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In Latest Sentiment Poll, Buying Conditions Are the Worst in Decades

Worst Buying Conditions in Decades 

Bloomberg reports Americans See Worst Buying Conditions in Decades on High Prices

The University of Michigan’s preliminary sentiment index edged up to 71 from 70.3 in August, data released Friday showed. The figure trailed the median estimate of 72 in a Bloomberg survey of economists.

Buying conditions for household durables, homes and motor vehicles all fell to the lowest in decades. The report said the declines were due to complaints about high prices. Consumers expect inflation to rise 4.7% over the coming year, matching the highest since 2008.

The university’s gauge of current conditions fell to 77.1, the lowest since April 2020, from 78.5. A measure of expectations rose to 67.1 from 65.1, according to the survey conducted Aug. 25 to Sept. 12.

Polls Not Surprising 

The polls are not at all surprising and arguably next to useless. Polls do little other than show current conditions visible in other data. 

For example, existing home sales have fallen every month since February. So, yeah, buying conditions are bad. What did the poll tell us we already did not know?

And if consumers are not buying homes, they are not buying appliances, furniture, and new cabinets to go in the homes.

Expectations are meaningless in both direction. If conditions improve, so will buying, regardless of what consumers currently think about the future. 

If conditions get worse so will real (inflation-adjusted) spending and home buying. 

At least the poll makes sense and matches reality. They don’t always do so.

Cyclical Components of GDP

Cyclicals such as housing and durable goods are the Most Important Chart in Macro.

Cyclicals including housing and durable goods only constitute ten to fifteen percent of GDP, but the swings account for variations between growth and recession according to Eric Basmajian at EPB Macro.

A Big Housing Bust is the Key to Understanding This Recession

On July 14, I did a follow up on the above idea in A Big Housing Bust is the Key to Understanding This Recession

Don’t expect strong consumer spending to save the day.

Factoring in Revisions and Inflation, Retail Sales Remain Very Weak

The amount of nonsense about strong retail spending recently is staggering. It’s real (inflation adjusted) spending that drives GDP, not nominal spending.

Real consumer spending peaked in March of 2021 at $236,100 million. It’s now $231,138.

Strong consumer spending? Where? 

Real spending bottomed in December of 2021 and picked up for the next four months, through April. 

Also, housing remained strong in 2021 and relatively strong in the first quarter of 2022.

That’s why I pegged a recession start In May.    

For discussion, please see Factoring in Revisions and Inflation, Retail Sales Remain Very Weak

Polls Tell Us What We Already Knew

Economists depend on consumer sentiment polls. I suggest they would be better advised to understand the data. 

GDPNow Forecast for Q3 Plunges to 0.5 Percent on Weak Consumer Spending 

Meanwhile, please note GDPNow Forecast for Q3 Plunges to 0.5 Percent on Weak Consumer Spending

With housing in the gutter and poised to get worse, I expect a third quarter of negative GDP. But hey, let’s dare not call that a recession.

This post originated at MishTalk.Com

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51 Comments
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Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Here’s an interesting energy article from Australia.
—————–
25 Aug 2022
Net zero is an immense challenge and a nation-building opportunity
INTERIM RESULTS FROM NET ZERO AUSTRALIA
The Net Zero Australia project today released uniquely detailed insights into the opportunities and challenges for Australia in transitioning to net zero emissions. The project is a research partnership between the University of Melbourne, the University of Queensland, Princeton University and international management consultancy Nous Group.
Key insights from the interim modelling
• Renewables will produce most or all domestic energy by 2050
• More productive use of energy can keep domestic demand about the same, despite population growth
• Carbon capture, utilisation and storage (CCUS) can play an important role, complementing renewables
• Unprecedented capital investment is needed, which will produce significant benefits
• Domestic energy’s share of GDP need not rise above today’s level, while being less prone to price shocks
• Clean energy can replace our fossil fuel exports
• The cost to export clean energy may rise, but should be competitive in a decarbonising global economy
• A large workforce with new skills will grow across the nation, particularly in northern Australia
• Emissions from farms, forestry and waste should fall, but are unlikely to reach net zero
• Large changes in land and sea use will occur, and will need careful planning and community engagement
camberiu
camberiu
3 years ago
Mish, the Bloomberg article you posted is from September 17, 2021
ColoradoAccountant
ColoradoAccountant
3 years ago
I am confused (Sunday evening checking in with news). Do we have a “one China policy” or do we not?
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Yes we do and Taipei City is the capital of all of China.
FromBrussels2
FromBrussels2
3 years ago
Whatever , our fn western debt inflated , money printing paradigm is at the end of its fn wits anyway …..so what you fn expect ? I dunno, who knows ? …..MISH…. gonna sue you , YOU told me to buy fn gold….
FromBrussels2
FromBrussels2
3 years ago
Reply to  FromBrussels2
I do admit though , my last joint got the best of me…..waitin for the final all destroyn sun flame …..and them magnetic fields dwindling , we re screwed …..luv …give me another one ….
Zardoz
Zardoz
3 years ago
Reply to  FromBrussels2

