity issue. And yes, demographics is always there for all to see. But it doesn’t mean that things will “go to heck”. You are exaggerating. It simply means that you can expect modest headwinds to both productivity and gdp growth for two or three decades (starting back in about 2007). In addition, there are many other factors that affect productivity and gdp growth. Add them all up and it gives you a better idea of whether things will “go to heck” or not. Myself, when I add them up, I see slow growth for a long time.
I do not understand your comment on Climate Change. It is not a religion. People who say that are idiots. Don’t be an idiot.
Climate Change is basic science. And it is accepted as so by the 195 countries that signed on to the climate accords, the vast majority of the board members and executives of corporations all over the world, and the tens of thousands of scientists who work in the field. Which impacts the decisions that these folks end up making, including the energy transition the world has embarked on over the last few decades. I consider this transition as another headwind in the growth of productivity and gdp. Building out renewables will be a costly endeavour. And putting constraints on fossil fuel e+p, will increase energy prices for the next decade. And since gdp growth is very correlated with growth in energy supply, this places another restriction on gdp growth and productivity.
As always, I cannot change the large macro forces and worldwide trends that are in place; but I can profit from them.
Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
11 months ago
Reply to  PapaDave
Apparently your definition of basic science would include phrenology and astrology as basic sciences.
On the other hand –

A religion is a unified system of beliefs and practices relative to sacred things, that is to say, things set apart and forbidden—beliefs and practices which unite into one single moral community called a Church, all those who adhere to them

(Émile Durkheim)

As in the Church of Global Warming.
You need to bone up on what Science is and is not.
Start with reading Sir Karl Raimund Popper and deductive vs inductive reasoning.
A large consensus told us that the world is flat and the Sun moves around the Earth.
.
PapaDave
PapaDave
11 months ago
Reply to  Lisa_Hooker
Stop wasting my time.
RonJ
RonJ
11 months ago
Reply to  PapaDave
“Most here cannot see the forest for the trees. By focusing on the US
only, everyone fails to grasp a situation that is actually worldwide.”
I realize it was world wide. The economic lockdowns were global. Only Sweden bucked the trend and the others tried to shame them for it.
vanderlyn
vanderlyn
11 months ago
Reply to  RonJ
of the rich countries anyway. there are lots of countries that did not lock down.
Christoball
Christoball
11 months ago
Reply to  PapaDave
Good analysis.
GruesomeHarvest
GruesomeHarvest
11 months ago

The US is in full collapse. Thank President Biden and his perpetual war and ultra wokism. Who voted for this clown? Institutions are in full decay by concerted design to allow the totalatarians to take full control of the sheeple. Bray they allow us a few oats to chew on. In another step to demoralize and destroy institutions we have this.

Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
11 months ago
Terry Gilliam did a great Monty Python’s Flying Circus bit on Royal NaayVeee enlistment in the seventies.
This is that old.
vanderlyn
vanderlyn
11 months ago
Reply to  Lisa_Hooker
navies have always been homosexual friendly for thousands of years
Bam_Man
Bam_Man
11 months ago
Reply to  vanderlyn
Cue The Village People singing “In the Navy”.
Bam_Man
Bam_Man
11 months ago
Reply to  Lisa_Hooker
Churchill supposedly stated over 100 years ago that Royal Navy “tradition” amounted to nothing but “rum, buggery and the lash”.
So we are finally catching up, as far as the buggery is concerned.
oee
oee
11 months ago
This is further evidence. That the Robots and AI are not …taken over. Companies are not investing “labour saving devices.”
Dean2020
Dean2020
11 months ago
The answer is not as complicated as people realize: Failed policies, corrupt politicians and propaganda have weakened and dumbed down America in an effort to maintain tighter and tighter control. Most don’t know what hard work is. Our nation is now a nation of snowflakes that care more about feelings than earning a day’s wage.
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
11 months ago
Reply to  Dean2020
Hard work alone won’t get you anywhere. The Fed decided to pick and choose some industries over others. The ones they picked aren’t productive ones. This is why people stopped working so hard. We live a quasi federalized economy with trillions of dollars backed by the Fed.
Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
11 months ago
The Government picked certain CORPORATIONS over others. The said industries, but they pick companies. And with Biden’s new heap of money, favoritism is being continued even further.
vanderlyn
vanderlyn
11 months ago
Reply to  Dean2020
sharecroppers got free room and board for 50% tax on production. i think modern employees don’t realize they are no better. ownership is only proper way to go through life. working for a paycheck is idiotic. at best.
Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
11 months ago
Reply to  vanderlyn
By becoming a slave to the property taxman?
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
11 months ago
I think the real issue is productivity has been broken for some time. This goes back to Fed policies and banking deregulation after 1999/2000. It started then and it’s been downhill. Bubble after bubble. Businesses no longer fail but are allowed to get more loans via corporate bond market. I hope Jerome stays strong and doesn’t cave on lowering rates. The money supply needs to come down further. Since 2018 I’ve been saying a lot of pretending is going on by businesses that are losing money but were simply surviving by getting loans via the bond market or manipulating the stock via buybacks and making the balance sheet look pretty. Like the 2000s, the 2010s will be proven have been fraudulent. Covid deferred this but can’t deny it. Our politicians and private banking system are a house of cards set to collapse just like 2008/2009.
Until we get an economy that invests in productivity and not speculation, nothing will change.
Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
11 months ago
Productive investments overseas in low labor cost countries kept the cost of living down but didn’t help much longer term.
Having so much surplus money for speculation doesn’t help either.
shamrock
shamrock
11 months ago
BDS?
shar
shar
11 months ago
In this educated crowd, I am surprised no one yet has mentioned all the extra tens, if not hundreds of thousands of working age people who have died, or are now so disabled they cannot work – from bad hospital protocols for “covid”, and mostly for bad “vaccines”. There is your loss of productivity. Not to mention all the mental health issues created from the tyrannical lockdown-mask- shot insanity. My own workplace is down 6 FTE’s and we are hopelessly behind. I had a coworker die after her second shot, a coworker who developed RA, a boss who has had a clot in his leg for months and can’t get it to resolve. All after the shots.
MPO45v2
MPO45v2
11 months ago
Reply to  shar
No one mentions it because like you said we are educated and dont subscribe to conspiracy theory nonsense. You need to talk to RonJ here, you two will become best buddies as he spent months writing conspiracy theories endlessly.
If you want to know what is killing americans it is heart disease, cancer, covid and accidents. A big mac and fries or a drunk driver is likely to be the cause of your death more than anything else but that won’t stop you from eating burgers or getting in a car will it?
Siliconguy
Siliconguy
11 months ago
Reply to  MPO45v2
You left out the fentanyl.
The insurance actuaries see plenty of excess deaths. Normally after an epidemic the death rate goes down. The plague kills off a good many people who were already sick. That didn’t happen this time, the death rate is still elevated and the epidemic is over.
Will the CDC admit they messed up? No. Will any commercial media outlet bring it up and take the risk of seeing all those fat Pharmaceutical advertising deals go elsewhere? Of course not.
You are on your own.
Christoball
Christoball
11 months ago
Reply to  Siliconguy
Demographics is the reason, the oldest Baby Boomers have reached 77 years old. The average age of death in American Males is 76. Females 79. With or without covid, death numbers are going to be higher than Pre covid.
Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
11 months ago
Reply to  MPO45v2
OBESITY !
Oh, and woke politicians.
RonJ
RonJ
11 months ago
Reply to  MPO45v2
