Essentially zero. Let’s discuss why.
Trump’s Second Executive Order
On March 31, the White House reported Trump issues second executive order on elections, giving U.S. Postal Service unprecedented control over mail voting.
The executive order is labeled ENSURING CITIZENSHIP VERIFICATION AND INTEGRITY IN FEDERAL ELECTIONS
The order mandates states to send the U.S. Postal Service a list of voters “to whom the State intends to provide a mail-in or absentee ballot” 60 days before any federal election, and directs the Postal Service to create “unique ballot envelope identifiers, such as bar codes” for those voters.
The Postal Service would only be authorized to deliver ballots from people on an approved list, which states would be allowed “to routinely supplement and provide suggested modifications or amendments” to.
DC Court Ruling
The district court in DC denied a preliminary injunction against the ruling. Justice Carl J. Nichols, a Trump appointee, sided with Trump as noted by the Court Listener.
That ridiculous ruling will be Trump’s last legal win in this matter.
ArtI.S4.C1.2 States and Elections Clause
Please consider the Constitution Annotated review of ArtI.S4.C1.2 States and Elections Clause
Article I, Section 4, Clause 1:
The Times, Places and Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives, shall be prescribed in each State by the Legislature thereof; but the Congress may at any time by Law make or alter such Regulations, except as to the Places of chusing Senators.
Nowhere in the Constitution or subsequent law is there a provision for the president to issue executive orders on voting rules.
Federal Court Hears Challenge to Trump Executive Order Restricting Mail-in Ballots
On June 2, the League of Women Voters reported Federal Court Hears Challenge to Trump Executive Order Restricting Mail-in Ballots
A federal District Court heard arguments today in a lawsuit [see LWV v Trump snip below] challenging President Trump’s March 31 executive order concerning mail-in voting. Plaintiffs argue that the order violates the US Constitution and federal law and risks mass disenfranchisement of eligible voters.
The Constitution makes clear that only the states and Congress can set the rules for elections. Nevertheless, the executive order attempts to override states’ mail-in voting laws by transforming the US Postal Service from a neutral mail carrier into an arbiter of who may cast a ballot by mail. The order also requires the Department of Homeland Security to build and give to each state a purported list of US citizens over the age of 18.
Plaintiffs asked the court today for a preliminary injunction to block implementation of Section 3 of the order, which directs the Postal Service to create unlawful new rules for the transmission of mail-in ballots.
LVW v Trump
The Executive Order’s directives to USPS are doubly unlawful. Not only does the President lack power over elections, but Congress, pursuant to its authority in the Postal Clause, U.S. Const. art. I, § 8, has established USPS as an independent entity charged with providing reliable and neutral mail delivery. In passing the Postal Reorganization Act of 1970, Congress required USPS to provide “prompt, reliable, and efficient services to patrons in all areas and . . . all communities.” 39 U.S.C. § 101(a).
In doing so, it stated that USPS must be operated “as a basic and fundamental service provided to the people,” providing services to “patrons in all areas and . . . to all communities.” Id. USPS has no authority to refuse to carry otherwise lawful election mail based on executive directives purporting to dictate voter eligibility; doing so would contravene Congress’s direct instructions.
The Executive Order would violate this statutory mandate by transforming USPS from a neutral mail carrier into the ultimate arbiter of who may cast a ballot. The Constitution forbids this attempted usurpation of power.
The President’s role is to execute the laws enacted by Congress—not to create new ones. Because the Executive Order exceeds the President’s constitutional and statutory authority and intrudes upon powers reserved to the states and Congress, it is unlawful and must be set aside
LWV Six-Point Challenge
- First, the Executive Order violates the constitutional separation of powers. The Constitution gives the states and Congress—not the President—the power to regulate elections.
- Second, the Executive Order is ultra vires. The Constitution gives Congress—not the President—power over USPS.
- Third, the Executive Order intrudes on state sovereignty in violation of the Tenth Amendment and bedrock federalism principles. The Constitution reserves the authority to regulate elections to the states, subject to constitutional restraints and laws passed by Congress.
- Fourth, the Executive Order unlawfully imposes an undue burden on the right to vote. In directing USPS to refuse to deliver lawful mail ballots, the Order threatens to disenfranchise eligible voters, including Plaintiffs’ members.