Feeling nice and safe, Comrade Yoda, far from the shifting frontlines, where Comrades freeze, starve, and flee?For shame! Comrade Putin needs every man! Stop your toilet emails and get to the front!

Robbyrob
Robbyrob
3 years ago
Former Google CEO Eric Schmidt Warns China Could Cripple US Military, Economy
StukiMoi
StukiMoi
3 years ago
Reply to  Robbyrob
Near universal American incompetence has already long since beat those scary Chinese childlaborers to that one……
Zardoz
Zardoz
3 years ago
Reply to  StukiMoi
Chinese have the same problem. It’s a human problem.
JRM
JRM
3 years ago
Reply to  Zardoz
It’s is a software problem, China has corrupted our military hardware!!!
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Reply to  Robbyrob
If you have kids or are young enough, learning Chinese seems like a good idea.
Six000mileyear
Six000mileyear
3 years ago
Consumer sentiment never recovered even to the pre-COVID lows of Trump’s Presidency. Polls are now worse than deep COVID when grocery store shelves were cleared out from hoarding. Within 6 months of taking office, Biden’s policies have derailed the recovering consumer sentiment.
8dots
8dots
3 years ago
An extremely bearish sentiment is what the blue zone are looking for. Are we falling apart ?? // Between 2004 and 2006 SPX built a
Lazer tilting up. After 15Y, in Dec 2020, SPX breached it from below. SPX osc above til Jan 2022/ below in June 2022. Option #1 : after losing it’s grip, last month, SPX will plunge.
Option #2 : June low is good enough. SPX will osc inside and rise above to a new all time. Option #3 : The next high, at 6K/7K, will not be the last high. It might cont for a while, perhaps for over a decade….
PapaDave
PapaDave
3 years ago
Reply to  8dots
So what are you invested in?
dtj
dtj
3 years ago
Meanwhile Biden’s poll numbers are apparently “soaring”. Apparently he’s convinced a deluded bunch of nitwits that his latest spending bill is actually an “inflation reduction” measure.
Tawdzilla
Tawdzilla
3 years ago
Reply to  dtj

Yep, he’s buying votes and hosing taxpayers.

Zardoz
Zardoz
3 years ago
Reply to  dtj
More like they’re getting creeped out by the clownshow the gop has assembled for midterms.
vanderlyn
vanderlyn
3 years ago
Reply to  Zardoz
without the hand maid tale Rs running, it would be a landslide for GOP. but for anyone with half a brain, like mitch and down to the bloggers, nobody will want to vote for complete creepy nit wits.
Captain Ahab
Captain Ahab
3 years ago
When ballots mean nothing, people vote with their feet and wallets.
PapaDave
PapaDave
3 years ago
Makes sense to me. People will continue to spend on essentials: food, shelter and energy. Discretionary spending will fall.
Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
3 years ago
Reply to  PapaDave
Things change.
A firearm and ammunition once considered discretionary may become essential.
Depends on where and when.
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Reply to  Lisa_Hooker
I’m envious watching the shows like Mountain Men and Alone, seeing people capable of catching, processing and preparing animals for food.
PapaDave
PapaDave
3 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
Wow! You waste your valuable time watching that staged tv crap? Do you really want to go back and live in the 1800s? There were no blogs to comment on!
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Reply to  PapaDave
“A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently and die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.”
–Robert A. Heinlein (found in the “Intermissions” of Time Enough for Love, and in the separately published Notebooks of Lazarus Long)
PapaDave
PapaDave
3 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
If that’s your standard, why are you wasting your time watching television?
Zardoz
Zardoz
3 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
It’s not that difficult, but not a fun way to live.
Now if you’re competing with millions of starving people, it gets more difficult, unless you aren’t particular about where your meat comes from.
PapaDave
PapaDave
3 years ago
Reply to  Lisa_Hooker
Yep. Then you can shoot yourself when things get bad and end your misery.
Lisa_Hooker
Lisa_Hooker
3 years ago
Reply to  PapaDave
Hmm, an unfortunate but valid option to be avoided.
Apparently your option continues to be pleading with folks for more investment ideas.
PapaDave
PapaDave
3 years ago
Reply to  Lisa_Hooker
Hardly.
You appear to be afraid of difficult times. Hence the talk of guns and ammo.
I am merely looking for ways to take advantage of difficult times.
And note that I am willing to freely share that info. All I am looking for is like-minded individuals, who are willing to reciprocate. Should I scratch you off that list?
Tawdzilla
Tawdzilla
3 years ago