“No one mentions it because like you said we are educated and dont subscribe to conspiracy theory nonsense.”
It isn’t conspiracy theory nonsense. Ed Dowd isn’t a conspiracy theorist. He analyses data. Same with Steve Kirsch. The CDC hid the fact that their Covid vax death safety signal had triggered by the end of January 2021, for some two years.
prumbly
prumbly
11 months ago
Reply to  shar
I also have a family member who was killed by the Covid shot. I suspect most people know someone who was dispatched in this way. I don’t know anyone who died from Covid though.
I still have mixed feelings about the Covid shots. They probably saved some lives, but they also took other lives. Those in power are doing their best to make sure we never fully understand whether, on balance, they actually had a benefit. I suspect they didn’t. The reality is that they were rushed out without the extensive safeguards and testing that vaccines normally go through. Perhaps that was the right thing to do at the time because we didn’t know how bad Covid was going to be, but the scary thing is not that this happened, it’s the ongoing cover-up. We have learnt that we can never trust them again.
Zardoz
Zardoz
11 months ago
Reply to  shar
Toot toot! Kook alert!
RonJ
RonJ
11 months ago
Reply to  Zardoz
Zardoz, you have no evidence to back up your claim. The critics do.
Zardoz
Zardoz
11 months ago
Reply to  RonJ
The Critics = The Kooks
And they have zero credible evidence, as you repeatedly demonstrate.
RonJ
RonJ
11 months ago
Reply to  Zardoz
Yes, the critics do have credible evidence, as i have repeatedly demonstrated.
RonJ
RonJ
11 months ago
Reply to  RonJ
As reports of vaccine injuries gain traction globally, an
Australian doctor is leading a new class action against the federal
government and key medical figures.”
The truth will come out, Zardoz.
Cabreado
Cabreado
11 months ago
Scariest “in your face” post for a while now…
vanderlyn
vanderlyn
11 months ago
this is inflationary. regardless of the reasons. in the 90s our productivity soared above europe due to our immigration of young workers. i suspect our geezers are slowing down and not working so productively as they used to. i know i’m not.
Casual_Observer2020
Casual_Observer2020
11 months ago
Reply to  vanderlyn
It’s also harder to get that level of productivity because most technology is now evolutionary rather than revolutionary the way it was in the 90s. The same thing happen after the industrial revolution in the late 1800s until WWI. Eventually it led to the excesses of the 1920s which ended badly. We really need something revolutionary for productivity gains. I feel humankind is about to hit a wall on how much the planet can support in terms of growth.
vanderlyn
vanderlyn
11 months ago
good points. productivity of human primates do go in fits and starts. and war mongering is usually very unproductive. especially the billions to the likes of C suite jerks at MIC firms like raytheon……….who con the treasury.
PreCambrian
PreCambrian
11 months ago
I think that your reasons for the drop in productivity are a little unsubstantiated. Maybe it is changing supply chains that is causing people to be less productive. Or a warming climate. Maybe it is everyone using ChatGPT. Or it could be that I was single handedly holding up the entire economy until I retired.
prumbly
prumbly
11 months ago
Reply to  PreCambrian
Yes, it’s definitely because of climate change!
Six000mileyear
Six000mileyear
11 months ago
Apparently they don’t realize many people had to put in a lot of effort to produce smart phones, streaming movies., and social media.When those things break and can’t be fixed, society will begin to repair itself, unless it becomes an Atlantis moment.
HippyDippy
HippyDippy
11 months ago
It’s never happened before because we’ve never been led this far down the road to communism before.
Zardoz
Zardoz
11 months ago
Reply to  HippyDippy
Sure, Jan.
Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
11 months ago
Reply to  HippyDippy
We are nowhere near “far down the road to communism.”
Ask Pol Pot or Mao.
We still have plenty of room to grow.
HippyDippy
HippyDippy
11 months ago
Reply to  Lisa_Hooker
I didn’t say we were that far. We’re just farther than we’ve ever been. And remember, Pol Pot and Mao started in countries that still had a middle class. There’s a tipping point. We ARE near that tipping point. And a big reason is because the slaves just love to have the state tell us who to hate. Communism, like all the totalitarian isms, is born of societies in which the mediocre, who hate excellence in others, have banded together in a common cause. Look around.
8dots
8dots
11 months ago
I go to MCD every Sun morning to buy coffee, because I love those high school teenagers.
Their platoon commander is a 17y/18y kid who works there for about 2Y. Productive or not , who cares, they are fantastic. The lady mgr. charges a little more for coffee.
The least productive people are those college kids who put their laptop on their reproductive organs.
Salmo Trutta
Salmo Trutta
11 months ago
The neutrality of money is a false doctrine, viz., “theory that changes in the money supply only affect nominal variables, such as prices, wages, and exchange rates, and not real variables, such as interest rates, employment, consumption, or GDP”.
It takes increasing infusions of Reserve bank credit to generate the same inflation adjusted dollar amounts of GDP.
Stagflation is business stagnation accompanied by inflation. As
predicted in 1963 in my Money and Banking book, Dr. Pritchard’s (Ph.D.
Economics, Chicago 1933, M.S. statistics, Syracuse, Phi Beta Kappa) economic
syllogism posits:

#1) “Savings require prompt utilization if the circuit flow of
funds is to be maintained and deflationary effects avoided”…
#2) ”The growth of commercial bank-held time “savings” deposits (money supply), shrinks
aggregate demand and therefore produces adverse effects on gDp”
#3) ”The stoppage in the flow of funds, which is an inexorable part of
time-deposit banking, would tend to have a longer-term debilitating effect on
demands, particularly the demands for capital goods.”
MPO45v2
MPO45v2
11 months ago
  • Biden rules and regulations
  • Biden’s clean energy push including the ridiculously-named Inflation Reduction Act (IRA)
  • Retiring baby boomers are replaced by less skilled workers
  • I actually think cultural/demographic changes have more of an impact than 1 & 2 on this list. Young people have a very low tolerance for bad behavior from older generations such as boomers who have a tendency to condescend and belittle people. The young would rather quit and do nothing than tolerate daily abuse or work in these environments. Cue the “Nobody wants to work anymore!” rant from a boomer.
    Part 2 of the cultural change are things like work-from-home where it’s easy to get distracted and go do laundry or other chores.
    Part 3 of the cultural change is the fact that American society is getting older and as such gets sicker and works at a much slower pace. It doesn’t help that young people are probably the most unfit and fattest people in recorded history. Lots more medical appointments in Americans future for a variety of diseases and illnesses.
    It easy to blame Biden for everything but I guarantee you that when he leaves office, these problems will continue to persist no matter who is president. let a Republican into office and have him/her repeal all regulations, how will the culture change in young people? how will people become healthier when they will only be 2 years older in the next election and 4 years after that administration is done. how will having millions of baby boomers on social services improve productivity?
    TexasTim65
    TexasTim65
    11 months ago
    Reply to  MPO45v2
    “I actually think cultural/demographic changes have more of an impact
    than 1 & 2 on this list. Young people have a very low tolerance for
    bad behavior from older generations such as boomers who have a tendency
    to condescend and belittle people. The young would rather quit and
    do nothing than tolerate daily abuse or work in these environments.
    Cue the “Nobody wants to work anymore!” rant from a boomer.”
    Young people can do this only as long as they are allowed to get away with it. Once they can’t live in their parents basements or the welfare money dries up (or general lack of goods/services happens because no one is working) they’ll have to put up with all the things they currently snub their noses at.
    It’s sort of like when kids refuse to eat their veggies and parents are afraid they will starve so they let them get away with it and give them something else to eat. So of course the kids won’t eat the veggies. But if there is no other food in the house, you can bet those same kids will hold their noses and wolf it down.
    MPO45v2
    MPO45v2
    11 months ago
    Reply to  TexasTim65
    They will be able to get away with it for a long time. As millions retire and not enough back fill it will be an employees job market. It will be like the dot com boom where you could quit Friday and have multiple job offers on Monday if you had the right skills except any skill will be worth their weight in gold over the next decade. There are shortages of everything: teachers, nurses, doctors, pilots, engineers, etc. and we haven’t even seen the full retirements take place, that won’t happen until 2030.
    If Congress does immigration reform maybe it will get fixed or we get those mythical robots or AI that will do everything for us.
    Lisa_Hooker
    Lisa_Hooker
    11 months ago
    Reply to  MPO45v2
    Pundits?
    Is there a shortage of pundits yet?
    I am hoping for a severe shortage so I can get a job in punditry without having to move.
    Zardoz
    Zardoz
    11 months ago
    Reply to  TexasTim65