- Fifth, the Executive Order violates Section 11(a) of the Voting Rights Act, which prohibits government officials from acting under color of law to deny any qualified citizen the right to vote. By directing USPS to refuse to transmit the ballots of certain voters who are not enrolled in at least one of several ill-defined lists enumerated in the Executive Order, the Order denies the right to vote to scores of qualified citizens who will be excluded from those lists.
- Sixth, the Executive Order instructs the Department of Homeland Security (“DHS”) to compile and transmit a list of U.S. citizens to each state before every federal election—in a manner that squarely violates the Privacy Act and risks disenfranchising eligible voters.
LWV Will Easily Win on Merits
To succeed on merits, the LWV only needs to win one of the above points.
I expect the LWV will win on all six points.
The case is cut and dried. There is no chance of Trump winning despite a preposterous DC ruling.
Trump’s lawyers are going to be unmercifully crushed in court and they will get what they deserve too.
What About Ballot Counting Deadlines?
Under Mississippi law, a voter’s mail-in ballot is counted if it is postmarked on or before Election Day and arrives within five business days of the election.
Other states have similar provisions.
In March, the Supreme Court heard a challenge to Mississippi law in MICHAEL WATSON, MISSISSIPPI v. No. 24-1260 REPUBLICAN NATIONAL COMMITTEE.
I read all 170 pages.
The oral argument was long and technical, focusing on text (“cast”/”day”), history (19th-century practices, absentee voting for soldiers), federal statutes (e.g., UOCAVA for overseas/military), and practical concerns like finality, fraud risks, recall hypotheticals, and voter confidence.
It was a tedious read, and I don’t recommend it.
- Conservative justices showed skepticism toward Mississippi’s position (the state allowing the grace period).
- Justices Gorsuch, Thomas, Alito, and Kavanaugh pressed hard on finality (“when is the choice truly made?”), recall risks (e.g., could a voter send it back via FedEx?), appearance of fraud from late-arriving “stashes” that flip results, and line-drawing problems. Gorsuch was particularly active in hypotheticals challenging the petitioner’s definitions. Barrett grilled on consistency with early voting and finality before Election Day.
- Liberal justices (Sotomayor, Kagan, Jackson) were more supportive of the state, emphasizing history of state flexibility, no federal prohibition on reasonable receipt windows, longstanding practices in many states, and that Congress didn’t clearly preempt this. Sotomayor pushed back on selective historical readings.
- Barrett is a potential swing here—she probed both sides but seemed uneasy with loose finality.
The dispute is narrowly about grace periods (typically 3–7 days) for counting absentee/mail ballots that are postmarked or cast by Election Day but arrive afterward. Mississippi (and ~15 states + D.C.) allows this; the RNC argues federal “Election Day” statutes (1845-era laws) require receipt by Election Day for federal races.
The key takeaway is not this ruling itself, but all of the discussion on mail-in voting in general.
The important point, for those who slogged through the arguments, is that Mail-In Voting is here to stay.
My Expectation
I think team Trump wins this one 6-3 or 5-4.
If so, it won’t be a bad ruling. Does anyone like forever counting?
Practical Implications
- Rough Numbers: Only 0.1% to 3% of total ballots arrive after Election Day in states that count them. This is a small share of mail-in ballots, and a tiny fraction of all votes.
- Voters will adapt: They will vote earlier. In the current no-grace-period states, fewer ballots arrive late because voters know the cutoff and adjust.
- Accepting no ballots that arrive late will end one source of fraud claims by Republicans. That’s a good thing.
- A uniform Election Day receipt rule could make results feel more “final” on or soon after Nov. 3, reducing that narrative’s fuel. Again, that’s a good thing.
Unfortunately, this election day cutoff would not meaningfully speed up overall vote counting in California and other states.
California’s main counting bottlenecks come from the vast majority of mail ballots that arrive on or before Election Day (via drop boxes, early returns, etc.).
California suffers from a large volume all-mail system. It goes through signature verification and mismatch curing. Tossing late-arriving ballots won’t do much to drive the overall pace of counting.
Election law professor Rick Hasen notes “The main bottleneck is really not ballots that arrive after election day. The bottleneck is ballots arriving before or on election day.”
Five Key Takeaways
- Trump’s executive orders are heading for the ash can.
- The Appeals Court oral arguments rate to be amusing.