Maybe we should try a truly free market economy. This central planning Frankenstein economy is not working for most people.

PapaDave
PapaDave
3 years ago
Reply to  Tawdzilla
Careful what you wish for. Britain tried free markets for energy, and prices have skyrocketed. Now they want to bring in more regulation to try to blunt those crazy high prices.
Tawdzilla
Tawdzilla
3 years ago
Reply to  PapaDave
Difference is UK doesn’t have huge natural reserves like the US does.
If we unleash the private energy sector in the US, we will be able to increase supply which will lower prices not only the US but also UK.
But the central planners would rather offshore CO2 to China and Russia. All this does is weaken the West and strengthen the East. No improvement to the global climate.
PapaDave
PapaDave
3 years ago
Reply to  Tawdzilla
In a free market, companies are free to do what they feel is in their best interest.
In previous decades, US oil and gas companies would respond to high prices by taking on mountains of debt and expanding production. Then, when prices crashed, they were stuck with that debt and struggled to stay solvent.
These companies have now found discipline. They are not taking on debt and expanding production in response to high prices. Instead, they are taking advantage of high prices and bringing in huge amounts of cash flow and using it to primarily pay down their debt. Some of these companies are already debt free, or will be, in the next year or so.
They are also using that cash flow for a modest amount of capex in order to simply maintain their production levels.
Finally, they are using their remaining free cash flow to reward shareholders by buying back shares and increasing dividends.
Which is why I have loaded up on their shares (both US and Canadian oil and gas companies) in order to profit.
If you want to “unleash the private energy sector” to produce more, government is going to have to provide some extra incentives to get them to do so. Because they are not going to do it on their own. Of course, that would be “Central Planning” wouldn’t it?
Tawdzilla
Tawdzilla
3 years ago
Reply to  PapaDave
Bullcrap. They don’t need incentives, they just need government to get out of the way.
PapaDave
PapaDave
3 years ago
Reply to  Tawdzilla

I follow these companies closely because I have a lot invested in them. Their focus is on paying down debt and shareholder returns. Not on expanding production. If it was, I would be selling my shares. Why don’t you try to find out what is actually going on before you make yourself look stupid.