    I don’t think this bunch will buckle down and become good little wage slaves. There’s no American Dream as a reward anymore, and they know it.

    Christoball
    Christoball
    11 months ago
    Reply to  Zardoz
    The social contract has been broken by the Baby Boomers. You are right in that the American dream is too unaccessable to many bright young people because America has been financialized under the Baby Boomer watch. Working hard and getting ahead has been replaced by, Work hard and Fund my Government Pensions, Annuities , and 401K; which are just appendages of Wall Street.
    RonJ
    RonJ
    11 months ago
    Reply to  Christoball
    Contracts are made to be broken. The social contract was never viable in the first place, as a cycle has a down phase, as well as an up phase. Every boom goes bust. Someone wrote a book called The Fourth Turning. Kondratieff wrote of a 50 year cycle, decades ago, and in Biblical times, there was a year of debt Jubilee on a regular cycle. Groundhog Day keeps repeating over and over again.
    “Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. Weak men create bad times. Bad times create strong men.”
    Zardoz
    Zardoz
    11 months ago
    Reply to  RonJ
    So bend over and take it, my fellow Americans!
    TexasTim65
    TexasTim65
    11 months ago
    Reply to  Zardoz
    If that’s the case then a complete collapse of the social order is coming. As in food riots etc. Maybe not for a few years, but it will come if people don’t do work. Unlike the virtual world, things don’t magically appear in the real world.
    Zardoz
    Zardoz
    11 months ago
    Reply to  TexasTim65

    Most people don’t work at anything involving essentials right now. We have a long way to go before there’s that kind of troubl.