- Election day cutoff is not a bad thing. And that’s the ruling I expect. Voters can easily adapt.
- One source of fraud claims will vanish.
- This will not speed up election night counting.
A ruling against grace periods (my expected outcome) would tighten deadlines and reduce one source of late “dump” claims.
However, it wouldn’t transform California’s multi-day/weeks-long count into same-night results.
The Save Act Is Dead
In March, I posted the SAVE Act is dead. Officially it will be alive until it isn’t.
The odds of passage is still sitting at 8 percent in Polymarket where it’s been mostly stuck since the end of March.
I rather doubt there is even another attempt at passage with all the Republican infighting.
If it did pass, I think the Court would strike it for disenfranchisement and other reasons, but I would rather not find out.
Save Act Background
The Safeguard American Voter Eligibility (SAVE) Act is federal legislation that would amend the National Voter Registration Act (NVRA) to require individuals to provide documentary proof of U.S. citizenship—such as a passport, birth certificate, or certain REAL ID-compliant documents—when registering to vote in federal elections.
States would be prohibited from accepting registration applications without this proof, and the bill includes provisions for alternative processes, voter roll purges, and penalties for non-compliance.
The act requires the voter ID to be the same as their birth certificate.
This places an extraordinary burden on women who would need a birth certificate and a marriage certificate to register to vote. Multiple divorces and remarriage is particularly problematic.
The whole point of the Save Act and these executive orders is to steal the election.
For further discussion, please see SAVE Act Silliness: Trump’s “Go for the Gold” Killed It
Lie of the Day
Truth Social: THE SAVE AMERICA ACT is by far the most popular Bill of its kind ever put before Congress! President DJT
That is such obvious idiocy it’s hard to know what else to say.
In the above post I explain three reasons the bill would be ruled unconstitutional.
Fortunately, the point is moot. It’s never going to get out of the Senate.
For starters, it’s not a budget reconciliation item. Majority leader Thune won’t bring it up, and there are not 50 votes to replace Thune. The bill would not survive Senate rules anyway.
Meanwhile, Senate bickering is so intense (blame Trump), there may be no further budget reconciliation bills at all.
Significant in close races particularly when the talking heads try to explain inconsistent deviations:
Rough Numbers: Only 0.1% to 3% of total ballots arrive after Election Day in states that count them. This is a small share of mail-in ballots, and a tiny fraction of all votes.
Check out Generic art dad facebook reel
Create Chaos /seize opportunities /erosion of laws keeping his power in check. /nudging where the tends lead to.
Self-titled “originalists” would have to do quite the cynical sleight-of-hand to give this to Trump. A simpleton reading the Constitution can see that it never gave this overall power level to the US president. That was all a more recent innovation, mainly in the last 100 years.
Originalists are always and only originalists when it meets their personal goals.
If Trump is so against mail in voting, why does he do it himself?
34x convicted Felon and Epstein pedophile…
He’s not against all mail-in voting. He’s against mail-in voting for people who aren’t his brain-washed, slavish supporters.
meanwhile: President Donald Trump announced Saturday that a deal to end the U.S. war against Iran would be signed Sunday – a timeline Iranian media described as his “strange insistence” – and onlookers think they know why.
“Is this idiot trying to settle this foreign policy debacle Sunday, just so he can announce it on his birthday tomorrow during the UFC fight?” asked Sen. Ruben Gallego (D-AZ) in a social media post on X.
Orange idiot will probably announce some peace signing lie regardless of reality.
Fox probably has the footage in the can and is simply waiting to release it. They will probably have some Iranian looking dudes all “on set” for the camera crews to stage the signing.
Mail in voting is absurd. Its beyond absurd, its a corruption of basic voting security on purpose.
Its been rejected in most other countries for 50 years +.
That anyone is making arguments to defend it, or hinder its removal is really revealing to how fundamentally corrupt everything is in this country.
Long lists of convoluted political and legal machinations don’t change the basic principles.
Agreed, no chain of custody. Even if it’s done on the up and up it always has the appearance of impropriety given the loosey-goosey rules.
So, tell us what is actually absurd, and how your state’s voting processes and laws fail to mitigate said obvious absurdities. Betcha can’t!
My idea for mail-in voting is that the deadline a postmark on a mail ballot be changed to 7 days prior to election day. This will give a full week for all ballots to be received. Any received after election day polls close, for any reason whatsoever, get tossed.