These companies are going to do what is in their shareholders best interests, not yours. Wake up and smell the coffee.
Now; I will gladly give you the names of a few of these companies, if you want to invest in them. Do you want to make some money, or do you want to believe in fairy tales?
Tawdzilla
Tawdzilla
3 years ago
Reply to  PapaDave
I’d rather make myself look stupid, not wake up, not smell the coffee, and believe in fairy tales. You seem like a real gem. I see that nobody here upvotes any of your comments.
PapaDave
PapaDave
3 years ago
Reply to  Tawdzilla
I’m not here to make friends. I’m here to gather info to profit from.
If all you have to offer is your fairy tales, then so be it. There is a feature on this site, called the IGNORE button. I will now apply that to you so I never have to see another one of your useless comments.
Bye.
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Reply to  PapaDave
TX also. Weren’t they getting thousands $$ bills when that last unexpected cold snap hit?
Basic utility services need to be fully regulated – electricity, gas, water.
PapaDave
PapaDave
3 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
Free markets vs regulated markets. A debate I don’t really care much about. I merely look at what exists and then try to take advantage of it.
For example, Texas electricity prices have increased recently, partly because natural gas prices have increased (though TX has a lot of renewables as well). Natural gas prices are up, in part, because of more exports to Europe, trying to displace Russian gas.
Which is the result of companies taking advantage of free markets to sell to the highest bidder. Another point that Tawdzilla should consider when he talks about “free markets”.
Some people love free markets till they kick you in the nuts. And some love regulated markets till they kick you in the nuts. I find it funny to see how people’s positions change so easily.
vanderlyn
vanderlyn
3 years ago
Reply to  PapaDave
bingo. you nailed it. all the so called free market companies and CEOs and folks looked to the .GOV free sh*t army the minute some turmoil comes around. 9.11, panic of 2008, the covid plague………..and on and on………
StukiMoi
StukiMoi
3 years ago
Reply to  PapaDave
Bring the crew from a shale well in Wyoming to Britain, and see how “free” they are to start drilling….. Or try hooking a generator to a coalstove… Or rolling out some length of pipe to Russia….. Or, anything else with a proven history of producing cost effective energy, for that matter.
For a “market” to be “free”, suppliers able to do so at below prevailing prices, MUST be free to add to supply when prices rise. If suppliers cannot freely do that, you don’t have a “market” at all, much less a free one. If suppliers cannot add, isn’t it pretty obvious to all and any that “supply/demand” can’t work?
It’s exactly the same reason the only thing America is capable of producing efficiently anyone, is homeless people. Of course the dumb people, being dumb and all, keep babbling about the Housing so called “Market.” As if there was one. If there was, don’t you reckon someone, somewhere would find a way to add a few square feet of covered space in Pacific Heights, considering that doing so would fetch them a quick $5million? I mean, a box with an opening isn’t that expensive to slap together and all…..
Free markets work. Always have, always will. Catch is: They reward competent people more than incompetent ones, though. Hence redistributes social standing away from the retard classes The Fed handed all its stolen loot to. Which is why those idiots never seem to stop coming up with one childish, harebrained reason for why freedom is somehow “baaaad”and “scaryyy” after another. With the braindead indoctrinati cheering them on every step of the way, unfortunately.
Tawdzilla
Tawdzilla
3 years ago
Reply to  StukiMoi
Yep, dependent people are multiplying like gremlins. It gets back to the old saying…”if you subsidize something, you get more of it. If you tax something, you get less of it.” We are subsidizing stupidity/laziness and taxing hard work .
MPO45
MPO45
3 years ago
Reply to  PapaDave
I just checked the going rates for electricity in Texas and my jaw dropped. The going rate is $0.15/kw to $0.17/kw and a few years ago it was half that! This website is for Texas electric shoppers to compare prices.
PapaDave
PapaDave
3 years ago
Reply to  MPO45
Free markets at work. And I intend to profit from it.
Zardoz
Zardoz
3 years ago
Reply to  MPO45
Texas is going to get as expensive as California.
RonJ
RonJ
3 years ago
“In the University of Michigan sentiment pool, consumers have soured on buying homes, cars, and durable goods.”
Even food prices leave a sour taste in the mouth.
MPO45
MPO45
3 years ago
Reply to  RonJ
Went to store for few essentials this morning: eggs, tomato, onion, garlic, chicken, potatoes, etc. $86 for ONE bag of groceries. I feel your pain.
Jojo
Jojo
3 years ago
Reply to  MPO45
Yup. Most everyone from food manufacturers to distributors to sellers are glomming onto the “inflation made us do it” bandwagon and raising prices on everything they can to insane levels.
An example. One of the stores I shop at is Grocery Outlet here in CA. I had purchased a bag of snack bars called Paleo Bars there for $9.99. I liked the product but when I went back to pick up a couple of more bags, the price had soared to $14.99! You can’t be serious, I thought!
StukiMoi
StukiMoi
3 years ago
Reply to  Jojo
I bet if you looked at the finances of the makers (fat chance, more like marketers….) of those bars; their costs are largely made up of fixed items. None of which have much to do with making foodbars. Instead being such doozies as “rent”, “insurance” etc. Such that: Even if sales drop, costs hardly drop at all. Making it almost impossible to survive, with crazy HailMary price increases being the last shot for many.
In functioning economies, most costs are direct inputs required to produce the goods sold: When sales slow, so do costs. Slowing sales is still bad for business. But businesses are a lot more resilient when money-out drop more in lockstep with money-in. Rather than “all” costs being fixed indenture payments which has to be paid in preference to all else, by force of law.
MPO45
MPO45
3 years ago
Reply to  RonJ

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