    shamrock
    shamrock
    11 months ago
    Reply to  TexasTim65
    Do you have any kids? That’s a cliche that people who have never raised children like to say.
    ohno
    ohno
    11 months ago
    Reply to  MPO45v2
    As a mfg supervisor I can attest you are 100% correct with younger people’s willingness to put up with ‘crap’. They walk out at the slightest hint of BS or from having to work too hard. This also takes a toll on older workers who end up having to do more and makes the resentment between the two even worse.
    I disagree with them having to change their ways. It’s how they are and id guess most of them aren’t going to change.
    This society is turning into pure garbage. All we need is a few million unemployed illegals sprinkled all over it. “fixed”…..Biden.
    MPO45v2
    MPO45v2
    11 months ago
    Reply to  ohno
    On Antiwork forum on reddit I read a good perspective from a young person’s point of view. It read something like this, “if you hire a contractor to remodel your kitchen, you don’t expect the contractor to do your bathrooms for free so why do these boomers expect you do to three or four different jobs for the same pay?”
    The general modus operandi of young workers is that if they get hired to be a cook at a restaurant then they are going to cook, don’t ask them to wait tables, don’t ask them to be a cashier when it’s slow or anything else that isn’t cooking. That’s the new culture not the old where people were essentially exploited to do three jobs but only get paid for one.
    RyanL
    RyanL
    11 months ago
    Reply to  MPO45v2
    It’s generally not the right analogy. If I’m paying you for 8 hours of work I’m paying you for 8 hours of work. This attitude tends to come from people who think they have one task and if it’s done in 3 hours how dare you give me stuff to do with the other 5. It’s more like they hire a contractor for 3 days work, and when he’s done with the kitchen in a day he insists he should just get paid to play on Snapchat the rest of the time.
    Sure If you are salaried and suddenly have to work 60 hours a week instead of 40 because you were given 2 extra jobs you have reason to expect more compensation, but that mostly isn’t what we are taking about here. I worked with a bunch of 30 year olds who acted as if they had been burned with a cigar when asked to be on call on a rotating basis for a few weeks to deal with production problems. These are the same people who think it’s fine to announce they are taking the morning off with pay to care for a sick pet whenever they please.
    You describe the zeros among young people who are going nowhere in life. They aren’t to be admired.
    TexasTim65
    TexasTim65
    11 months ago
    Reply to  MPO45v2
    That’s an excellent reason why those people will be life’s losers. Constantly passed over for promotion by those willing to do extra things, the first ones laid off / jobs replaced by robots ASAP etc.
    It’s 1970’s Union mentality where union guys did just the exact letter of the job and nothing else. It ended VERY badly for unions / union workers and none of these kids have union job protection.
    MPO45v2
    MPO45v2
    11 months ago
    Reply to  TexasTim65
    They won’t be losers. They WILL be in charge of firms. They will be the new executives, directors and managers of all firms because boomers are retiring and the GenX demographic is not large enough to fill all the open roles.
    The millennial executive mindset will hire and promote other people who reflect their values not the values of boomers or others. This is why we now have all the “woke” processes, protocols and procedures, it’s happening now but we are just at the start of it. The US Navy just had a drag queen ambassador. Why do you think this happened? Who do you think is in charge now? What happened with Bud Light?
    If you don’t align with woke you WILL go broke. You don’t have to like it but you will conform to it just like everyone had to conform to having Jesus shoved down their throat 40 years ago whether they wanted it or not. It’s cyclical culture reform just like the past 10,000 years. Same as it ever was…
    TexasTim65
    TexasTim65
    11 months ago
    Reply to  MPO45v2
    Sorry you’ve got it backwards. It’s Get Woke – Go Broke. Why do you think Bud Light is back pedaling as fast as they can. There are NO companies who have gone broke from not going woke.
    Those losers on that board will not be in charge of anything. You only need 10% to be in charge (management, CEOs, business owners). Those are the 10 percenters, the ones who make the real money because they are in charge of companies and own businesses.
    You and me, we are those 10 percenters who are in charge right now. Why? Because we have ambition and are willing to work and learn. I recall working one summer in college for a union based manufacturing company. It paid great even for student wages. But the people who had been there for 10 or 20 years were doing the exact same thing they had done 10 or 20 years ago. They were mentally dead, just like the guys posting on that site. Think about it, the guy posted that he only wanted to cook if he was hired to cook. Then how does he expect to get promoted if all he does is cook? If he never learns how to run the cash register or wait tables then how can he be promoted to shift manager or restaurant manager or lord forbid, own a restaurant. The company is literally doing him a favor by letting him learn other jobs while paying him and he doesn’t want to learn anything. He’ll still be putting wings in the deep fryer at Hooters 20 years from now and moaning how kids half his age are his manager.
    MPO45v2
    MPO45v2
    11 months ago
    Reply to  TexasTim65
    Our time has come and gone. What we valued will soon to be gone. The “old” work ethic is gone, that’s what I’m trying to tell you. In the cook example, the millennial view (mindset) is that the cook should be paid $30/hr and shouldn’t aspire to become a restaurant manager because in theory the manage will also get paid $30/hr or perhaps a little more. All roles are equal and all pay is about the same. Millennial seems to want living wages for all. Call it socialism if you want or neo-millennial capitalism but the old ways will be gone. it goes beyond wages, it is equality for all hence the whole drag queen, lgbt etc.
    It’s funny to see people like Desantis kicking and screaming they don’t want it but that’s the direction. Remember boomers who are the big supporters of Trump and Desantis and the old ways are dying at a rate of 5000 a day. GenXers are bifurcated (50% red/ 50% blue) but millennials are 80% blue. Try to think beyond today into years and decades into the future, you’ll see it clearly if you try.
    TexasTim65
    TexasTim65
    11 months ago
    Reply to  MPO45v2
    I don’t care about decades into the future because as you said, our time will be gone by then. Whatever problems exist then will be for the people of that age to solve.
    The problem with everyone getting paid 30/hr is that it doesn’t work. It never has worked at any time in human history and it won’t work in the future. Anyone who works harder will always resent anyone who doesn’t AND receives the same pay / reward. You can see it even in the animal kingdom, never mind the human one so it has nothing to do with Blue vs Red.
    Look, everyone is a dreamer when they are young. I was a dreamer and you probably were too. But then reality sets in when you get older and find out how things really work and realize you don’t want someone putting in half the effort you do to get the same rewards as you do.
    jiminy
    jiminy
    11 months ago
    Reply to  MPO45v2
    This sounds union. Wait two hours for an electrician to change a light bulb.
    Lisa_Hooker
    Lisa_Hooker
    11 months ago
    Reply to  jiminy
    Sorry, wrong type of light bulb.
    I’ll call the shop steward and we’ll get the right electrician.
    If one is available.
    Zardoz
    Zardoz
    11 months ago
    Reply to  MPO45v2

    Less skilled than boomers? At office politics maybe…

    MPO45v2
    MPO45v2
    11 months ago
    Reply to  Zardoz
    Probably should have said experienced. Young people today want to do everything via text, don’t know how to interact with people and have very narrow focus. Granted it’s not all the young people…
    Lisa_Hooker
    Lisa_Hooker
    11 months ago
    Reply to  MPO45v2
    I think I may have been over-condescended in my youth.

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