Counting of mail-in ballots begins when the expiration date arrives. Again, in my scenario, this gives election authorities a full week to complete the counting and any necessary signature validations, etc.
In order to ensure security and no influence voters on election day at physical polling places, the mail-in ballots must be counted by machine with no one having access to the totals until the close of polls on election day.
What’s not to like about this plan?
When is Election Day not Election Day? When it’s 7 days prior. Besides, the real goal is to prevent eligible voters that MAGAts don’t like from voting.
Somehow France manages to count all the election ballots in the evening and overnight. (Voting day is traditionally Sunday) People show up and drop paper ballots in envelopes into a transparent box. No waiting for the mail, no proprietary software voting machines engaging in algorithmic calculations, etc. Oh, and “MAGAts” are perfectly happy with eligible voters voting. Unless you’re defining eligible voters as 3rd world foreign nationals yearning to vote freely. Vote by mail is convenient, but it’s nonsense and shouldn’t be part of a serious country.
Every time you dimwits bring something up like this, when I read into it there’s some catch. Last time it was some dumb shit about Australia, where of course voting is mandatory so completely different than the US, not to mention being smaller than a single US state in population. It’s not worth listening to you lying fucktards.
You’re eating everyone’s time just like you ruined America reputation on the world stage. You maga shitstains are a blight on America.
Phil, calm down…we disagree on this matter. But even the non-MAGA Jimmy Carters and others warned of the deep flaws in vote by mail. No name that you call me can make those flaws and corruption inherent in vote by mail to go away.
Damn liberals love everything about France. Maybe we should have French style universal healthcare, or open borders for muslims! Take your French vote counting to your safe space snowflake Dumocrat!
I’m far from a liberal, Jon…but the Libs in France manage to conduct votes quickly, out in public and with reasonable efficiency and competency. No vote by mail.
Adding to the American farmers Trump nightmare is his newest declaration regarding USMCA. Trump has declared that he has no interest in renewing it and that we need nothing from Canada or Mexico.
Nothing could be further from the truth. We need Canadian lumber, oil and aluminum and foodstuffs and oil from Mexico.
The problem is that trump believes his own lies at this point and does not care that without these two trading partners, our costs will be far higher. This goes hand in hand with his crushing Americans with inflation from his theocratic war on Israels behalf.
Who does Trump work for?
Regarding voting? Trump wants to control who gets to vote. The last thing he wants is fair voting access or a representative government.
All of this is enabled by Fox News propaganda given Fox and trumps history of being an election deniers and liars.
Screw Trump and his sycophants!
“Election Denier” is another one of those tropes like “hate speech”. Both essentially mean “I Disagree/Hate You Politically”.
What would happen if Trump privately directed the Postmaster General to shred all mail-in ballots that attempted to go through the US Mail before the election in November?
All kinds of mischief can be done by a President who has only toadies and stooges reporting to him.
elections in 1700 and 1800s and early 1900s were all sketchy as hell. as amerikan as apple pie.
Well, Florida would go Democrat. Most mail-ins are from old people and most of them are Republicans in Florida.
I suppose we can start lumping them up together. We got the War continuation issue, the BRC issue, and now we can add mail in voting to the mix…
Agreed that the EO’s will likely lose. However the goal of tightening up on the franchise is laudable. Oregon (where I live) is the typical blue state hive mind of sanctuary state, motor voter registration from the age of 16, 7 days after election to enable sketchy ballot stuffing when it’s really needed, (big statewide votes) and the general coddling of criminal behavior. Typical county has 5-6 percent more voters registered than physically exist in the population. We’ve erred on the side of incluuuuuusion, and demahhhhhhhhhcracy…as long as it benefits the controlling party which in this state, are Democrats.
Bill, I live in Oregon, too. I want VOTERS IDENTIFIED AS REALLY Americans. What about those Licenses that have the “Real-ID Compliance” marks on them?
The other big question is HOW do we confirm that a person is actually American? Congress needs to get off of their asses and make it LAW with TEETH.
If ONLY there was some kind of LAW that detailed how CITIZENSHIP worked! If only that existed!
If ONLY there was some kind of LAW that was actually enforced how CITIZENSHIP worked! If only that existed!
Fixed it for you…
Hi David, the challenge is Real ID in Oregon is issued to citizen and non-citizen alike. All it means is you met the Fed requirements for identification. There is no difference in the ID of a citizen and that of a foreign national. IIRC, not all states enacted Real ID like Oregon.
What if 51+ % don’t want that? Then what?
Trump votes by mail. It’s just more bomb throwing.
Last I heard “the evidence is everywhere” is not admissible in court.
I agree with Mish entirely on the odds of Trump’s EO standing. I can see how some national standards on voting procedures might be good, but given that the Constitution leaves it up to the states – barring a constitutional amendment – that could probably only be done the way Congress has strong-armed states in the past – by, for example, denying highway funds to states that don’t implement Congress’ favored voting procedures. It’s a crappy way to circumvent the Constitution, but some states’ loosey-goosey mail-in rules seem designed to allow mischief in close elections.
“but some states’ loosey-goosey mail-in rules seem designed to allow mischief in close elections.”
“seem designed to” and “actually allowing” mischief are two very different things. How can this topic even be worth discussing when no one has ever shown any wide-spread voter fraud from mail-in voting? Not once in all of American history. Is it possible that there is a behind the scenes issue here that Fox isn’t reporting?
These Executive Orders are dead on arrival at the courts and I’m certain Trump knows it. He gains by highlighting the issues and forcing scarce resources to battle him in court, all the while abusing the resources of the taxpayer funded Justice Department which has to defend his actions,
1-Star Mishelin award granted for excellent post subject to 3-Star upgrade when proven calling it correct.
Do worry, Trump & Walrus will find a way to make things even worse.™
“Walrus”? I thought John Bolton was in jail. Is he still out free?
How long are we going to continue to live with this nightmare of deranged tyrant and bootlicker minions? Is there any hope at all that the dc miscreants will grow a spine or is it impossible since they are stuffing their pockets as well?
The more misery the better, it needs to be ingrained in stupid people’s minds that republican scumbags are bad for business, bad for the people and bad for America.
And I’m 100% confident Trump will deliver on more misery, especially on those stupid boomers.
https://www.salon.com/2026/06/13/gop-has-a-new-plan-to-kill-off-medicare-and-social-security/
Personally, I can’t wait to see these cuts and watch boomers reap what they sowed and I won’t be shedding a single tear for these leeches.
Pretty nasty label for an entire generation of Americans. Just as bad as tarring the youth population as incel morons. We’re all products of the times in which we were raised. I’m sure there are plenty of powers that would love to have the generations fighting each other rather than fighting the tyrants moving them around like chess pieces.
Bill,
Just ask yourself two questions:
If you think about the question carefully, the question answers itself because people born 24 years ago would be 24 today and hardly deserve any blame no? Even those born 28, 32 years ago barely should shoulder any blame.
Bonus questions: So who made this mess? Who continues to make it worse? Who is making is worse now? When might it get better? (i.e. who needs to die off)?
Yes, I am better off!
– are you better off than you were 4,8,12,16,20,24 years ago? > 100% in every case you listed.
– if the answer to #1 is no then who is to primarily blame? > The answer is Yes.
– If you think about the question carefully, the question answers itself because people born 24 years ago would be 24 today and hardly deserve any blame no? Even those born 28, 32 years ago barely should shoulder any blame. > I don’t care how old, or young, or which generation you were from or your parents were from. ALL of that is totally irrelevant.
>> If YOU are not pitching in, and being a contributing member of society, in a positiv manner, then YOU are the problem.
– Bonus questions: So who made this mess? Who continues to make it worse? Who is making is worse now? When might it get better? (i.e. who needs to die off)? > Those not accountable, held accountable, and never will be accountable. Those with no skin in the game, those that win, no matter what happens!!! THOSE PEOPLE!
This is correct, everyone else in these comments should be ashamed. Why are we stealing from each other when one man alone is supposedly “worth” a trillion dollars? One who isn’t a boomer.
Nicely stated!
“Pretty nasty label for an entire generation of Americans. Just as bad as tarring the youth population as incel morons.”
I dunno, both can be true at the same time. However, I think we can all agree that there are some bright folks in all generations and not so bright.
We just have to wait for the Democrats to come to power and make these plans a reality…
Remember that most of “St. Ronnie”‘s wet dreams were made real, not by GHW Bush or GW Bush, but by BJ Clinton.
Trump promised to give every adult citizen $2000 if he was reelected in 2022. But Biden actually did it.
It seems that the “Boomers” you hate so much are continuing to work well beyond their official retirement ages. Many of them because there are so few qualified or willing to work people in younger generations.
Most of the tradespersons I employ are between 50 and 75 years old and while they often have “apprentices” those apprentices rarely last longer than three months and the time they invest in training them is wasted.
Huge numbers of skilled labor and tradespersons are needed to keep this nation maintained and construction moving forward. Younger people are being brainwashed to become debt slaves through dead end college paths.
I like hiring the older generation as they are far more reliable than many of my peers. Younger than 30 and they have no physical skills and can only do computer related things. Plus most of them are obese.
Just wait until you move to your fantasy “Exit strategy” country. Then you can find out what outsiders with no long term connections get to deal with. My guess is that you will be treated as the entitled American, alienated and come running home with your tail behind your legs. This mostly because you have so little respect for others and a massive perspective gap.
Good luck to you regardless
Lol. You’re projecting Frosty. I assume that’s an apt description of you and your behavior and attitude. You’re, “I’m a nice guy and you’re bad” routine exemplifies the boomer mindset and that’s why everyone not a boomer hates you guys. That’s why I need to leave the US until most of you die then things might start to get better and maybe I’ll head back.
Don’t worry, many investment will remain here where the kings of graft can get rich on the backs of the comically stupid.
I don’t know how many times I need to say this but I already have friends and family living in countries overseas from Europe to Asia to Latin America. Get that through your thick boomer skull, I not only already know what’s waiting for me, I have friends and family there. Let me say that again, I already have friends and family there. They call me regularly asking when I’m coming and I’m almost done with all the crap that needs to be done for a permanent move like this.
Have fun running the family farm until Trump tariffs, gestapo, election blocking/rigging or whatever other stupidity comes your way and bankrupts you and the family. But for the sake of God, don’t say nobody warned you about what was coming. Just take it.
And good luck to you regardless…
You can run, but you can’t hide…
And being long oil was not so smart the last couple of trades you boasted about. Methinks you are a blowhard.
Oil is a long game but farm boys don’t have the intellect to understand that which is why you are farm boys.
but but with the seniors sneakers plan I get s free gym membership and the pool is oh so nice! lol
I’m just behind the Boomers. What about me? I’ll be eligible just as the fund will take a haircut if nothing is done.
Right there with you, I’ll be 65 later this year one of the younger Booms just before GenX – full SS “retire” age is what, 67 1/2, but will be working as long as I can…it’s just reality.
How exactly are “boomers” leeches? They’ve been paying into Social Security for 50+ years. Saying SS is an “entitlement” is like saying you don’t have a right to collect on an annuity you’ve been paying into for 50 years.
That is exactly right. SS is a forced annuity. People can complain that maybe you receive more than the annuity earned, but those same people never, ever seem to want to force a vote on ensuring the revenues and investment returns are adequate to meet obligations.
Unfortunately, it’s only a government benefit program. The supreme court case of Fleming v. Nestor ruled there’s no contractual obligation with SS, there’s no required benefit amount based on your contributions, and it’s just a government program subject to change. Congress could end it tomorrow and that’s all there is to it. Yep, we were forced to pay in, and for those who clamor to GET MY MONEY BACK, hey, I’m with you, but the moment you forcibly gave money to Caesar, it became Caesar’s money. Another case, IIRC, ruled that Social Security “contributions” were merely an additional income tax.
The Baby Boomer generation, born between 1946 and 1964, significantly contributed to technological advancements, including the development of personal computers and the internet, as well as social movements that promoted civil rights, gender equality, and environmental activism. Their impact on culture, economy, and innovation has left a lasting legacy on society.
Those Boomers?
You should watch “Monty Python – what have the Romans ever done for us?” on YouTube and substitute Boomers for Romans.
Why the British don’t like Trump
https://x.com/Gianl1974/status/2062036970679718284
Suggested reading:
I thought it was because he is right about their country falling apart, due to incompetent leadership. He is correct that they are allowing their Country to be stolen, and working really hard to assure it happens. Soon enough they will be begging for help, but from whom? Not long after that they may have less of a country already. Then what?